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Extremism...
    #5152244 -

...is the way of death. When one embraces extremism in a religious sense they turn their back on life. Lately many Americans have come to equate this term with fundamentalist Muslims, but Christians and Jews are every bit as guilty. When a fundamentalist tells me that their religion is the one true way and that all others are abandoned to Hell I am convinced that I am dealing with a person who is functionally insane. I say this because when a person has the ability to view another person as a lesser being then persecution, war, and murder, become justified. Religious extremists are encouraged by the very nature of their faith to depersonalize others who follow a different path. Organized religion engenders hatreds that last thousands of years, and recently I feel that all organized religion ultimately ends in extremism.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5152277 -

does not every way lead to death?

maybe thinking of anything leading to death is the only death.

saying extremism leads to death is a pretty extreme statement in my eyes.

edit:

or maybe there is only one way. your way. your way is the only way...and is never the same as any other way (even if you think it is). so who cares if they say there is only one way?

maybe you classifying them as insane and thinking of them in that way is the real root of whatever perceived problem you think there is.


Edited by TameMe (01/07/06 09:55 PM)

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Re: Extremism... [Re: TameMe]
    #5152287 -

Avoid contact with eyes.

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Re: Extremism... [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5152303 -

yeah.

and why do i do that?

edit:

because of my father. well...because of our interaction dating back to when i was younger. i think that may have something to do with it.

Edited by TameMe (01/07/06 09:52 PM)

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Re: Extremism... [Re: TameMe]
    #5152445 -

Extremism in any sense, not just religious, messes things up. The only thing it does is create the opposing side and extremists ON THAT side. Maintaining a fairly level head about things and leaving your ideas open is healthy and only creates more like minded individuals.

Take, for instance, an abused child. The parent abuses the child for making small mistakes that are viewed by the parent as wrong. This teaches nothing to the child, and only creates problems. More than likely, this child will grow up to be full of irrationality and potentially a much worse adult than had he been reasoned with.
Dissociative identity disorder's number one cause is early childhood abuse.

You can also look at the original poster for a good look at what extremism has caused. Nothing against you, by the way, Huehuecoyotl, but you now believe that fundamentalists are insane and probably are more skeptical of all religious people in general. Had all religious people been reasonable and not extreme about their views, you would have no reason to believe they were insane...


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Let the Demons have their place, if so, it's angels you'll create.

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Re: Extremism... [Re: TameMe]
    #5152820 -

I was thinking in terms of Taoism. Some ideas promote life, others promote death. Extremism of any sort is full of restrictions and inflexible, and so does not encourage growth...therefore it does not promote life...so it promotes death. Do not take me quite so literally.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

Edited by Huehuecoyotl (01/08/06 12:05 AM)

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Re: Extremism... [Re: TameMe]
    #5152827 -

"maybe you classifying them as insane and thinking of them in that way is the real root of whatever perceived problem you think there is."

When people fly airplanes into skyscrapers, or try to wipe out other religious groups using ethnic cleansing, or when two types of christians wage war over religion (Northern Ireland for many years) there is a problem...this is not merely "perceived" by me. It is all around you in the world today.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5152830 -

"Nothing against you, by the way, Huehuecoyotl, but you now believe that fundamentalists are insane and probably are more skeptical of all religious people in general. Had all religious people been reasonable and not extreme about their views, you would have no reason to believe they were insane..."

You are correct.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5152852 -

what i find most surprising about religious extremists is how they can believe that God would set things up so only the followers of one specific demonination of one religion could be saved. how could God ever expect people to choose correctly? i've actually met someone who believed that only members of a special partition of the chruch of latter day saints received the highest place in heaven. such ideas simply don't make sense to me.

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Deviate]
    #5152859 -

I have met people (most Christians) that claim all non-Christians are damned to hell...


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5152955 -

Huehuecoyotl said:
I have met people (most Christians) that claim all non-Christians are damned to hell...


You have just met another one. Unless you accept Christ as your Lord and saviour, you'll be condemned.

/awaits  :shitstorm:


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010001100100001001000101!

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Fospher]
    #5152970 -

This arrogant assumption that only one religion is the correct one is also extremism in my view. Since this is the basis of Christianity I consider all of it extreme to one degree or another. What religious bigotry.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5152996 -

Heaven/Hell is a Jewish/Christian concept, so wouldnt it only make sense that you will be accepted into these places upon acception of the religion?

Although I tend to side more with Mohammed in a sense of him saying that whatever religion you are is where you'll go in your after life.


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010001100100001001000101!

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5153012 -

"Whoever we are, wherever we?re from
We shoulda noticed by now, our behavior is dumb
And if our chances expect to improve
It?s gonna take a lot more, than trying to remove the other race
Or the other whatever, from the face
Of the planet altogether

They call it THE EARTH, which is a dumb kinda name
But they named it right, ?cause we behave the same...
We are dumb all over
Dumb all over, yes we are
Dumb all over, near an? far
Dumb all over, black an? white
People, we is not wrapped tight

Nerds on the left, nerds on the right
Religious fanatics on the air every night
Saying the Bible tells the story
Makes the details sound real gory
About what to do if the geeks over there
Don?t believe in the book we got over here

You can?t run a race without no feet
An? pretty soon there won?t be no street
For dummies to jog on or doggies to dog on
Religious fanatics can make it be all gone
It won?t blow up An? disappear
It?ll just look ugly for a thousand years...

