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OfflineArCh_TemPlaR
enthusiast
Registered: 07/15/01
Posts: 200
Last seen: 21 years, 9 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: Menace]
    #551746 - 02/14/02 07:25 PM (22 years, 11 days ago)

Maybe, you should direct your thoughts at Zahid, he's the expert on Allah. Not me



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OfflineMentalHygene
otherworldly

Registered: 01/14/02
Posts: 192
Loc: Somewhere...Under the rai...
Last seen: 20 years, 1 month
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: ArCh_TemPlaR]
    #551840 - 02/14/02 08:59 PM (22 years, 11 days ago)

    Arch:  Sorry about that, I should have specified.  I was asking Zahid about the afterlife thing....  (at leats thats what I assume you are refering to)  I am aware now that you are not muslim. I mean I am dumb, but not that dumb to forget so quickly. :wink: 


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"WHATS THE USE OF AUTONOMY WHEN A BUTTON DOES IT ALL?"


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OfflineArCh_TemPlaR
enthusiast
Registered: 07/15/01
Posts: 200
Last seen: 21 years, 9 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: MentalHygene]
    #551873 - 02/14/02 09:25 PM (22 years, 11 days ago)

Np.. 

Afterlife:  I never asked I just provided Ch'an(Pure land)  perspective on it that traces back to Siddartha's teachings.  He basically taught theravadin, mahayana, and vajrayana.  The schools just took pieces of it and taught it in a specailized way to capture the diversity of people's needs.

That's my understanding so far. 

Well, I'll forgive you since you're a err God.. :wink:


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OfflineMentalHygene
otherworldly

Registered: 01/14/02
Posts: 192
Loc: Somewhere...Under the rai...
Last seen: 20 years, 1 month
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: ArCh_TemPlaR]
    #551952 - 02/14/02 10:36 PM (22 years, 11 days ago)

HEY YOU....I AM GOD AND I SHOULD BE DOING THE FORGIVING!!!!  :smile:
  Ok sorry, I couldn't resist, but I promise thats the last time.  Speaking of Siddartha, have you read the book by Herman Hesse of the same title?  If you have not I would highly reccomend it.  It chronicles the buddha's life in a very easy to read, and very easy to understand manner.  Traveling in a linear fashion from birth to enlightenment to death. This is the best book I have ever read on the subject.  Just thought you might like to know!! 


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"WHATS THE USE OF AUTONOMY WHEN A BUTTON DOES IT ALL?"


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OfflineLeroyBr103
Stranger
Registered: 02/14/02
Posts: 11
Loc: Midwest
Last seen: 21 years, 9 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: MentalHygene]
    #552377 - 02/15/02 10:10 AM (22 years, 11 days ago)

hell ya ive read Siddhartha by Herman Hesse, I was just reading that you reccomended it. That book is great, it pretty much states what i belive, that you shouldn't spend your life searching for religion from other people.


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OfflineMentalHygene
otherworldly

Registered: 01/14/02
Posts: 192
Loc: Somewhere...Under the rai...
Last seen: 20 years, 1 month
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: LeroyBr103]
    #552482 - 02/15/02 11:34 AM (22 years, 11 days ago)

Exactly....you have to find your own god! :smile:


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"WHATS THE USE OF AUTONOMY WHEN A BUTTON DOES IT ALL?"


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OfflineArCh_TemPlaR
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Registered: 07/15/01
Posts: 200
Last seen: 21 years, 9 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: MentalHygene]
    #552778 - 02/15/02 04:01 PM (22 years, 11 days ago)


Oh yeah, I forgot.. Excuse my insolence.. *LMAO

No, I haven't, but I will. Siddartha's teachings speak in depths beyond what ears could hear. I consider the best way to learn, to understand, and find insight is to never recite his sutras unless it was necessary. I instll my understanding in my own words and creativity instead.

Exactly....you have to find your own god!

Then tell me, God, the answers to this:

Four kinds of hourses
The excellent horse moves before the whip touches its back.
The good horse runs at the slightest touch of the whip.
The poor horse doesn't go until pain is felt.
The worst horse doesn't budge until pain is felt to the bones.

Which is the best horse for cultivation?

Technically, there's two answers.


