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 Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Very mysterious!  You also seem to be unattached to any position. You are a facinating fellow. 
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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 OldWoodSpecter
waiting
Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 4,033
Loc: mountains and lakes
Last seen: 16 years, 11 months
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 Re: why christianity is bullshit  [Re: Icelander]
#4402529 - 07/14/05 05:56 AM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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I always try to take the oposite position of what was the first post in a thread about. If it is something about selfishness and violence, I'll defend peace and love. If it is something against greed and violence, then I'll try to defend greed and violence.
Of course, it is very hard not to include my own personal views in this, but I try
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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Very cool. I have noticed. Thats what I meant by not attached.
Now tell me. Why do you take this approch?
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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mikeytwice
Wanderer
Registered: 06/21/05
Posts: 195
Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: Icelander]
#4402687 - 07/14/05 08:08 AM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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The words "separation of church and state" appear nowhere in the Constitution or Declaration of Independence. The constitution says: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" - and you can interpret that how you will. But supposing there are no laws involved, any practice is outside the realm of government officials...
And to say America wasn't founded on a christian tradition ignores the fact that most founding fathers were christian and many early settlers came ot avoid religious persecution - and I don't think they were those damn Moslems or anything...
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\
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OldWoodSpecter
waiting
Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 4,033
Loc: mountains and lakes
Last seen: 16 years, 11 months
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: Icelander]
#4402911 - 07/14/05 09:36 AM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Very cool. I have noticed. Thats what I meant by not attached.
Now tell me. Why do you take this approch?
Simply because I feel obligated to help to return every discussion in the middle (uncertainty). It's a sceptic approach
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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine
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Veritas
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: mikeytwice]
#4402922 - 07/14/05 09:41 AM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wikipedia said:
In the United States, separation of church and state is governed by the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution and by legal precedents interpreting that clause.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Neat! I'll remember that. 
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida 
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: mikeytwice]
#4403613 - 07/14/05 12:55 PM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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Actually, geniuses like Jefferson and Franklin were 'Deists.' which was a popular theological position to take in the period of 'the Enlightenment.' Much of the universal truth was adopted from the Bible, but little to none Christian doctrine per se. The Deist position also underlies Freemasonry, to which George Washington belonged. Even though the Bible is considered in the West to be 'The Light of Freemasonry,' one need not be a Jew or a Christian, but one must acknowledge GOD in some way - T:.G:.G:.O:.T:.U:. - The Grand Geometer Of The Universe.
Franklin, on the other hand, belonged to a wild playboy-like group called 'The Hellfire Club' in which all manner of sexual debauchery was said to have gone on. Not Christian in its regard for sexuality at all.
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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gnrm23
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 08/29/99
Posts: 6,488
Loc: n. e. OH, USSA
Last seen: 11 days, 4 hours
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well, it was quite possible for some of them old "founding fathers" to hold more than one idea in their heads at a time... and for (some of) them to belong to more than one ummmm organization at a time...
as to "most" of them being "christian" - well, i dunno... and to be a "founding father (what about the founding mothers, eh?) --- did one merely have to affix one's signature to the document, or must one have been actively involved in its crafting? and which document: the decaration of independence, the articles of confedration, the constitution???
the framers of the constitution wrangled long and hard over the language, and the powers vested in the 3 banches of the government...
(and the powers vested in the people themselves, the citizens... and what "being a citizen" might mean in this era of new possibilities...)
the "bill of rights" (the first 10 amendments to the US constitiution) church/state seperation was put there to forbid "the state" from making one particular religion "official" (or even worse mandatory!), and to allow "the people" to worship any damned way they please, or even to (gasp!) not worship at all...
the USA has long been in a sort of "armed truce" between the various reigious groups vying for supremacy, but (allah be praised!) not has yet established a theocracy, mmmmkay?
(again to note: there used to be one of those "send in a buck for our info" ads in the back of maybe popular science, i dunno... like those crazy AMORC ads, heh... for a group called SEA (the society of evangelical agnostics)... & their literature & bibliography lists were great fun... & they had an excellent suggestion for those agnostics who find them selves in a situation where public prayer is practiced ---> OK, you don't wanna bow your head like all the sheeple around you, but ostentateously making some sort of a row is just bad form, innit? soooo: silently & respectfully, keep your head raised, your eyes open, maybe your armes crossed, or even better, one handed fisted under your chin... and perhaps allowinf a faintly puzzled look to settle on you visage (as if wondering to yourself: "gee whiz, what are all these folks doing with this hand-folding & bowed heads & some guest preacher droning on invoking something or other?")(
~
sound like a plan, stan?
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old enough to know better
not old enough to care
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Phluck
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 04/10/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 5 months, 24 days
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Give the Man some credit will ya?
C'mon, he gets lots of credit as it is. There are tons of churches around the world devoted to worshipping the guy.
Sure the way he's portrayed is as a loving, nice guy, but my point is we really don't know for sure who he was or what was going on in his mind.
There are a lot of con artist "holy men" out there who use painted on selflessness as a cover for their greed.
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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us
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OldWoodSpecter
waiting
Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 4,033
Loc: mountains and lakes
Last seen: 16 years, 11 months
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: Phluck]
#4407324 - 07/15/05 09:33 AM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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he is not worshiped as an actual person, his imprint into text is worshiped, his words, the image that is in the bible is what is worshiped. As long as that is so, it doesn't matter if he was just kidding about all that suff or being a liar.
If a fool says something wise out of ignorance, it is not less wise than the same word that came from some that ment it.
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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: Phluck]
#4407688 - 07/15/05 12:36 PM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well, when He acts in and through me, I 'Know' His mind intimately. Now, mind you when I say His mind, I mean the Logos, not something mundane>
Love can change the world
Love can change your life
Do what makes you happy
Do what you know is right
And love with all your might
Before it's too late.
Where did I find all these words?
Something inside of me is burning
There's life in other worlds
Maybe they'll come to earth
Helping man to find a way.
One day I hope we'll be in perfect harmony
A planet with one mind
Then I could tell you All the things inside my head.
- 'My Song' (Moody Blues, 'Every Good Boy Deserves Favour')
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
Edited by MarkostheGnostic (07/15/05 09:50 PM)
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Mark I this song. I'm a very long time Moody Blues fan. When I first started trippin in 70, they were my favorite band to trip to; along with pink floyd.  I still listen to both.
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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spud
I'm so fly.
Registered: 10/07/02
Posts: 44,410
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: Icelander]
#4409227 - 07/15/05 07:25 PM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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You guys should check out the book:
The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross: A Study of the Nature and Origins of Christianity within the Fertility Cults of the Ancient Near East
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Huehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: Icelander]
#4409385 - 07/15/05 08:21 PM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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"When I first started trippin in 70, they were my favorite band to trip to; along with pink floyd. I still listen to both."
Your experience mirrors mine...except in 81 instead.
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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#4409388 - 07/15/05 08:23 PM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Re: why christianity is bullshit [Re: Icelander]
#4410467 - 07/16/05 12:45 AM (18 years, 2 months ago) |
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Christianity is boring.
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Prosgeopax
Jaded, yethopeful?
Registered: 01/28/05
Posts: 1,258
Loc: Appearing at a mall near ...
Last seen: 17 years, 9 months
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Which version of Christianity are you referring to?
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Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.
You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite
Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Boredom is an emotional condition of YOUR mind, not a quality of a reality to which your singular life pales in comparison.
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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The veneration of Christ.
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