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Offlineseeker
Curator ofBarbaricRefinery

Registered: 03/22/02
Posts: 128
Loc: between Here and There
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
Whats wrong with being a skeptic
    #623526 - 04/30/02 09:53 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I am not just talking to the "God shall smight thee doubter" type. I am asking the question of everyone who ever bitched because some one dared to ask questions. Straight answers only, please. None of this, "Because (add your teacher/mentor/prophet/diety's name here) said so."

Anyone?


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In a state of anarchy every individual is their own kingdom.

Thou art God (but so am i :wink:)


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OfflineTheShroomHermit
Divine Hermit of the Everything
 User Gallery

Registered: 02/19/02
Posts: 7,575
Loc: border of Canada and Mexi...
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: seeker]
    #623530 - 04/30/02 09:56 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

There is nothing wrong with being a realist.


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InvisibleRevelation

 User Gallery

Registered: 08/04/01
Posts: 6,134
Loc: heart cave
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: seeker]
    #623533 - 04/30/02 10:00 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Nothing wrong with being anything. It is of no consequence. What will be will be.


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Anonymous

Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: seeker]
    #623538 - 04/30/02 10:05 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I don't think that there is anything wrong with being a skeptic...

Everyone learns in their own way and in the end we all share the same fate, so to each his own.


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: seeker]
    #623572 - 04/30/02 10:49 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Skeptics want to take all the fun and mystery out of life. They want to pull back the curtain and expose the mighty Wizard of Oz for the frightened fake that he is. They want to tell you that love is merely a collection of primal, biological urges, that Santa Claus does not exist; that a balloon crashed at Roswell and that mushrooms do not put you in touch with another realm, but merely disrupt your delicate neuronal chemistry.

Those bastards! Someone get a rope!




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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineJPAtanat
member
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 101
Last seen: 14 years, 9 months
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: Revelation]
    #623576 - 04/30/02 10:55 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I think there is absolutely nothing wrong with being a skeptic.
However much I wish I could say "nothing wrong with being anything," I just don't believe it.
I do not think it is ok to be a racist or a violent homophobe, a murderer a rapist, etc. These things are of great consequence. And what will be of course WILL be, but we do have influence in what will be, so we should not take this determninistic attitude that promotes apathy, and fight for what we think is right.

I apologize for being an ass, revelation, just felt like i needed to say something there.


Peace.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: Anonymous]
    #623585 - 04/30/02 11:15 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Well, for starters, it's pretty obvious that any skeptic (or sceptic if you're British) is just some asshole with a quick tongue (usually forked- check if you don't believe me). All a skeptic does is take well-established belief systems (that have worked just fine for centuries mind you) and trash them. Fuckin' naysayers. All they do is challenge people, even if they agree with them, those skeptic jerks will start an argument just to hear themselves talk. Skeptics also use poor logic and demand ?proof? for everything.

Like this one time, I saw a flying saucer land. I posted a thread a while back explaining how cool the aliens were and how they didn?t want to conquer Earth- they just wanted to smoke out and stuff, because Earth has the best ganja- and some jerk off skeptic came along and was all like ?Where?s the evidence?? when I told him that I witnessed it personally, he was like ?That?s not good enough, we need REAL evidence.? That?s when I formed the SSH (the Society for Skeptic Haters). Now when I post stuff about my telepathy powers and the skeptics shoot it down with their twisted logic and fuzzy math, I?ll just send a couple of SSH thugs to their house and they?ll kick the shit out of them. Take that you naysayers! Well, I haven?t actually done it yet; thugs are hard to find.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: JPAtanat]
    #623587 - 04/30/02 11:18 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Is it OK to hate racists and homophobes?