Zahid: I've noticed when I look back at my posts that I mirror the thought processing of the recipient [you]... Sometimes with a little too mustard. heh So if you're still around, see if you notice I match your self-righteousness with my fierceness, a reflection of you. I am nothing compare to what you will find out there waiting for you, the kuhrs. And kuhrs sound like dogs.. Woof! *LOL


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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 4 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: ArCh_TemPlaR]
    #552925 - 02/15/02 06:33 PM (22 years, 10 days ago)

Arch_Templar: I still stand by everything that I've said so far. The non-believers will never understand why we believe, and the believers will never understand why the non-believers do not believe. Throw as many theories as you would like, Feud and Jung.. are what, two people? (well no shit). How many people are on this planet? Heh. The way you sound, you think your "perspectives" are right. These are theories. Look it up. I sense a alot of egoism here. But go ahead, rant all your theories and your perspectives all you want. Maybe I'm right in my beliefs, maybe you're right in yours. I believe in what I believe. People like you will never understand that. :-) If you're right, then we'll all experience complete nothingness or enter some mystic afterlife that everyone (including people like, Albert Fish?) can experience. If I'm right though, would you be able to handle it? Have a nice day.


--------------------


Edited by Zahid (02/15/02 06:34 PM)


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InvisibleLallafa
p_g monocle
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/13/01
Posts: 2,598
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: Zahid]
    #552944 - 02/15/02 06:56 PM (22 years, 10 days ago)

"The non-believers will never understand why we believe, and the believers will never understand why the non-believers do not believe."

you forgot to add that the nonbelievers are going to suffer a just fate of eternal damnation


i dont believe, but i understand why you believe


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my tax dollars going to more hits of acid for charles manson


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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 4 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: Lallafa]
    #552951 - 02/15/02 07:01 PM (22 years, 10 days ago)

No, you don't. :laugh: You would like to think that.


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InvisibleLallafa
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Registered: 04/13/01
Posts: 2,598
Loc: underbelly
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: Zahid]
    #552996 - 02/15/02 07:38 PM (22 years, 10 days ago)

im pretty sure i know.
-you want to belong, the social aspect
-you are afraid of what happens when you die (the scariest thought probably being "nothing")
-you have been brainwashed by others
-it makes you happy. Heaven sounds like a cool place huh?
-gives purpose and direction in your life
-allows you to adopt someone elses morals, values and rules instead of taking the time to create your own
-it makes you feel secure. you take comfort in believing there is something higher than all of us ...its kind of a crutch, or safety blanket. you like ?knowing? there is a ?big picture? and it all means something
-its believable to you, makes sense, and you probably really honestly believe it, and FEEL GOD RUNNIN THROUGH MY VEINS PRAISE JESUS
-you like closure. this is the way it is, i dont want to have to change it, question it, or even think about it all that much
-your god threatened you (and me!) with eternal hell


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my tax dollars going to more hits of acid for charles manson


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OfflineMickyFinn
Fuck the DJ
Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 760
Loc: VA Beach VA
Last seen: 13 years, 11 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: Lallafa]
    #553035 - 02/15/02 08:40 PM (22 years, 10 days ago)

