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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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Re: On gayness [Re: Basilides]
    #5662002 -

we are all in a fierce battle over our political rights.

personally, I sympathize with gays a lot because we both lead alternative lifestyles. I mean, I enjoy behavior that is against the law, so who am I to judge? Still though, I don't walk around shouting out to people that I smoke pot. That would be counter-productive. Yeah, gays get beat up and kicked out of school for their lifestyle. So do drug users. We get kicked out of school and put in prison, and beaten and raped there. Where's our parade?

you wanna hear a funny joke I made up?

"Why is homosexuality against the law? What do they expect to accomplish by this? What are they going to do if they catch you with another man? Send you to prison? How does that make sense? That's like sending a pot head to an all-expense paid trip to Amsterdam!"

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Re: On gayness [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5662087 -

I don't think being gay is illegal anywhere in the developed world. And you know, stoners have rights too which is why they gather at Smoke-Ins. Man, the spirit of the 60's was to protest the establishment and their out-dated views even if it meant getting the blunt end of a baton or being taken downtown by the boys in blue.  :tongue: It's a matter of not letting others push you around, so if it's gays or stoners showing a bit of fortitude, more power to them.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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Re: On gayness [Re: Basilides]
    #5662120 -

"We lost the values but we kept the weed!"

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Re: On gayness [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5662179 -

After reading all your posts on this thread I have come to a conclusion. You need to come on out of the closet because your obsession with your possible latent homsexuality is really causing you some trouble. Self rejection is never good, and the sooner you come to grips with this the better. I am serious. The bigoted responses you have posted point very strongly to these impulses. Combine that with your contempt for women and I think I got your tendancies nailed down.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: On gayness [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5662204 -

As fireworks would say...

:lol:


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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Re: On gayness [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5662227 -

Huehuecoyotl said:
After reading all your posts on this thread I have come to a conclusion. You need to come on out of the closet because your obsession with your possible latent homsexuality is really causing you some trouble. Self rejection is never good, and the sooner you come to grips with this the better. I am serious. The bigoted responses you have posted point very strongly to these impulses. Combine that with your contempt for women and I think I got your tendancies nailed down.


the only thing you have nailed down is your own hands to a tree.  You think I'm runnin out of nails?  A pretty girl with blue eyes gave me all the nails I need.  Have fun hanging there, guy.  I'll be back in a few thousands years to get you down :rofl:

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Re: On gayness [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5662315 -

While Huehuecoyotl usually has some pretty enlightening things to say, I think the whole "you bash gays so you are secretly gay yourself" stab is pretty tired. I doubt all the rednecks that hate black people secretly go home and listen to Nelly, so why has homophobia become an automatic open door for people to point out that the person himself is gay?

Also, likening him to Hitler for his views on the gene pool or distate for gay rallies is rather hyperbolic.

I don't even agree with DoctorJ on a few points, or to the extent he believes in other things, but his vastly different viewpoint (like most others) should be thoughtfully analyzed rather than immediately scrutinized for insights into his own personal faults


--------------------
-CUBErt
:cubie::levitate::cubie:

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Re: On gayness [Re: Andy21]
    #5662372 -

Well, I'm definately gay, and I don't really know what you mean by a spiritual perspective on being gay, as I see sexuality as a function of the personality and not Spirit. However, on a psychological level, I'd say that when I was very young my emotions began to flow much stronger towards men than women. As you can see from my pic, I'm not effiminate either, but I really see no problem with effiminate men, I'm simply not attracted to them. I think in the world of pornography, anything that's considered "work" is going to lack empathy, but if people who are genuinely turned on by one another and a camera, then it's real and hot. Granted that's not the standard in the industry, but it's out there if you look for it in the right places. Life isn't so black and white.
Though you're not interested in Pride parades (that's OK), they exist for a reason. In 1969 in the last weekend of June there was a riot against police who used to brutalize gay men (at the time it was illegal to serve alcohol to gays) at a bar in NYC called Stonewall on Christopher St. This started a protest for 3 days. You know, it also OK if you don't "go out every night to be sodomized by strangers", but really, why so judgmental? I'd estimate that I've had thousands of sexual partners, but when I go out into a social-sexual scene like a bar I don't have any expectations, I just look to enjoy my community, everything else that may or may not happen is an extension of that. I see your view of top/bottom power dynamics in sex as extremely limited as well, though if you're not interested in their erotic potential that's your right, just realize that you've only scratched the surface of this subject.


