Home | Community | Message Board
You are not signed in.
Sign In New Account
Forum Index Search Posts Trusted Vendors Highlights Galleries FAQ User List Chat Store Random Growery


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
Threaded Mode Threaded  Previous topic Previous  View all topics Index  Next topic Next 

Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck, Certified Organic All-In-One Grow Bags by Magic Bag   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

Jump to first unread post Pages: | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 |  [ show all ]
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Silversoul]
    #5509843 -

There's no way Temptress is Swami. Swami was far more insightful and engaging.

And I doubt Swami's crotch looks like that.  :laugh:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5509897 -

From dictionary.com, there are two common, varying definitions of "Faith". There seems to be a clear semantic confusion between Wilshire and yourself, ergo, I will clean up this mess to my best ability.

1.)Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.

2.)Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence.

So if we are to assign different meanings to the word "faith", then obviously it pays to be clear and direct about how we are using the word. Following along, it is perfectly fine to state that we are "faithful" about many things - in certain contexts. However, what must be distinguished, as outlined in the two definitions about, is the difference between faith and blind faith.

For instance, I may go to a dentist soon and will have faith that he knows what he's doing. I have faith that the sun will rise tomorrow. I have faith that the metaphysically-given facts of reality remain absolute, and so forth. In all of these contentions, I need not wander around in my imagination, groping around in the dark and picking out subjective answers - no, all I need to do review the objective data derived from observations of these occurences -all of which have been quite certainly consistent- and articulate the relationship between these objective, consistent occurences and the faith for their continued occurence.

Now, if I had blind faith that I can summon the powers of some cosmic energy and intervene in the natural processes of a cancerous malignancy, then that is different for there is no supporting context. Or to take another example, if a Christian has faith that the "rapture" will come as they've described it, then that is blind faith, as it has zero contextual support in actuality.


In conclusion, it is all about context. Definition & clarity is crucial.




--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: RedNucleus]
    #5509913 -

We are talking about the difference between posting-

"This research report turned up no evidence of paranormal activity at this address so , paranormal activity does not exist.

and

This research report turned up no evidence of paranormal activity at this address so paranormal activity at this address does not exist.

Do you understand the difference?

I personally do not have issue with the later being posted in there. It's ignorant illogical stances like the first that people are looking to catch some fresh air from.

Why is it some of you are so quick to point out the "imaginations" "ignorance" and "illogic" of a believer in something not well understood, yet are totally blinded by the fabrication, ignorance, illogic of some critics of said beliefs?

:lol: I must have something more productive to be doing then posting in this thread. For anyone who took the time to understand another perspective, I thank you. :smile:

:peace: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5510064 -

Wilshire wrote:
the thing that makes MRP special is faith. applying reason is not permitted in that forum because the whole point of the forum is to provide an environment where the faithful may be uninterrupted by their own faculties of reason or anyone else's (it's the only forum where reasoning is prohibited). i do not understand how denying and prohibiting the use of reason can ever be constructive.


In rebuttal, Jiggy wrote:
That was completely ignorant wilshire.

Posters have valid reasons for what they are interested in and are constructing paradigms of understanding and reason that serve them in their personal goals.


Jiggy, the MRP-posters having a whyfor behind their beliefs and espousements, does not ever necessarily subsume the proper, objective and fair use of one's faculty of reason. When one arrives at conclusions, premises and beliefs on the grounds of selectively chosen bits of data in accordance with their own bias, they are not using faculty of reason - rather, they are misusing it.

When one blocks out objective evidence that conflicts heavily with their philosophical espousements, when one refuses to consider any number of alternatives of answers to questions they seek answers to - out of evasions of reality, they are not reasonable - they are unreasonable.


While on the other hand, it is indeed often the case that out of simple nescience in the matter at hand, one may inadvertly miss important detail[s] of the situation and thus, arrive at contradictory premises [as demonstrated by savages]. Such innocent errors of knowledge are acceptable, providing that one is willing to correct one's errors in light of such. However, it is important to recognize that this is vastly different from one who knowingly evades reality, facts and knowledge. This volitional escapism is a hallmark of mysticism [pertinently defined in dictionary.com or merriam-webster] - and the MRP forum.

