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InvisibleVeritas
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Registered: 04/15/05
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Deviate]
    #6198458 - 10/22/06 06:36 PM (15 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

Deviate said:
Quote:

Icelander said:
I When you truly understand your own mind you understand everything.




one of the wisest things you've ever said imo.




Yes, and this advice pre-dates Jesus by quite a few years.

"Know thyself," or "γνώθι σεαυτόν" was inscribed over the entrance to the Temple of Apollo in Ancient Greece.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Ravus]
    #6198514 - 10/22/06 06:57 PM (15 years, 8 days ago)

Did you make those Jesus-quotes up yourself? If not, there is no accuracy to most of them and you did not cite any references. Jesus never had a Trinity to deny, He emerged from monotheistic Judaism that had a number of Holy Names for deity. Tertullian coined the word Trinity based on NT verses that speak to 'the Father,' 'the Son' and 'the Holy Spirit,' and these were eventually turned into intellectual constructs about the Divine Economia - structure of the Godhead.

One of your quotes relates to Thomas and there is much scholarship on the theology of that early writing which suggests that it is genuine, pre-Mark, pre-Q, and derivative of an early oral tradition.

Matthew the 'Judaizer,' with his own agenda preferred to use the word 'heaven' instead of 'G-d' with regard to the kingdom because he was sensitive to writing the Names of deity because of magico-religious sentiments in Judaic tradition.

Increase scholarly documentation. Feel free to dismiss devotional fanaticism utterly - it is all pathological.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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OfflineTodcasil
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Veritas]
    #6198557 - 10/22/06 07:09 PM (15 years, 8 days ago)

If you are searching for the kingdom of Heaven, then you cannot find it. By searching for something that is already there inside you, you truly are seperating yourself from it.

To bring sin, condemnation and damage to your spirits, you must be mentally seperating yourself from the kingdom of heaven/god... The only true seperation from the kingdom of heaven/god is the idea that you are seperate... the idea you have to search.

Jesus said that the kindgdom of God is RIGHT THERE inside us all! Inside everywhere.

The greatest lie we have ever told ourselves is that we are seperate from God.


--------------------
Men look at themselves and they see flawed humans, we look at women and we see perfect
GODDESSES
Women look at themselves and they seem utterly human, when looking at men they see proud
GODS.


~Casil



:cactus:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Todcasil]
    #6198620 - 10/22/06 07:26 PM (15 years, 8 days ago)

The greatest lie we have ever told ourselves is that we are seperate from God

Well said. :mushroom2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Icelander]
    #6198783 - 10/22/06 08:17 PM (15 years, 8 days ago)

As far as science can tell everything is made from the same stuff. Looking at it that way we could say accurately that all is one. And that stuff that we and everything else is made of. Where does it come from? That's the million dollar question. :heart:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineTodcasil
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Icelander]
    #6198958 - 10/22/06 09:37 PM (15 years, 8 days ago)

:todcasil:

Its all different densities or vibrations of the same energy :heart:

All is one, because e=mc^2

heh.


--------------------
Men look at themselves and they see flawed humans, we look at women and we see perfect
GODDESSES
Women look at themselves and they seem utterly human, when looking at men they see proud
GODS.


~Casil



:cactus:


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OfflineFospher
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Ravus]
    #6200219 - 10/23/06 02:09 AM (15 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

Ravus said:
is an ancient enemy indeed.

"His disciples asked him: When will the dead rest? When will the new world arrive? He replied: That which you are waiting for has come, but you don't recognize it."

Obviously, the Second Coming is bullshit, an ancient misinterpretation that solidified into mythology even against numerous sayings of Jesus that deny it.





No. You are the Second Coming (And so am I)!


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #6200341 - 10/23/06 03:09 AM (15 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
Did you make those Jesus-quotes up yourself? If not, there is no accuracy to most of them and you did not cite any references. Jesus never had a Trinity to deny, He emerged from monotheistic Judaism that had a number of Holy Names for deity. Tertullian coined the word Trinity based on NT verses that speak to 'the Father,' 'the Son' and 'the Holy Spirit,' and these were eventually turned into intellectual constructs about the Divine Economia - structure of the Godhead.

One of your quotes relates to Thomas and there is much scholarship on the theology of that early writing which suggests that it is genuine, pre-Mark, pre-Q, and derivative of an early oral tradition.

Matthew the 'Judaizer,' with his own agenda preferred to use the word 'heaven' instead of 'G-d' with regard to the kingdom because he was sensitive to writing the Names of deity because of magico-religious sentiments in Judaic tradition.

Increase scholarly documentation. Feel free to dismiss devotional fanaticism utterly - it is all pathological.




Did you read through the thread? All of these quotes are from the Gospel of Thomas, which has been dated by scholars as being written anywhere from the 50s AD to the 100s AD, passed down from oral tradition. Seeing as the book is considered by some scholars to be strongly tied to early Gnosticism (though it does not include the traditionally Gnostic terminology, a fact which seems to support an earlier date of creation than a later one) I'm surprised you've never heard of the Gospel of Thomas or its recent discovery along with scores of other hidden books.

http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/nhl_thomas.htm
http://www.nag-hammadi.com/

And in case you want to check my quotes, here's a translation of the entire Gospel of Thomas:
http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/gthlamb.html


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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OfflineMaitereya
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Todcasil]
    #6200407 - 10/23/06 03:49 AM (15 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

Todcasil said:
If you are searching for the kingdom of Heaven, then you cannot find it. By searching for something that is already there inside you, you truly are seperating yourself from it.