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.

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Re: On gayness [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5662455 -

Huehuecoyotl said:
After reading all your posts on this thread I have come to a conclusion. You need to come on out of the closet because your obsession with your possible latent homsexuality is really causing you some trouble. Self rejection is never good, and the sooner you come to grips with this the better. I am serious. The bigoted responses you have posted point very strongly to these impulses. Combine that with your contempt for women and I think I got your tendancies nailed down.


his posts may be bigoted but yours is just plain ignorant. in my psychology class last semester we studied the research on this question to find out whether it was true bigotry against homosexuals points to homosexual impulses and it turned out to be totally false.

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Re: On gayness [Re: CUBErt]
    #5662582 -

i like the flamboyant gays and the transgendered. lesbians freak me out a little because i can never tell if they have a dislike of men. normal gay men i like that they give me compliments i don't get anywhere else, and i don't have to respond to it other than inner satisfaction.

i like the flamboyants because of the whole "mutant" sort of effect. i like that poeple are differnt than normal, and are able to maintain it and push thier differnce at other poeple without being destabilized.
as to the whole energy blockage or psychological problem dealy: energetically normal poeple are just as fucked if not more so. All common attidues towards sex energetically and psychically are fucked, and if you have the spiritual technology to use sex correctly then it doesn't matter who or what you're using to arouse that energy.

remeber that according to most of the old time spiritual practices male-female sex is depleating the man and at worst is making the woman energetically crippled by dependence. at best women have it better energetically it would seem.

the highest form of sex is to constantly be making love to yourself and your surroundings withhout the limitations of the genital reproduction.


--------------------
You can check the last post in my journal for contact info.

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Re: On gayness [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5662633 -

Quote:
I don't go out and wave the fact that I smoke and trip in people's faces. You know what happens when potheads try to get together and have a parade? they get busted.


Absurd comparison. Homosexual relations are legal while recreational drug usage is not.

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Re: On gayness [Re: Deviate]
    #5662702 -

Obviously not everyone who gay bashes is gay. Much of the world still has a problem with homosexuality and much of the world is obviously straight. The insinuation is more of a poetic irony - someone who consistently worries about the bedroom lives of others might at times come off as a little "lacking" in their own department.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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Re: On gayness [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5662737 -

fireworks_god said:
It's no big deal. It is merely one's personal choice. For whatever reason, some are attracted to individual's from the same gender in a sexual manner, and they have the right to express that and to form relationships with each other. :wink:



I'm not getting into this topic tonight, if at all, but I will say that one cannot claim it is "merely" anything without providing the facts behind the issue. Tragically very few people possess the ability to discern between evaluating the source of an action and evaluating the worth of a person. To claim that homosexuality is not "natural" is not an offence, and when someone takes it as that it is out of simple-mindedness.

The truth of the issue of homosexualy, as far as we've discovered, is that it is not supported to be natural (keep reading) although there have been numerous "science-based" claims by activist groups, and activist-group supporters suggesting evidence that it is equal with heterosexuality. A review of these reports, from their original sources, shows that they intentionally contain large holes, manipulative wording, and conclusion-jumping. The state of the world now is that if someone doesn't want to see something then that someone won't see something, and the truth is no longer truth, but opinion.

I can find all homosexually-supporting reports in a few minutes and display, in focus and detail, the errors within them - however it cannot be tonight.

One base fact people can think on:
The vagina wall contains something around 90 cell layers to protect against disease, tearing and contamination. The anus has 2-3 layers of cells, tears easily, does not protect against disease, and contains no pleasure nerves.

I respect people whether or not they are straight or gay, however the truth of homosexuality's validity I will not attempt to make up or be biased on, nor would I be concerning any truth. I do not care about being right or wrong, I care that the truth stands and that people stop pretending their way through life. I also have gay friends, I don't condemn them or think of them as worse than myself, nor do I think of the issue of homosexuality as one of my life's focus'.


Another pop-psychology moment is when people think that all choices of action are equally intended and natural. That is fairy tale ideology. It's simple for a mind without understanding to dismiss honest learning by claiming everything is valid. Everything being possible to happen is no the same as everything being designed to be.