You can?t run a country by a book of religion
Not by a heap or a lump or a smidgen
Of foolish rules of ancient date
Designed to make you all feel great
While you fold, spindle and mutilate
Those unbelievers from a neighboring state

TO ARMS! TO ARMS! Hooray! That?s great
Two legs ain?t bad unless there?s a crate
They ship the parts to mama in
For souvenirs: two ears - Get Down!
Not his, not hers, but what the hey?
The Good Book says: ?It?s gotta be that way!?
But their book says: ?REVENGE THE CRUSADES!!!!...?

With whips an? chains an? hand grenades...?
TWO ARMS? TWO ARMS? Have another and another
My God says: ?There ain?t no other!?
Our God says: ?It?s all okay!?
My God says: ?This is the way!?
It says in the book: ?Burn and destroy?..?
An? repent, an? redeem, an? revenge, an? deploy
An? rumble thee forth to the land of the unbelieving scum on the other side
Cause they don?t go for what?s in the Book
An? that makes ?em BAD
So All, verily we must choppeth them up
Or stompeth them down
Or rent a nice French bomb
to poof them out of existence
While leaving their real estate just where we need it
To use again for temples in which to praise OUR GOD
?Cause He can really take care of business!?

And when His humble TV servant
With white hair and a brown suit
And maybe a blond wife who takes phone calls
Tells us it?s okay to do this stuff, then we?re supposed do it
?Cause if we don?t do it, we ain?t gwine up to heaven!
(Depending on which book you?re using at the time...
Can?t use theirs... it?s all lies...... Gotta use mine... Ain?t that right?
That?s what they say -- Every night... Every day...
Listen, we can?t really be dumb, if we?re just following God?s Orders
After all, He wrote this book here an? in the Book He says:
?He made us all to be just like Him,?
So... If we?re dumb... Then God is dumb...
An? maybe even a little bit ugly on the side" --Frank Zappa


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5153327 -

I do agree that extremists are not based in the same reality as myself, but:

Quote:
Americans have come to equate this term with fundamentalist Muslims, but Christians and Jews are every bit as guilty.



while they all may be borderline insane, you can compare KKK maybe, and i guess they are in fact a terrorist group, but as much of an obersver i like to be on the issue, it seems that the muslim extremists are the most likely to kill many others with bombs and etc, at least during the past 30-40 years.

but really it seems like this has been going on since the crusades. it still hasnt ended.


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No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5153344 -

Huehuecoyotl said:
Organized religion engenders hatreds that last thousands of years, and recently I feel that all organized religion ultimately ends in extremism.


Buddhism, in some cases can be seen as an organised religion, yet I have never met a "Fundamentalist Buddhist" to this date. This is becuase  Buddhism teaches freedom from extreme views as the basis for correct practice.

To say that "all organized religion ultimately ends in extremism" is not only an incorrect statement, but an extreme view in itself.  :tongue:


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Edited by Sinbad (01/08/06 06:57 AM)

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Sinbad]
    #5153415 -

I don't really view Buddhism as an organised religion. It is in fact only loosly organised and decentralised. Buddhism of course teaches avoiding extremism and is a sensible religion in my view.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Extremism... [Re: kotik]
    #5153444 -

"it seems that the Muslim extremists are the most likely to kill many others with bombs and etc"

The U.S. government is now waging a war in Iraq. The president who started this war is a fundamentalist. He has been seen to make statements to the effect that the "liberation" of the middle east is a mission giving to him by God. He has been quoted as saying God tells him what to do. I think his aspirations are financial (oil), but there is an underlying insinuation here that it is about religion. There have been 100 times more Muslims killed by Christians and Jews than the reverse. U.S. fighters and bombers have dropped hundreds of thousands of "bombs" in the middle east recently. This is the same president that supports the teaching of intelligent design in schools as science. I think Christian and Jewish extremists have killed many thousands of Muslims in our world in the last 5 years. I have noticed that if Christians run low on Muslims to kill they will happily kill each other...they will kill each other over an imaginary man who lives in the sky...how crazy is that shit?
Note: I am not absolving Muslims of their responsibility just noting that this phenomenon takes many forms.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

Edited by Huehuecoyotl (01/08/06 08:55 AM)

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5153477 -

Hue, You don't know how many times I have thought of this Frank Zappa song when dealing with the amazing ignorance in the extreme positions (fear based IMO) that fundamentalist Christians take. It's my very favorite song of that genius musician, and very logical human. (so rare)

Any way you're my hero today for digging it up. Its an amazing song to listen to. ( Frank makes it funny and fun) :thumbup:


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Extremism... [Re: Icelander]
    #5153494 -

Yeah, that song is as relevant today as when it was written in '85(I think).


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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