The point, once more, is that the full use of reason, is the only applicable use of reason - however limited by one's natural boundaries, i.e., knowledge, temperament, age, memory-capacity, etc.
To half-use reason, is seriously as dangerous and irresponsible as it is to half-drive a car. Ultimately, lives are in danger by both.




--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5510095 -

This research report turned up no evidence of paranormal activity at this address so paranormal activity at this address does not exist.

My closet is empty, I just looked. So, the Flying Spaghetti Monster only does not exist in my closet (necessarily granting that He MAY be living in a nice condo on Neptune, but we're not addressing that now and everyone should assume he does live on Neptune, just in case).

Alright. I love the way you think! :crazy2:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Diploid]
    #5510115 -

Quote:
My closet is empty, I just looked.


lets take up a clothes drive for poor diploid...  :frown:


--------------------
i have less ego than you do!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Diploid]
    #5510130 -

Diploid said:
This research report turned up no evidence of paranormal activity at this address so paranormal activity at this address does not exist.

My closet is empty, I just looked. So, the Flying Spaghetti Monster only does not exist in my closet (necessarily granting that He MAY be living in a nice condo on Neptune, but we're not addressing that now and everyone should assume he does live on Neptune, just in case).

Alright. I love the way you think! :crazy2:


come on diploid, jiggy never said everyone should assume prayer works. she gave a scientific assesment of the results, i thought thats what you were in favor of.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Deviate]
    #5510164 -

She's saying that you should believe something until it's disproved. That is faulty thinking of the highest order because even if a trillion studies show prayer is useless, she will always come back and claim that maybe study one-trillion-and-one will show it works.

That's not a search for Truth. Rather it's a search for validation of your beliefs while selectively excluding anything that contradicts your beliefs.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Deviate]
    #5510174 -

smearing spaghetti sauce on your walls will no more make a wish come true than getting on your knees, lighting a candle and mumbling words to yourself (or an imaginary friend). should would do endless testing of every possible nonsensical ritual based on nothing at all?


--------------------
i have less ego than you do!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Diploid]
    #5510190 -

a more valid test would be to mail me a check for $100 while making a wish...

oh wait! that has already been done to death by many televangelistas.... never mind.


--------------------
i have less ego than you do!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Temptress]
    #5510197 -

Wiccan_Seeker: I take it back. Temptress is Swami. I guess I just never noticed how annoying he was before.


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Silversoul]
    #5510209 -

Temptress is Swami

OMG! You mean that IS Swami's crotch? :whoa:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Silversoul]
    #5510218 -

annoyance is a quality of the observer; not the observed.


--------------------
i have less ego than you do!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Diploid]
    #5510251 -

Diploid said:
She's saying that you should believe something until it's disproved. That is faulty thinking of the highest order because even if a trillion studies show prayer is useless, she will always come back and claim that maybe study one-trillion-and-one will show it works.

That's not a search for Truth. Rather it's a search for validation of your beliefs while selectively excluding anything that contradicts your beliefs.



she did not say you should believe something until its disproved. from now on please provide a direct quote to back up all your paraphrasing because its obvious your statements dont accurately reflect her position.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Temptress]
    #5510267 -

Temptress said:
smearing spaghetti sauce on your walls will no more make a wish come true than getting on your knees, lighting a candle and mumbling words to yourself (or an imaginary friend). should would do endless testing of every possible nonsensical ritual based on nothing at all?



you never answered my question, if this study had found an affect from prayer, would you be here touting its benefits?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Silversoul]
    #5510281 -

Paradigm said:
Wiccan_Seeker: I take it back. Temptress is Swami. I guess I just never noticed how annoying he was before.


so the mods here don't mind people evading bans? on other boards ive been to such behavior is worthy of an ip ban.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Deviate]
    #5510339 -

she did not say you should believe something until its disproved

She says it all the time, Deviate.

from now on please provide a direct quote

OK.

Here's one recent apropos example of many:

I pointed out that reverend Peter Popoff (who claims to read the mind of audience members by communicating directly with God) was exposed as a bold-faced liar by James Randi.