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Re: On gayness [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #5662902 -

I am sorry I sounded judgemental, reading my message again I agree. I guess I probably am judgemental about promiscuity, just because I despise feeling used. I really have no moral objection to it, I just have the sneaking suspicion it would leave me a blubbering mess. DocterJ as to all gays being clean freaks, you are wrong. You should check out my room, theres about 50 empty evian bottles followed by a nice carpet of assignmnents followed by unwashed clothes. That said a few years ago I was a little OCD about cleanliness, but then just got bored and decided to get a hobby. I started watching movies, it worked out well; theres lots of movies  :thumbup:

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Re: On gayness [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #5662912 -

I hate talking about this kind of shit because I always feel like an asshole for saying what I mean. I really shouldn't have gotten in on this thread at all and I apologize to anyone I have offended.

The fact of the matter is that homosexuals are a minority. We have a society based in majority rules with minority rights. And I respect the rights of the minority. But they should understand that they are unique in that they only make up about 10-15% of the general population. So not everyone is going to be down with them.

Does that mean they should get beat up and ostracized by society? Absolutely not. If I saw someone beating up a gay dude just for being gay, he would not escape my justice. Thats sickening to beat someone up over something so trivial.

But on the other hand, I'm not going to be all for it when some flamer comes around. I mean, when I see someone who is obviously gay to the point that they are letting everyone know it with every breath they take, I can't help but think about what they do. And it creeps me out. Thinking about that literally makes me shudder. I mean, shouldn't homosexuals at least be sensitive to the fact that their sexual practices just seem wierd to a lot of people? I mean, I don't have a problem with the existence of wierd things, but if I was around wierd things all the time, I'd go nuts.

Are we straight people not allowed our little bubble of ignorance? I mean, just because I accept that homosexuals exist doesn't mean I want to know all about them and what they do. Sometimes, I'd rather remain in the dark about some things. I think a lot of homosexuals are masters of the TMI: Too Much Information.

And its not like I hate gay people. Its the act that bothers me. The people are just fine. If one of my friends came out to me, I wouldn't be bothered by it. I would and have supported many gay people in their decision to be themselves.

But maybe gays should realize, just as they have a gene that makes them gay, I have a gene that makes gay sex seem repugnant to me. Can they not accept the fact that I would really rather just not hear about it?

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Re: On gayness [Re: DoctorJ]
    #5662985 -

It seems to me that you're simply generalizing a group of people :shrug:


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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Re: On gayness [Re: Deviate]
    #5663026 -

"in my psychology class last semester we studied the research on this question to find out whether it was true bigotry against homosexuals points to homosexual impulses and it turned out to be totally false."

I agree. Bigoted behavior towards a certain group does not indicate secret membership in that group, but it does indicate insecurity, but the individual involved also bears hatred towards women...so I see that as the deciding factor. It is possible, though, that he is merely unenlightened and and lacking in basic intelligence so I might be willing to concede the point to you with these factors in mind.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: On gayness [Re: Ped]
    #5663260 -

Ped said:
I'm fervently against so-called "gay pride parades", and other homosexual community demonstrations.


Are you equally agansit Boy Scouts of America parades? The last time I checked, it was all right to form a group and to celebrate the group and its aspects.

Quote:
  I am equally disappointed with such demonstrations as I am with societies which fail to honour the rights of homosexuals.  I find either side to be crude and obnoxious.


Feeling disappointed in a society that fails to honor rights of a certain group doesn't exactly accomplish much in influencing society to honor their rights. I guess it is crude and obnoxious to make an example of the fact that one can practice one's right when another group refutes and denies one's rights, eh? :rolleyes:

Quote:
"Gay pride parades" aren't just about gay rights.  They are about standing out, about creating a contrast between one community and another.


Cultural diversity is to be cherished and celebrated. It isn't a negative display when Native Americans hold a pow-wow, is it? Community should not be homogenized (:smirk:), just as genetics should not be. Variety is the spice of life, variety is responsible for the continued existance of life. Why do you feel that variety should not be recognized, demonstrated, reveled?

