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Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) * 23
    #17252080 -

This is part of my series on how I get things done. I hope it helps!
DO NOT USE THE PICTURED WHITE PLASTIC LIDS THEY DO NOT SEAL -FH

I've been asked many times how I do my WBS so I figured I'd write it up for anyone who is curious.
This always, always, always provides me with perfect moisture content.

I make sure my WBS doesn't contain cracked corn or peanuts. Cracked corn can be used if you're careful, but I find that it makes everything stickier.


About 9-10 cups of dry WBS equals 7-10 hydrated WBS quart jars (varies by brand)


Even if your WBS says it has nothing but milo, millet, wheat and CC, you will often find objects that don't belong, such as:
Cracked corn
Corn
Raisins
Peanuts
Sticks

You'll want to remove these things as you notice them, but if a couple slip by it won't be a big deal.


Measure out the amount of WBS needed and throw it into a stockpot.
Fill it with cold water and stir the grains well, this will kick up a lot of dirt and straw and other crap. Pour the water out slowly, dumping anything floating. Repeat until the water runs clear. I get rid of floaters and sunflower seeds during this step.


It will take 4-5 pours but eventually the water will run clear and most of the sticks and garbage will be gone too.


Fill the pot with water so it covers the WBS by a couple inches at least.  Add a small handful of gypsum per 4 cups dry WBS and 3-6 cups of fresh coffee, stir well. Soak for 12-24 hours.



After 12-24 hours, heat on the stove, high heat, until the water begins to simmer. Stir occasionally.

Simmer for 5-10 minutes.


Pour the hot grains into a strainer. Shake every 10 minutes or so for 30-60 minutes.


Your grains should be dry on the outside at this point. The grains should not be sticky or clumping. Shake them one last time to distribute the moisture and if need be, put a small handful on a piece of toilet paper for 15 seconds. If it leaves no wet spot, your moisture content is perfect :thumbup:
If needed, you can cheat and use a blowdryer on low to finish the last bit of wetness. I do it every now and then :shrug:


Load your jars, making sure you cover your lid with foil (unless using a SFD for the filter.)
I load mine 2/3 full for G2G jars and 3/4 full for master jars.



Put a canning rack in the bottom of your PC. Add your jars and fill with enough water for a 90 minute cycle. If you have a large enough PC, place a canning rack on top of the first jars inside and put a couple more jars on top. My AA921 can hold ten quart jars at once.


PC at 15psi for 90 minutes. Let the PC vent steam for 5 minutes or so before putting the weight on.



Let the pressure cooker cool 2-4 hours.

I shake my WBS jars while they are still relatively hot after sterilizing. It helps distribute the moisture more evenly once its cooled.

Sometimes when I take them out of the PC hot, the lids will be a little loose. I tighten each lid before I shake it, then I loosen it a quarter turn afterwards. Put each in an area with minimal air movement to cool overnight (I use a large plastic tote.)

Once they're cooled, give em a shake and they should look about like this:


Next up, inoculation! Coming soon.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

Edited by FrankHorrigan (03/28/22 01:23 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #17252537 -

As with grain, do you simmer for 10 minutes?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: dlaz] * 2
    #17252547 -

dlaz said:
As with grain, do you simmer for 10 minutes?


No, I dump it as soon as it starts to simmer.
My WBS comes out very sticky when I simmer it like rye, making the batch unusable.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #17252573 -

Cool I will have to try it your way.....

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #17252635 -

FrankHorrigan said:
dlaz said:
As with grain, do you simmer for 10 minutes?


No, I dump it as soon as it starts to simmer.
My WBS comes out very sticky when I simmer it like rye, making the batch unusable.


:imwithstupid:

I tried boiling WBS for 7 minutes after an 18 hour soak.
No bueno.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: TranscendingLife] * 2
    #17258037 -

My first time doing WBS, I did it just like rye and ended up with a big brick of hard, sticky birdseed.
WBS doesn't take boiling well at all, I've found.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #17258153 -

Idk why people take out floaters and sunflower seeds, I even leave the pieces of straw or whatever in there and have had 0 contamed wbs jars.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: whtspoppin] * 2
    #17258167 -

It's personal preference.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: whtspoppin] * 3
    #17258178 -

whtspoppin said:
Idk why people take out floaters and sunflower seeds, I even leave the pieces of straw or whatever in there and have had 0 contamed wbs jars.