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
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Registered: 11/24/01
Posts: 10,211
Loc: Bloomington, IN
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Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: Swami]
    #623591 - 04/30/02 11:26 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

As much as Jimmy Skeptic's attacks on faith annoy me, I have to admit that skepticism is necessary...
I think my skepticism saved my soul from being completely devoured when I met Satan. It went sorta like this:

Satan: "You will obey me for I am your Lord."
Me: "I don't know... you feel powerful, but you also seem tainted with darkness and evil."
Satan: *slightly amused* "Evil??"
(Satan then proceeded to show me that good and evil were just perceptions, and that we exist here in both Dark and Light.)
Satan: "So you see, everyone here has both dark and light inside."
Me:"I still don't know... I'm afraid... Doesn't feel right... "
(things get hazy around here... all I remember is that he overtook and entered into my body but all fear eventually vanished and I was left on the fringes of reality, my sanity in critical condition. Also, I was left with the thought "DEVOUR! IT IS THE WAY OF THIS WORLD" over and over in my head.)
All of this came after calls for "The One Who Brought Me Here". I was expecting God or something so it truly surprised me.  :smile:


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: Sclorch]
    #623593 - 04/30/02 11:27 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I personally want to join Believers Against Rationality and Facts (B.A.R.F.).


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineJPAtanat
member
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 101
Last seen: 14 years, 9 months
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: Swami]
    #623594 - 04/30/02 11:35 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Thats a good question.
I am not sure I can answer it satisfactorily.

I do not approve of hate in any form, of course that is an ideal. When I see it manifested in violence or any sort of aggression I become angry and then I am the hater. So I recogize hate within myself. I do not want to hate myself or others, including other "haters."
The theoretical solution would be to hate racism, but not a racist, and to hate murder, but not the murderer. Of course you can say that they are inseparable, but I am just talking about being able to see through someone's faults no matter how overwhelming they may be. In reality this is pretty difficult to achieve, but it is an ideal to work towards. Also I don't mean it to sound like we should condone murder or rape, but to be able to see past the action to the person within would lead to a more compassionate state that would be better able to address the situation (as oppossed to someone who simply reciprocates the hate).
I think a discussion of this deserves a whole thread.

By the way, what do you think Swami?


Peace.


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Anonymous

Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: Swami]
    #623607 - 04/30/02 11:48 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

My dad use to use a skeptic stick after he shaved. I never liked 'em though.

Then there's my brother who lives up in the mountains and has a bunch of guns and a few acres of land. He claims he has a skeptic tank but said he couldn't show it to me. I told him to be careful because I don't think they are legal. Anyways, Sclorch you might be able to borrow that instead of hiring some thugs.

Just some thoughts...


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: JPAtanat]
    #623614 - 05/01/02 12:00 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

It was strange, when I was robbed at gunpoint last year with my Mom by a black gang-banger, I was not particulary afraid nor even upset. Not even when he threatened to kill us. But when I looked over and saw my mom crying because she thought he really would, I was ready to shred the fucker. The guy was 20 years younger and much larger, but I felt like saying "Why you don't put that gun down you pussy and take me on man-to-man." I am not violent nor a fighter, nor very adept at martial arts, but it struck a primal chord in me to threaten my family. I might have gone all the way given the chance.

Yet I got out of the service on a Conscientious Discharge due to Bhuddist-like morals (and meant it!) which was nearly impossible post VietNam.

In another incident 2 years ago, an aerobics instructor (gay male) grabbed my cock in the sauna. If he had not fled after seeing my shocked expression, I might have pulverized the rude fag.

Am I racist or homophobic? No, but I am certainly affected by these and other incidents.

My point is a moral stance in a quiet discussion is quite different than a real-world (not a lab - LOL!) situation. These sorts of things really test where you are at.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineJPAtanat
member
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 101
Last seen: 14 years, 9 months
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: Swami]
    #623639 - 05/01/02 12:41 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

"Am I racist or homophobic? No, but I am certainly affected by these and other incidents."

Was wondering how specifically you were affected (after the actual event).

"My point is a moral stance in a quiet discussion is quite different than a real-world (not a lab - LOL!) situation. These sorts of things really test where you are at."

