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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Observations
    #4909578 -

Nothing exists until or unless it is observed. ~William Burroughs


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<3 juliamarie

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Re: Observations [Re: juliamarie]
    #4909611 -

Very true.


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Re: Observations [Re: RESTLESS]
    #4909613 -

I'm under that belief as well.

It's sort of like...mind and matter exist together not separetly.

the mind exists because we have a brain...and the brain exists because we have a mind.

Edited by TameMe (11/08/05 03:17 PM)

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Re: Observations [Re: juliamarie]
    #4909646 -

If you mean to say an object does not exist as percieved, until it is observed, then I agree.

If you're implying that my juicy steak which I am eating, zaps out of existence into nothingness when I turn my head the other direction, until I turn my head back in the directional view of my steak, then I don't agree.

And welcome to The Shroomery. :smile:


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.

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Re: Observations [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #4909689 -

I think ontology should be thrown into the wastebasket and replaced by perceptology.

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Re: Observations [Re: juliamarie]
    #4909954 -

the same oppinion was also proposed by a philosopher named berkley, and many others.

i also share this oppinion... funny that an oppinion that would be considerd crazy by the vast majority of our society is like almost universal on the shroomery philosophy forum


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Everything I post is fiction.

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Re: Observations [Re: Moonshoe]
    #4909975 -

Quote:
funny that an oppinion that would be considerd crazy by the vast majority of our society is like almost universal on the shroomery philosophy forum


Speak for yourself. I disagree 100% with Burroughs' unfounded assertion.

As for the number of people in this forum who believe it, that says more about the credulity of the denizens of the forum than it does about the nature of the universe. The number of adherents of a proposition does not determine its validity.



Phred


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Re: Observations [Re: Phred]
    #4910023 -

To KNOW an object is there, you do PERCEIVE it, so you HAVE TO OBSERVE it to KNOW it is there.


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<3 juliamarie

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Re: Observations [Re: juliamarie]
    #4910044 -

Every perception is a gamble.

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Re: Observations [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #4910059 -

Every perception means something different to each individual, so yes, every perception is kinda like a gamble.


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<3 juliamarie

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Re: Observations [Re: juliamarie]
    #4910066 -

Quote:
To KNOW an object is there, you do PERCEIVE it, so you HAVE TO OBSERVE it to KNOW it is there.


Well, first of all, that is not what Burroughs was saying in the quote you provided.

Secondly, we don't have to perceive an object to know it is there. I can't perceive my pancreas, but I know it is there. I can't perceive the craters on the back side of the moon, but I know they are there, too.



Phred


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Re: Observations [Re: juliamarie]
    #4910077 -

So, if we do not KNOW about it, it does not exist?

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Re: Observations [Re: Phred]
    #4910079 -

i kno burroughs wasnt saying that...i put a spin on wat u said...lol. but i still think burroughs had something going there.


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<3 juliamarie

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Re: Observations [Re: Phred]
    #4910081 -

"Speak for yourself. I disagree 100% with Burroughs' unfounded assertion."

i am speaking for myself... and all the other people who had posted in this thread so far

"The number of adherents of a proposition does not determine its validity."

i never said it did. i was just commenting that so far 5 out of 5 people had agreed with a sentiment the vast majority of people do not believe in.

all is mind...

logos


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Everything I post is fiction.

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Re: Observations [Re: Moonshoe]
    #4910096 -

Actually, you said you were speaking for the entire Shroomery Philosophy forum. :grin:

"Almost universal" is a pretty sweeping statment if you were just speaking for yourself and a few people who posted on a brand-new thread.

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Re: Observations [Re: Phred]
    #4910104 -

Phred said:
I can't perceive my pancreas, but I know it is there. I can't perceive the craters on the back side of the moon, but I know they are there, too.


You could.

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Re: Observations [Re: Veritas]
    #4910273 -

"Almost universal" is a pretty sweeping statment if you were just speaking for yourself and a few people who posted on a brand-new thread. "

that is true. i hope what i meant to convey has been clarified


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Everything I post is fiction.

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Re: Observations [Re: juliamarie]
    #4913243 -

I am also totally different. I admit, I often lay much much too much value on those things, we not know allready, but which are not out of possibilites yet, either :grin:
Yes, I love Science-Fiction and Fantasy :lol:

UTOPOS rules !

But even things, that most people couldn't consider true in history, became very true in the present...try to continue this into future !


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
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"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

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Re: Observations [Re: juliamarie]
    #4914636 -

If something does not exist until it is observed, then how could the physical constituents of observation (mind) arise from nothingness (non-observation) in the first place? That statement is inherently flawed in my humble opinion. Unless you're positing that consciousness is eternally self-observant and independent from matter...


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Persons denying the existence of robots may be robots themselves.

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Re: Observations [Re: Phred]
    #4916572 -

Phred said:
I can't perceive my pancreas, but I know it is there. I can't perceive the craters on the back side of the moon, but I know they are there, too.


i think you dont know that there are crates on the back side of the moon, you belive it.

there is difference between beliving and knowing...

IMO knowing is a gamble, but beliving is true...

if you remember a story when napoleon ships came to shores of america, the natives couldnt see the ships. ships was there, right in front of their eyes and still invisible for them cuz they didnt belive ships could exist.

sorry for bad english in advance if there is any.


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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