TL is right, there's nothing important about removing them.
They just tend to all come out while dumping my rinse water anyhow, so i just let em go.
I don't like black stuff in my jars :lol:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: TranscendingLife] * 1
    #17258190 -

This tek looks very usefull ! will try this out .
good post :smile:


--------------------
An intellectual is a person who's found one thing that's more interesting than sex.
- Aldous Huxley

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: agentg] * 1
    #17258362 -

FrankHorrigan where do you get your WBS at? I would love to know how many pounds is in the bag and what it costs too.

I've been paying approx $14 for a 40# bag at Walmart. It contains cracked corn, but I am interested in trying WBS that doesn't have any just to see how I like it.

I've also tried using chicken scratch which used to be about $7 for a 50# bag. Going solely by cost this was the cheapest grain I've ever heard of ($0.14 per pound). Chicken scratch seems to contain more cracked corn, but also a few different grains as well.


--------------------
Simple Tyvek Lids
Bulk Pasteurization - Electric/Steam
Greenhouse Humidification - RH Fully Automated
Increasing The Capacity Of Your Greenhouse

Edited by NineInchNails (11/21/12 12:16 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: NineInchNails] * 1
    #17258596 -

NineInchNails said:
FrankHorrigan where do you get your WBS at? I would love to know how many pounds is in the bag and what it costs too.

I've been paying approx $14 for a 40# bag at Walmart. It contains cracked corn, but I am interested in trying WBS that doesn't have any just to see how I like it.


That's funny, because I pay $14 for 40# at walmart for mine too. It's the "Economy Bag Wild Bird Feed." It doesn't really have any other label :lol:
I had to go all over to find one without cracked corn. I figured walmart wouldn't have it so I checked there last...Oops :shrug:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #17258627 -

Alright! Thanks! I'll check my local store and see if they stock that stuff for my next grow. I've seen pics of that WBS I think ... just a white bag with red lettering.


--------------------
Simple Tyvek Lids
Bulk Pasteurization - Electric/Steam
Greenhouse Humidification - RH Fully Automated
Increasing The Capacity Of Your Greenhouse

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: NineInchNails] * 2
    #17262440 -

Home Depot and Lowes also has a large selection of wild bird seed. I'd rather shop there than Wal-Mart.


--------------------
AMU  (Amateur Mycologists United)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: TheEaglesGift] * 1
    #17262493 -

Where can I get these jars with the plastic lids? Do they have an actual hole for injecting spores? :o

Going to do this tek as soon as my PC comes :laugh:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zenroe] * 1
    #17262539 -

zenroe said:
Where can I get these jars with the plastic lids? Do they have an actual hole for injecting spores? :o

Going to do this tek as soon as my PC comes :laugh:


You can buy these lids anywhere that mason jars are sold. You can also order the lids online. Google.com or amazon.com.

The lids do not come with holes for injecting spores, but with a 1/4 inch drill bit and a tube of silicone, you can make your own self healing injection ports. Search "self healing injection port" for some Teks.


--------------------
AMU  (Amateur Mycologists United)

Edited by TheEaglesGift (11/24/12 01:39 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: TheEaglesGift] * 2
    #17272489 -

During the soak anything I'm looking for to know that the soak is done... Don't wanna do 24 thinking more is always better when there's a window of perfection lol Great write up

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Liquid_Beef] * 1
    #17272493 -

Meh, I soak for 24, add gypsum, bring to a boil, let boil for 10 minutes, dump directly into strainer and let it steam dry. Works like a charm every time.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: c0ri] * 1
    #17272531 -

is that coffee you are doing the soak in or just hot water from thecoffee maker?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) *DELETED* [Re: Moosehead905] * 3
    #17272573 -

Post deleted by tabiyeh

Reason for deletion: Life is lowly anonymity.


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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Moosehead905]
    #17272954 -

penningtons at walmart is 17$ for a 40# bag, with no cracked corn, dirty as fuck though


--------------------
Looking for Wife, please pm me your picture and list of skillz.


I'm wrong all the time, my posts are subject to being wrong at any  point or time, get butt hurt at own risk.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Montock]
    #17273003 -

I get "deluxe blend" from Rural King and it doesn't require any rinsing at all. Water is clean, straight out of the bag. No cracked corn in the mix and only about 2% or less sunflower seeds.