this is directed to no one in particular, i guess it is going back to the original question "does god exist?" i think something does, i dont know what, i go back and forth on the subject. im baptist by birth, southern at that, and thats one messed up denomination, so i dont follow it. i cant say "god" doesnt exist, because i believe there has been times when "whoever" did me favors when i most needed it.
example: i lost my job, i had filed unemployment, i was receiving 125 bucks a week in benifits. after weeks of looking for a job, my savings ran out and this was not enough to pay for rent, food, utilities, car note, insurance etc. i cried myself to sleep with hopelessness, i said a prayer. the next day, and i bullshit you not, i got a check in the mail for 450 dollars. that was enough to pay for food, pay some utilities, rent etc. each week after that i received 250.00 . even though it was bill that was passed in congress to up the benifits for victims loosing there jobs due to 9/11, it came when i needed it most. i can say that was an act of "god" this is coming from someone that has not been the best christian he can be. i hope as i get older, that i can make that connection with my "god" that my parents have such a good relationship with. but, i dont believe in my own birth right religion, ive seen too many shady preachers, wearing jewelry that they dont need, driving vehicles that they dont need, doing things that will make you question are they in it for the money? and if there is a god, how can they do it in his name? that s a sure ticket to hell, if there is one. but then again, all they have to do is ask for forgiveness, thats such bullshit to me. that means i can sin everyday, even kill someone, break every single commandment, and ive broken quite a few and ask for forgiveness and find my spot in heaven. kinda not fair to the individual who has lived a rightous life, but im human. dont put something in front of me and tell me its bad, i have to see for myself. and to the muslim guy, i lived in saudi arabia, ive experienced islam, even though i never practiced. it borders on fundamentalism, im sorry. but thats my opinion. i kinda like buddism, i like that reincarnation thing, come back until you get it right. at the same time, we as a western society with all are liberties and all our evil doings over here, it sounds like you all believe that our whole nation is lost and no one from the west has a ticket to heaven. that could not be our fault, especially if we have the right to worship as we please, a generation or two slacked off with passing religious beliefs. we cannot possibly be punished for that, oh i forgot we can ask for forgivness, we just have to be sincere since god can see into our hearts. but back to the original question, i believe in something, it scares me more to believe that after my life is over, there is nothing. i cease to exist. dying can be no worse than going to the dentist, going to surgery, whatever, i know you feel the apprehension, but there is no use fighting it, it has to happen anyways. i just dont want what makes "me" to die away, fade away to nothing, thats my fear. if thats the case, life was the cruelest torture that was bestowed upon me.


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OfflineAxiom420
ADDICT

Registered: 03/22/01
Posts: 202
Loc: in the forest, behind the...
Last seen: 4 years, 11 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: Zylo]
    #553039 - 02/15/02 08:50 PM (22 years, 10 days ago)

Well as time wears on and mankind continues to spew toxic waste into the atmosphere and eat grease the genetic material that we pass on to our children will become weaker and weaker as has been happening for millenia...since, uh, the "fall" and especially since God stared degrading the human genetic code so that we have that 120 year expiration date now. And as the gene pool get weaker so the dangers of inbreeding. (Imagine two genetically perfect people... Adam and Eve for lack of a better name, inbreeding, theoretically, wouldn't be an issue that would cause retardation. It would only be an issue for people with more trash fucking with the genetic code, like us at 2002.)

Yeah, I believe. Its not like it was a choice or something...it just the nature of the way things are.

God exists.

I exist.

Jesus Christ.

Those mushrooms are funny things!


--------------------
"Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen."
- Albert Einstein


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Anonymous

Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: MentalHygene]
    #553160 - 02/15/02 11:21 PM (22 years, 10 days ago)

The concept of God is an anthropomorphic paradigm of the
universe, providing easily understood explanations for the
mysterious aspects of nature.

With God, one does not have to trouble himself with the
"Why?" of existence. With God, there is no reason to fret
over confronting our mortality which the survival instinct is
designed to postpone as long as possible, for in God we are
promised eternal life.

God provides humans with a ready made morality, no need to
grapple with the consequences of one's actions if a quick
consultation with the sacred text or the ready answer from
our favorite cleric will do.

After our parents are gone, there's no need to worry because
there's still God. When we are bad children, God will punish
us, when we are good children he will reward us. God will
destroy our enemies (and their God will destroy their's).

Of course, God is all loving and merciful. He shows this by
making little children suffer from a variety of maladies be it
aids, birth defects, being born to physically and sexually
abusive parents, dying of starvation or any one of a number of
horrible things. This kind, loving merciful fellow also brings
upon or allows the innocent to be subject to earthquakes,
tornados, hurricanes, war, genocide, dictators and torture.

The most curious thing about God is that this all knowing, all
powerful being requires to have his ego massaged and needs
us humble weak creatures to worship him. He also requires
that we abandon our most unique human characteristic, the
ability to reason, and provide him with unquestioned
obedience and accept everything on faith.

Beauty, order, the unexplained and the mysterious exist in
our universe as well as natural disasters, disease, accidents
and unfortunate circumstances individuals are born into.
Why people should project human characteristics upon it all
makes no sense to me.

Does God Exist? Yes, in the minds of many people. It is
their way of making sense of the universe.