I totally agree. The question is what do you do with the experience (hence the above question). Upon reflection from a calmer state, what were your feelings on the perpetrators? More compassion? Hatred? If hatred, do you think it is justified? Did your view point change due to the incident? Would you react the same way if it happened again? Is it possible to transcend the primal instict we feel in these situations - ie is it possible to embody our moral stance? If so, how?
Just some questions that ran through my head when I read your post.


Peace.


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InvisibleFloydian
veteran
Registered: 05/14/00
Posts: 1,022
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: seeker]
    #623689 - 05/01/02 01:47 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

only reason skeptics don't go over well here is because sketicism isn't condusive with a mind that is on psychedelics.

and all these emotionally driven seekers are too busy hoping to see the foolishness of their ways

LOL


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Don't squeeze the pancake batter


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OfflineJustFootsteps
newbie
Registered: 02/11/01
Posts: 31
Loc: a hill
Last seen: 15 years, 7 days
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: seeker]
    #623794 - 05/01/02 06:11 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

being cautious about what you will and won't accept as valid is just common sense.  this attitude should be applied to all -isms, including skeptic-ism.

skeptics make their own worlds drab, mechanical, predictable and violent.  skeptical argument is a form of violence.  conveying something of one's inner state using dead, dead, dead words (killed imo by advertising jingles) is a very tricky and personal business; it takes courage and practice to get better at it.  a well-crafted heartsong is a beautiful and intricate web of metaphor that usually only emerges after years of public practice.  skeptics make this difficult by quibbling.  they usually miss the forest for the trees.  they respond to a sentence instead of a paragraph, a paragraph instead of a book-long idea.  they wait for any mistake and ignore material they can't eat.  they are piranhas.  they don't create anything; they feed off the hard and personal work of others, and they do it in an intimidating and insulting fashion because they think they're doing something novel or necessary.  but they're not, they're quibbling.

crafting a thoughtful and challenging response to what someone else has said is a lot of fun, and plinks another note out in the tune of the great Schizoconversation of the collective subconscious.  gently guiding someone away from an errant position (there is no right answer, but there are plenty of stupid ones, as a teacher once said), using logic and rhetoric and eye contact, is a kindness to them and to the world.  but skeptics, while they perceive themselves in this role, only rob people of their vocal cords.  by pretending there is such a thing as non-poetic speech, they place barriers on communicative effort that can be bridged only perilously and with great effort, and that's NO FUCKING FUN. :smile:

former dogmatic skeptic logical bulldog,


--------------------
in peace,
just footsteps
http://www.whyvegan.org


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: JustFootsteps]
    #623868 - 05/01/02 09:49 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

skeptical argument is a form of violence.
Unlike the loving tone of this extremely harsh generalization.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinefrogsheath
Stranger
Registered: 02/18/02
Posts: 915
Loc: Chicago, Illinois U.S.A.
Last seen: 2 years, 1 month
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: Swami]
    #623914 - 05/01/02 11:41 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Hey skeptics! You all should try shutting up for one week just to see what happens to this forum. It might be funny.


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OfflineJPAtanat
member
Registered: 04/17/02
Posts: 101
Last seen: 14 years, 9 months
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: JustFootsteps]
    #624019 - 05/01/02 02:06 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Nice post, JF.


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OfflineTannis
ZoneTrooper
Registered: 12/13/01
Posts: 508
Loc: MD.USA
Last seen: 14 years, 4 months
Re: Whats wrong with being a skeptic [Re: seeker]
    #624027 - 05/01/02 02:16 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I went through a period in my life where I doubted my faith and abilities. It was the darkest time I have ever known. I was suicidal, and began to carry a weapon because I started to distrust everyone. I was out of control with drugs and alcohol and was headed for a criminal life style.

When I rediscovered myself and my faith and accepted my abilities.......I became a person who helps others........
I still don't just "buy" anything that comes along......but for me being a skeptic made me dangerous to myself and to others.


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