Scott brand Deluxe blend, 20 lb bag, 8$ @ rural king.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: tabiyeh]
    #17278063 -

Liquid_Beef said:
During the soak anything I'm looking for to know that the soak is done... Don't wanna do 24 thinking more is always better when there's a window of perfection lol Great write up


:thanx:
Nothing to look for really, I've done this same process many, many times, after a 12 hour soak or an 18 or 24 hour soak...always comes out great.

Moosehead905 said:
is that coffee you are doing the soak in or just hot water from thecoffee maker?


Coffee, but it's made from grounds that have already been brewed through once.
if you use fresh grounds, make sure it's very weak.
Quote:
tabiyeh said:\This tek is great, can't wait to start working with WBS.


It's really nice to use once you get the process down. So much cheaper than any other grain I've found.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17283870 -

Yeah I ran through two 20lb bags of birdseed with this over the weekend and it scales up nice to if your skilled with google unit convertion lol, Consistantly from what I can tell perfect results so far... Easy way to get my plans into action :thumbup:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Liquid_Beef]
    #17284254 -

Once I get another chance to set-up I am giving this a try. For sure. I screwed up WBS the first time...damn. :mad:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: undeadninja2.1]
    #17284257 -

.


--------------------
:mushroom2::sun::crazy2::leaf:




...once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest places if you look at it right...



:feelsgoatman:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Sham87]
    #17332825 -

Thanks for this tek. I did some jars at the weekend with a 20 min simmer and no coffee and gypsum. Didnt realise you could add at this stage (add gypsum to water when heating coir/verm in water when preparing monotub). This I simmers on too high heat and was borderline boiler, hope if not messed it up! :mad:

Makes a lot of sense your tek and will be trying this one next, will let you know how it goes! Can you use instant coffee for it?

Edited by Chilled (12/04/12 01:36 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Chilled]
    #17381502 -

hehe cool, I finally understand why a lot of guides say to rinse until water runs clear.. your pics have really dirty water in that process.
The WBS bags over here run 100% clear at first rinse hah.

I will try dumping instantly at first sight of simmer (few bubbles?)..
I've been letting it simmer for 1 minute before dumping up to now..
And no matter how many hours I let it dry in colander it never gets completely dry.

But they still colonize without contams though.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: scarfaceofshrooms]
    #17395201 -

Hi,

Just a quick one. Is the point at which the water starts to simmer the second you see a bubble float to top? Is this when you take off heat? I waited until I saw a few around the pot and after emptying it seems that there are loads of creaked seeds and think its no good :mad:

Can you confirm this?




It has a really slimy feel and reckon I almost waited till it was verging on boiling (errors!!)

Next time should I just stop as soon as one bubble comes? Love this tek by the way and will be trying it again (got another in soak already!)


--------------------
Ecuador BRF/PF
Golden Teacher Monotub

Edited by Chilled (12/15/12 01:40 AM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Chilled] * 1
    #17398308 -

Chilled said:
Hi,

Just a quick one. Is the point at which the water starts to simmer the second you see a bubble float to top? Is this when you take off heat? I waited until I saw a few around the pot and after emptying it seems that there are loads of creaked seeds and think its no good :mad:

Can you confirm this?




It has a really slimy feel and reckon I almost waited till it was verging on boiling (errors!!)

Next time should I just stop as soon as one bubble comes? Love this tek by the way and will be trying it again (got another in soak already!)


Looks like you just dumped that, it might get sticky or just dry.
I'm sorry for the delay in responding, how did this WBS turn out?
Since you do have cracked corn, it might ruin it to boil it too hard.
Make sure you toss the grains every ten minutes or so to distribute the moisture :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #17398812 -

I just made my first jars with real WBS. The ones previous, all successful mind you, were the mostly millet type of birdseed. Something I've just started using and has completely changed my mycological life is paint strainers, that can be found at home depot or lowes. They are essentially pantyhose bags, but much stronger. They are great for holding things you'd like submerged in water but dont want spilling everywhere. I prepare my sub and grain in these bags and let me tell you they make everything perfect because you can hang dry them. Try them out for grains at least. Drying is easily done in a bucket. Maybe I'll make a tek for them when I make jars next


--------------------
:awecid::awecid:

Disclaimer: All posts by this user are fictious and outright forgeries of posts and pictures found elsewhere on the Internet. Do not heed any advice or suggestions as they are baseless and without merit. All posts are for entertainment and entertainment alone and should not be confused for fact or truth.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17399794 -

FrankHorrigan said:
Looks like you just dumped that, it might get sticky or just dry.
I'm sorry for the delay in responding, how did this WBS turn out?
Since you do have cracked corn, it might ruin it to boil it too hard.
Make sure you toss the grains every ten minutes or so to distribute the moisture :thumbup:


Thanks for the response mate. Yea I did 10 jars a fortnight ago and all not showing growth but have too many that are cracked and reckon it was too slimy and boiled. The WBS in pic I throw as it was obvious I had made the same error again. :eek:

I have another batch of 5 1L jars out of the pressure cooker soon (only holds 5 but more focused on getting this right before scaling up).