To bring sin, condemnation and damage to your spirits, you must be mentally seperating yourself from the kingdom of heaven/god... The only true seperation from the kingdom of heaven/god is the idea that you are seperate... the idea you have to search.

Jesus said that the kindgdom of God is RIGHT THERE inside us all! Inside everywhere.

The greatest lie we have ever told ourselves is that we are seperate from God.




exactly!!!!

"ill fast maybe then ill find god, maybe ill give my money and god will come. if i pray god will be there. wait god was here all along, shit ive been wasting my time trying to find god."


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Maitereya]
    #6201922 - 10/23/06 03:46 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

Sounds more like Taoism than Christianity.

"What does it mean that we are often our own worst enemy?
The reason I have an enemy is because I have "self".
If I no longer had a "self", I would no longer have an enemy.

Love the whole world as if it were your self;
then you will truly care for all things."


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Ravus]
    #6202214 - 10/23/06 05:10 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

If I no longer had a "self", I would no longer have an enemy.

Could you have a self and have no enemy?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlineck10n3
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Icelander]
    #6202682 - 10/23/06 06:59 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

"I am not your teacher. Because you have drank and become drunk from the very same spring from which I draw."




So when I am ready I am going to try and supply everyone with as much drink as possible. If they want to accept the drink and become drunk they will... this seems to be fairly few people though.

Quote:

As far as science can tell everything is made from the same stuff. Looking at it that way we could say accurately that all is one. And that stuff that we and everything else is made of.




It is the bio-geochemical cycle. I totally agree, and it can't get much simpler than that. If you can't understand that everything is one and the same you are oblivious to life itself.

I was thinking about this today in my Ethics class.

The Earth is seen as a whole. People categorize things so easily. If Earth is just seen as Earth, the macrocosm rather than microcosm and all the little shit going on. It can easily be seen that it is all alive. Everything sprouted from the Earth when it was born, or however that happened. Things evolved and grew off one another. Everything came from the same thing. It is all just one big growing life form. Just as little bacteria help us live and be. Everything on the Earth makes it "alive".

I think we are either in some sort of infinite space going larger to smaller. Like the Men In Black thing where our entire "outerspace" is just a marble in some much more vast and expansive place. Or we are in a loop of things and "outerspace" is actually something that makes up the things we are made up of in some sort of connected parallel universe with the larger to smaller thing going on within itself. Hard to explain, not good with communicating my ideas.


--------------------
"You must be the change you want to see in the world." - The trip of a Life Time.

Indra's Net - There is an endless net of threads throughout the universe. The horizontal threads are in space. The vertical threads in time. At every crossing of threads there is an individual. And every individual is a crystal bead. The great light of absolute being illuminates and penetrates every crystal being, And every crystal being reflects not only the light from every other crystal in the net, But also every reflection of every reflection throughout the universe.

-cK


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Ravus]
    #6202864 - 10/23/06 07:48 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

My apologies. Quite right. I thought that all translations of Thomas were identical, but tranlators may differ on a word or two. Your quote on "three gods" is logia 30 which I did not recognize at all. My bad. Thanks for providing your version. I bought my first translation of Thomas in 1976. However, the reference to "three gods" is not to a trinitarian notion of deity, it is a confluence of references to the source for Matthew 18:20 "For where two are three are gathered in my name, there am I with them," and John 10:34:

"Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are gods' if he called them 'gods,' to whom the word of God came - and the Scripture cannot be broken - what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world?" (NIV)

This NT reference has Jesus drawing from Psalms 82:6:
"I said, 'You are gods,' you are all sons of the Most High.'" (NIV)

Your interpretation caused me a knee-jerk reaction to respond somewhat harshly. Sorry about that chief.  :blush:


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #6202923 - 10/23/06 08:01 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
Your interpretation caused me a knee-jerk reaction to respond somewhat harshly. Sorry about that chief.  :blush:




Always are there opportunities for growth and transcendence! :wink:

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Offlinestellar renegade
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Re: Modern Christianity's Greatest Enemy [Re: Ravus]
    #7439044 - 09/22/07 03:05 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

All I have to say is that this thread was amazing... I enjoyed most of the input.

Also, that Nietszche quote really surprised me. Has been awhile since I've read Nietszche. Something he said turned me off to him, but the quote I like. I still don't understand why it said that he seemed to view Jesus in a negative light, though? All the things he said seem very positive...


--------------------
"I threw a small stone down at the reflection of my image in the water, and it altogether disappeared. I burst as it shattered through me, like a bullet through a bottle... and I'm expected to believe that any of this is real!" -mewithoutYou

"To believe in the wide-awake real, through all the stupefying, enervating, distorting dream: to will to wake, when the very being seems athirst for godless repose: these are the broken steps up to the high fields where repose is but a form of strength, strength but a form of joy, joy but a form of love." -George MacDonald


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