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OfflineOmega137
Mean green havocand devastationmachine
Registered: 08/28/01
Posts: 76
Loc: where the world's allrigh...
Last seen: 19 years, 7 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: MentalHygene]
    #553318 - 02/16/02 03:23 AM (22 years, 10 days ago)

there is no god as an omnipotent beeing but as a chaotic force which keeps everything alive, working this force only reacts so it is not omnipotent, mankind disturbs this force so mankind is no part of any kind of godlyness.


--------------------
ABC-weaponry for world Peace!!!!
Elsass-Lothringen geh?rt Deutschland!!!
Fuck Humanism!!!!
Let's not argue about who killed who!!
Drop Da Bomb Maan!!!!
H84U!


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OfflineTannis
ZoneTrooper
Registered: 12/13/01
Posts: 508
Loc: MD.USA
Last seen: 20 years, 10 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: MickyFinn]
    #553390 - 02/16/02 07:31 AM (22 years, 10 days ago)

I like your honest reply. I'm from a prodestant background and I made the relationship to my God personal. I know there are phony preachers but just because there are crooked car salesmen---doesn't stop me from buying the car. I just go to the honest one....


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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 4 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: Lallafa]
    #553467 - 02/16/02 10:41 AM (22 years, 10 days ago)

In reply to:

im pretty sure i know.
-you want to belong, the social aspect
-you are afraid of what happens when you die (the scariest thought probably being "nothing")
-you have been brainwashed by others
-it makes you happy. Heaven sounds like a cool place huh?
-gives purpose and direction in your life
-allows you to adopt someone elses morals, values and rules instead of taking the time to create your own
-it makes you feel secure. you take comfort in believing there is something higher than all of us ...its kind of a
crutch, or safety blanket. you like ?knowing? there is a ?big picture? and it all means something
-its believable to you, makes sense, and you probably really honestly believe it, and FEEL GOD RUNNIN THROUGH
MY VEINS PRAISE JESUS
-you like closure. this is the way it is, i dont want to have to change it, question it, or even think about it all that
much
-your god threatened you (and me!) with eternal hell




This is an outsider's view faith. You've proven my point when I say the non-believers will never understand, until the day of their death in this life. Read your post over, Lallafa. Hell isn't forever, either. Only the most warped souls stay there eternity. Anyone with any slight faith and belief in God (in this life) will eventually be located by angels after a fixed sentence in the Fire and brought back to the nymphes of Paradise forever. I see religion as the big picture, you see it as a crutch for the weak and thus you refuse to experience it.


--------------------


Edited by Zahid (02/16/02 10:43 AM)


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OfflineArCh_TemPlaR
enthusiast
Registered: 07/15/01
Posts: 200
Last seen: 21 years, 9 months
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: Zahid]
    #553771 - 02/16/02 05:23 PM (22 years, 9 days ago)

You cannot define what I see is right or not, nor non-islamic people. You don't even have clue what I believe in.. I'm through with this discussion.. You may not be an egoist but your words show it clearly, without a doubt.. I only mirrored it..



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Anonymous

Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: ArCh_TemPlaR]
    #555395 - 02/18/02 02:09 PM (22 years, 8 days ago)

I need proof. Without visual proof i don't believe in God. The same goes for most things in my life, if you can't see it then it doesn't exist


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OfflineBlastrid
e l e m e n t al i t y
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Registered: 01/14/02
Posts: 3,323
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Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
Re: Does God Exist? part one [Re: ]
    #555448 - 02/18/02 03:06 PM (22 years, 8 days ago)

Contact is the best movie. science vs religion, faith vs. fact. i'd just like to stress how religion is SCREWED, but how that is so completely different than believing in God or Jesus Christ. earlier this week 14 Catholic priests in New England were arrested for molesting children. how fucked up is that...
I for one believe there is a greater order and power to everything. but i don't KNOW. and i also believe it doesn't necessarily need to be in the form of a single entity like God in Heaven.
_ry_


--------------------
Blas'?trid (bl?s tr?d)
    n.  3rd generation derivitave of a combination of 'bastard' and 'blasted'.  Used as both an insult or an expletive.
    ex.  Blastrid!

Stereopattern  <--My music.


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