This batch I didnt get to simmer, if had so many problems where I accidently boiled so waited for steam to show and then took of heat. I have read some teks where they skip the heating stage before pressure cooker and so, with the added coffee and gypsum think they will be ok. I will optimise once I am getting in a good routine, as you seem to be! 

I have also brought by spores from a another vendor and I am dubious whether these are the quality of my first vendor. I have 6cc of amazonian spores from orginal vendor and then going to order some more from these as when doing PF tek and starting monotubs, these spores seems to grow in another however many mistakes I made and I am not convinced that this is the same for the 2nd vendor. They arnt big money so think this is the right choice and then experiment with these when I have the tek correct (and hence will know for sure its the spores).

I also think my WBS has cracked seeds in which I am not happy about so going to switch to another supply of that but will do for now. Hopefully will all these changes I will be shrooming again!!!

I'll post pics of the jars before inoculation and be great if you could tell me what you think of them. There were no cracked ones due to heat and got the moisture content exact with your kitchen towel idea in the tek.

(sorry for long post!)


--------------------
Ecuador BRF/PF
Golden Teacher Monotub

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Chilled]
    #17410828 -

Don't know if it'll help anyone but when I used this TEK I got perfect results and one thing i did when I did a little larger batch of WBS is when it comes time to the bring to a simmer I would divide my 20 cups of WBS (picking random numbers) into 3 pots... That way there wasn't 4-5" WBS but 1-2" instead. Or just do smaller batches :smile: lol

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Liquid_Beef]
    #17420977 -

Made a couple minor changes to the OP:

If you are using WBS that contains cracked corn, you do not want to boil at all, period. Simmer, then dump.
If your WBS is free of cracked corn, feel free to boil for a few minutes, it won't get as sticky. About 1-2 minutes boiling is optimal.

Also added that using a blow drier to get the last bit of wet off the grains works and I've been known to cheat like that sometimes :hehehe:

:cheers:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17421336 -

Hey,

Good to hear the changes you got there. I think all the difficulty with WBS for me has been with the heating and just boiling way too much.

I did batch with the WBS removed at the points of just simmering. They were then dried till nothing left on towel when left and then in the PC for 90 mins. 24 hours to cool and then inoculated. I did it without whipping with iso-propanol between flame sterilising as out of it and made the needle stick to the polyfil.

I need to find a supplier of WBS with no cracked corns, as think this is massive disadvantage as would like to simmer for longer.

Anyways, this is my latest attempt. the WBS is a lot harder than any batch I have done before but pretty sure its right RE your tek.





They have had 1cc of amazon spores each and shaken. Will be in a warm place. You think they look ok?


--------------------
Ecuador BRF/PF
Golden Teacher Monotub

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Chilled]
    #17449058 -

Chilled said:




They have had 1cc of amazon spores each and shaken. Will be in a warm place. You think they look ok?


Sorry to be so slow to reply, I read your post while drunk five days ago and totally forgot about it!
The WBS you prepped looks great :thumbup:
However, if you shook after inoculating with a spore syringe, expect slow growth. You only want to shake after 25-40% colonization when inoc'ing from MS. You can shake immediately after inoculation when working with agar or LC or grain to grain.
Any growth yet?


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17471053 -

Thanks for the reply!! I have since done two more batches of 5 and come back after xmas and found no growth at all. These two batches I didnt shake after reading how much of a negative effect this can have...

My tek is so much better than when I started when I got growth all the time and so reckon it is down to the spores. I suddendly got no growth from anything at the end of summer I reckon I have thrown the syringes somewhere they got too hot and so they are useless.

I have ordered new spores and will knock up some more jars when they are here.

I have since read up about g2g transfers and I reckon I will do this in future with a few strains as spores are pissing me off! I have no idea when I damaged them but whenever I used to knock up jars I would see some growth and was careful with inoculation so this is the only thing left to change.