Quote:
  Anyone with any insight in to the issue can see that gay pride demonstrations do not serve to advance gay rights -- at least not directly -- and in fact they function to stir up discontent, and to foment the hatred that some carry in their hearts.


Is that their fault? A black man walking down a street in the South, perhaps glancing at a white woman has stirred up discontent in the white people in the area, actually inciting the hatred that the white men carried in their hearts, bringing them to murder the black man.

Anyone with insight into the issue can plainly see that the black man was not serving to advance black rights by actively practicing black rights. :wtf:

Quote:
  Opposing hatred with obnoxiousness is like fighting fire with gasoline.


Society is a complacent firehouse that will not reach for its extinguishers unless it is a blazing forest fire. If there is a societal problem, it needs to be magnifed. Otherwise, society will shrug and continue on its normal routine.

Quote:
This is not to justify their actions.  It is merely to highlight a cause-effect relationship which, if allowed to continue, will only serve to further impair the collective judgement of our civilization.


Please explain to me very consisely and with vivid imagery the difference between the struggle for gay rights and the civil rights movement of the '60's.

No, you are right, the Million Man March was simply obnoxious. :nonono: Those damn niggers, they didn't even realize that they were simply serving to impair society's collective judgement. They weren't effectively fighting the fire. They weren't engaging in behavior that would secure their rights as a human being.

I'd continue, but my sarcasm constructor just blew a fuse... actually, I think the circuit board itself melted.... :lol:

:earth: :sun: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: On gayness [Re: Basilides]
    #5663277 -

Basilides said:
It's a matter of not letting others push you around, so if it's gays or stoners showing a bit of fortitude, more power to them.


If we showed more fortitude, we'd have the power to live our life as we feel necessary. It isn't going to happen like that, even though it could. We'll simply have to wait for the slow, gradual, subtle change that will eventually bring it so that we can walk down the street with a joint in our lips.

Honestly, it all boils down to how much an individual feels that it is their right to behave in a certain manner, or to simply be a certain way. The drug issue is one where they simply say "Hey, you can't do that, we will punish you". How would it feel if someone told you that you did not have the right to be something that you could not change? That is more motivation. :grin:

We lose our rights because we do not truly realize them as rights. If we were to say "Hey, I have an inalienable right to smoke marijuana" our actions would directly confront and rise agansit anyone who would attempt to deny us that right.

:earth: :sun: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: On gayness [Re: Disco Cat]
    #5663307 -

Disco Cat said:
One base fact people can think on:
The vagina wall contains something around 90 cell layers to protect against disease, tearing and contamination. The anus has 2-3 layers of cells, tears easily, does not protect against disease, and contains no pleasure nerves.


So, what exactly is your point?

Quote:
I respect people whether or not they are straight or gay, however the truth of homosexuality's validity I will not attempt to make up or be biased on, nor would I be concerning any truth.


Homosexuality's validity? Homosexuality is valid because it is a choice that a human being is capable of making. Your reasoning would support the statement that "Tattoos are not valid for a person because the skin tears blah blah blah".

Quote:
I do not care about being right or wrong, I care that the truth stands and that people stop pretending their way through life.


The truth? The truth is that homosexuality is a lifestyle choice. That makes it valid. Beneficial to an individual? Beneficial to another individual according to your own perspective? Debate that all you want. Don't throw the validity of something up in the air and implicate what you are alluding to.

Quote:
Another pop-psychology moment is when people think that all choices of action are equally intended and natural. That is fairy tale ideology. It's simple for a mind without understanding to dismiss honest learning by claiming everything is valid.


I choose to drink milk instead of water. Some scientific study suggests that the stomach lining is more suited to properly digest water than milk, etc. etc. technical stuff, so drinking milk is not a valid choice for an individual to make.

Quote:
Everything being possible to happen is no the same as everything being designed to be.


Is this to be interpreted as a subtle reference to creationism and a creator's intention? :wtf: Hhhm... let us think this one out, if something is possible to occur, than the involved aspects of reality are designed for that something to possibly occur. Wow!

Hhm... is two homosexual men who masterbate each other and have oral sex not "designed" to be? Does the fact that the mouth has teeth while the vagina does not mean that oral sex is not natural, not designed to be?

Where, exactly, are you fucking coming from? Way out from left field, perhaps? :confused:

:earth: :sun: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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