Randi caught Popoff using an accomplice with a radio transmitter and a tiny receiver in his ear to 'read minds'. Despite this, people have continued to pay the admission fee and stream into his prayer meetings by the millions every year.

jiggy's reply: Prove they were there because they believed he could read minds in the first place.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5493666#Post5493666

In other words, Popoff was exposed as a lying sack of shit about his ability to read minds, but maybe his OTHER powers are real because they haven't been disproved yet (he can cure everything from constipation to cancer with a smack to the head).


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Edited by Diploid (04/13/06 12:50 AM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Deviate]
    #5510363 -

so the mods here don't mind people evading bans? on other boards ive been to such behavior is worthy of an ip ban.

Encouraging enforcement against another who's not harming you (or anyone else) and is currently under the radar is about as spiritual as calling the cops on your neighbor for growing pot.

There's a more spiritual alternative. It's called the Ignore Button. But what do I know about spirituality.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Deviate]
    #5510372 -

who here believes in reincarnation?

Tiruchi Swami dead

By Our Special Correspondent

BANGALORE, JAN. 15. Sri Sivarathnapuri Mahaswami died at Kailash Ashram established by him at Rajarajeshwarinagar here, on Friday. The last rites were performed later in the day.

He was 74. He was popular as Tiruchi Swamiji.

Hailing from Tirunelveli in Tamil Nadu, Sri Tiruchi Swamiji settled in Bangalore many years ago.

He had constructed Sri Rajarajeshwari Temple adjacent to the ashram off the Mysore road.

The Chief Minister, N. Dharam Singh; the former Prime Minister, H.D. Deve Gowda; and the Minister for Law and Parliamentary Affairs, H.K. Patil; have mourned his death.

The Governor of Maharashtra, S.M. Krishna, said with the demise of Jagadguru Tiruchi Swamiji, the people of the State have lost a great spiritual leader.


--------------------
i have less ego than you do!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: questioning anothers beliefs is wrong in MRP [Re: Diploid]
    #5510399 -

Diploid said:
so the mods here don't mind people evading bans? on other boards ive been to such behavior is worthy of an ip ban.

Encouraging enforcement against another who's not harming you (or anyone else) and is currently under the radar is about as spiritual as calling the cops on your neighbor for growing pot.

There's a more spiritual alternative. It's called the Ignore Button. But what do I know about spirituality.


obviously the mods are aware of the situation and it is under their discretion (totally unlike your example) i simply asked a question because i am GENUIENLY CURIOUS about the way things operate on these boards.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 |  [ show all ]

Shop: MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck, Certified Organic All-In-One Grow Bags by Magic Bag   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
Threaded Mode Threaded  Previous topic Previous  View all topics Index  Next topic Next 

Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Believing in nothing becomes a belief.
( 1 2 all )		 chemkid 2,812 31 10/14/02 08:20 PM
by xganon
* Shroomism i need a question answered
( 1 2 3 all )		 johnnyfive 5,690 47 10/06/02 11:07 PM
by johnnyfive
* Belief revisited...
( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 all )		 Swami 10,344 126 11/13/02 12:26 PM
by FreakQlibrium
* Right and Wrong
( 1 2 all )		 CherryBomM 4,695 31 10/02/01 11:18 AM
by oneoverzero
* The nature of self-serving beliefs
( 1 2 all )		 Anonymous 7,787 28 10/13/02 02:12 AM
by johnnyfive
* Testing your Paranormal Hypothesis
( 1 2 3 4 5 all )		 Swami 8,706 91 06/05/03 12:43 AM
by spiritshaper
* Binary belief systems.
( 1 2 all )		 Xibalba 4,815 32 07/15/02 02:29 AM
by erectronik
* Whats wrong with being a skeptic
( 1 2 3 all )		 seeker 4,977 42 06/09/03 01:04 AM
by Sclorch

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, DividedQuantum
8,290 topic views. 1 members, 1 guests and 14 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2026 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.028 seconds spending 0.004 seconds on 16 queries.