There is no way I have messed up these and so it MUST be the spores. You agree?


--------------------
Ecuador BRF/PF
Golden Teacher Monotub

Edited by Chilled (12/30/12 01:54 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Chilled]
    #17471144 -

If you've had 5 runs of jars from the same spore syringe and none showed growth, it is most certainly the spores.
Get a new syringe and give it a shot again.

However, each drop of your spore solution is going to vary in cleanliness and amount of spores.
It may be easier for you to make an LC out of a couple drops of spore solution (if you are not going to be working with agar)
That way you can test for growth as well as cleanliness before knocking up many WBS jars :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17475232 -

They were from different syringes but same supplier and been kept in same place.

I am going to try and make a LC from them before throwing just to 100% check this (using pint jars and 2 teaspoons of honey put into a PC for 15 mins):

http://www.shroomery.org/10477/Cybers-Liquid-Culture-Tek

Then either I will know for sure, or will have stronger spores to use (once taken from LC).

I will let you know when I finally crack it! Thanks for help and this tek, seems very good!


--------------------
Ecuador BRF/PF
Golden Teacher Monotub

Edited by Chilled (12/31/12 06:13 AM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17764257 -

updated the OP, minor changes and adjustments :thumbup:
I am glad this helps many of you!


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17786625 -

I just found out I can borrow a friends pressure cooker, finally making WBS and option for me.
My question's are these:

1.  will it work as well using MS syringe instead of LC?

2.I have 12 syringes coming in the mail 2 of 6 different types of cubes, I would like to just use one whole syringe each, how many quart jars can I inoculate with 1 syringe?

3. after that I can just do G2G to get more, correct?

4. Am I better off making a LC out of the multi-spore syringes? I have never tried that before, I have done a few BRF tek runs before though, all with 100% success without a pressure cooker, so I feel I'm ready to try these better tek's..

Thanks so much for your time, I'm learning alot from your tek's, Frank. :thumbup:


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17786674 -

woah there! easy tiger!

1 syringe will inoculate 10 quart jars at 1cc each
(assuming 10cc syringes)

MS is fine. you don't need no damn LC.

one step at a time, tiger


--------------------
- endo cabendo

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: MonkeyJesusFresco]
    #17786882 -

Hey I figured out the hard way not to overcook birdseed too!
I thought i'd chime in on the sunflower seeds.

I used to remove them, but randomly I decided to leave them in.  Then I noticed they were the first things to show mycelium growth. (Shiitake LC). On later occasions, I noticed they are consistently the first to show growth (spores) .
Not sure why that is, but I no longer remove them. Maybe naturally occuring nutritious oils or enzymes.


--------------------


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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Oeric McKenna] * 1
    #17786940 -

Ha! My girlfriend asked "What are you doing?"
I replied: "A traditional removal of the sunflower seeds."
Her: "What does that do?"
Me: "Nothing."
Her: "Then why are you doing it?"
Me: "It's tradition."


--------------------
- endo cabendo

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: MonkeyJesusFresco]
    #17786978 -

MonkeyJesusFresco said:
woah there! easy tiger!

1 syringe will inoculate 10 quart jars at 1cc each
(assuming 10cc syringes)

MS is fine. you don't need no damn LC.

one step at a time, tiger


After reading a few teks it seems like LC is on of the easier steps in the process, If I can turn one syringe into 10 using LC it seems like it would be a whole lot more economical, unless it's more productive to skip that step and go straight from multi-spore to G2G?

Again, sorry for all the stupid questions, its jus tI've been doing non stop reading online and here and I finally had to sign up a few days ago to start asking the questions I wasn't able to find clear answers to.

Again, thanks for the help guys! 
:takingnotes:  :sporedrop:


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog] * 1
    #17786998 -

odbsmydog said:
After reading a few teks it seems like LC is on of the easier steps in the process, If I can turn one syringe into 10 using LC it seems like it would be a whole lot more economical, unless it's more productive to skip that step and go straight from multi-spore to G2G?


It is, as there is less risk of failure.

LCs, especially from spores, have an extremely high failure rate, especially with noobs.

LCs are a big waste of time in my opinion, knock up some grain jars with spores, do a couple grain to grain transfers, and be miles ahead of the game.


--------------------
                 
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17787009 -

ugh. do MS. use the entire syringe if you have to. grow. find the best looking fruit body from the first flush (not necessarily the biggest, but the BEST looking, healthiest, well developed) take a tissue sample and clone it on agar; transfer that to a grain jar, then grain to grain to how ever many jars you'd like. LC has a few draw backs, one being if it gets contaminated, ALL of your culture is contaminated.

edit: listen to notahacker!!!!


--------------------
- endo cabendo

Edited by MonkeyJesusFresco (02/12/13 01:01 AM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: MonkeyJesusFresco]
    #17813475 -

So after reading this thread, I'm a little bit confused.  Should I soak for 12 hours, 24 hours, or some other time?  I don't want to end up with ruined WBS my first attempt....

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Cruise1687]
    #17814170 -

yeah, just soak the WBS for 24 hours


--------------------
- endo cabendo

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: MonkeyJesusFresco] * 2
    #17824445 -

I do around 18 hours, then bring the soak water + WBS to a boil & dump immediately.
There's tons of different ways to prep WBS, and, for the most part, they all work.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #17824519 -

TranscendingLife said:
I do around 18 hours, then bring the soak water + WBS to a boil & dump immediately.
There's tons of different ways to prep WBS, and, for the most part, they all work.


:whathesaid:
Anywhere from 12-24 hours is fine.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17824806 -

People always say 12-24 hours, but I think you always want to lean closer to the 24 hour time frame. The reason for the soak is to let the endospores on the grains germinate. Some endospores may germinate as early as 12 hours, but some of the late bloomers will not germinate until closer to the 24 hour mark. The only way to 100% kill them all is to let them germinate than sterilize in a pressure cooker for 90-120 mins. If you have ungerminated endospores on your grain, the pressure cooker will not sterilize them and they will end up germinating after you innoc., contaminating your jar.


--------------------
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Shroomacabra]
    #17824885 -

Shroomacabra said:
People always say 12-24 hours, but I think you always want to lean closer to the 24 hour time frame. The reason for the soak is to let the endospores on the grains germinate. Some endospores may germinate as early as 12 hours, but some of the late bloomers will not germinate until closer to the 24 hour mark. The only way to 100% kill them all is to let them germinate than sterilize in a pressure cooker for 90-120 mins. If you have ungerminated endospores on your grain, the pressure cooker will not sterilize them and they will end up germinating after you innoc., contaminating your jar.


There are always endospores that will survive the PC cycle. However, they take far longer to recover than your myc should take to fully colonize the jar.
I do hundreds of jars for all different species, I've never had a problem with endospores.
I have also let jars just sit uninoculated at 70-75F. It takes a good 2.5-3 months to even start to show signs of bacterial contamination.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

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AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17868790 -

Frank, what did you use for the filter patch on your lids? I made up some metal lids with rtv noc sites, but have just been using new poly fill each round. Going to switch to plastic once I squeeze every bit of life out of the metal ones and I'd like to quit using the poly. Also, is there a reason for red instead of blue rtv?


--------------------
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: ghiajake]
    #17869388 -

ghiajake said:
Frank, what did you use for the filter patch on your lids? I made up some metal lids with rtv noc sites, but have just been using new poly fill each round. Going to switch to plastic once I squeeze every bit of life out of the metal ones and I'd like to quit using the poly. Also, is there a reason for red instead of blue rtv?


I use SFDs that I ordered from the mad season, one of the shroomery sponsors. Basically I just get big SFDs, the biggest size they have, and cut quarter-sized circles out, then I silicone them to the lid with red or grey RTV. Grey RTV is more rigid and seems to adhere better to the plastic IME.

You can use any kind of silicone that can withstand PC temps for your lid. Blue, red, whatever works as long as you can PC it and stick a needle through it :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

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AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17869555 -

RTV is actually not even needed, just regular silicone.

The red RTV stuff peels off real easy for some people, even RR.


--------------------
                 
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #17870397 -

I got the clear and red and I like the red better. As long as you score the lid it shouldn't peel. Score it where the silicone goes =D


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17870431 -

what do you mean by score.

ive herd of this in pottery


--------------------
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http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17728431

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http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17727919

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: King Reishi]
    #17870524 -

Same concept. I drill the hole then I take a piece of sand paper and sand paper the F out of the top of the lid for the filter spot and both top and bottom of the injection spot if you even make one.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17870582 -

So roughing it up would be better to say than to score it, because I thought of scoring a piece of drywall with a knife when I read that. :lol:


--------------------
                 
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #17870606 -

Notahacker420 said:
So roughing it up would be better to say than to score it, because I thought of scoring a piece of drywall with a knife when I read that. :lol:


Same here.


--------------------
How it should & shouldn't look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE

:imo:Lets get rid of the SWIM shit, This also goes for my dog, someones pet ferret, and any other way of saying you are not really you.
Its bullshit and we all know it. Man up and admit you are the SWIM.:2cents:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: shroom-a-zoom]
    #17870871 -

Ok rough up the surfaces lol.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17870909 -

Cool. My blue rtv seemed to work fine (they were out of red). I was planning on ordering some SFDs anyways so... Something I've been doing to rinse my grains is using a dollar store black plastic pail with many small holes drilled in the bottom. Pretty much just a big colander with tiny holes. Set it flat it the sink, let it fill up, swirl it around with a big spoon, drain and repeat til clear. The pail fits perfect in my stock pot, like a double boiler, for soak and heating then just pull it out and drain, shaking every 10 like you said. Then I dump it out on a towel to finish drying.



--------------------
Ghia's Edible/Medicinal Log
Ghia's Easy Outdoor Mushroom Beds
Ghia's Canna-Shroom Chocolates

Edited by ghiajake (02/26/13 07:11 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: ghiajake]
    #17870958 -

I rinse it. Simmer it and put it in a 5 gallon paint strainer. hang that up above my sink and walk away for 30-60 mins come back, load up and finish er up.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17871122 -

I do like the paint strainer idea, zMan. Do you use them for pasteurizing too? Where ya get 'em?


--------------------
Ghia's Edible/Medicinal Log
Ghia's Easy Outdoor Mushroom Beds
Ghia's Canna-Shroom Chocolates

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: ghiajake]
    #17872424 -

I use a mash-ton from my homebrew gear for grain straining and straining straw.
Its a 6 gallon plastic buckey with tons of holes drilled in it. Cheap & easy


--------------------


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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Oeric McKenna]
    #17875616 -

Nah I pasteurize in jars.

You can get them anywhere they carry paint from sherwin williams to home depot to lowes.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17911532 -

Frank, do you have any tips for rye, or can you recommend a good rye grain tek? I have a lot of rye berries and can't afford birdseed.


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17911727 -

odbsmydog said:
Frank, do you have any tips for rye, or can you recommend a good rye grain tek? I have a lot of rye berries and can't afford birdseed.


Use RRs rye berry tek. See my link for signature. If you need more help you can PM me.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17912018 -

Thanks, I'm just waiting on gypsum and tyvek so  I can start. Hopefully I will be able to run any questions I have by you before I start. 5-4-u


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17912891 -

odbsmydog said:
Frank, do you have any tips for rye, or can you recommend a good rye grain tek? I have a lot of rye berries and can't afford birdseed.


Like zMan said, it doesn't get much better than RR's rye prep.
I recently got some rye berries for sclerotia production and I immediately remembered why everyone likes rye more than WBS. So easy to get perfect.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17912984 -

Good looking out, I watched RR's rye vid the other day, I'll probably watch it again when I'm getting ready to start. Just need some damn gypsum and tyvek..


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17913006 -

:thumbup: Nice writeup Frank. I do pretty much the same thing. on the simmer/steep i Leave the water right under boiling I dont want it boiling and let it steep like that for about 10-15 mins stirring and looking for bursted grains, once everything looks hydrated ill sqish a grain to test. Never Preped my own rye but never needed too as this tek and WBS kick ass.


--------------------
“Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: SHROOMYG]
    #17913141 -

I'm new and don't see anywhere what does "LC" and "MS" stand for? thanks

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Hey27]
    #17913150 -

LC=Liquid Culture. MS=Multi Spore.


--------------------
“Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: SHROOMYG]
    #17913469 -

:whathesaid:

Sorry, I usually try to use the full words the first time in my paragraphs and then the abbrvs. I get kinda baked before I post sometimes and forget though... it happens.


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17913564 -

No doubt Frank. Its not "leave it on for 2 mins to long and the WBS is useless" type deal lol


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Liquid_Beef]
    #17918361 -

I'll be using this on my next batch. Fantastic post. Also, what does the coffee do?


--------------------


Fuck the King's Guard. Fuck the city. Fuck the King.
-The Hound

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Kavince]
    #17919131 -

Adds nitrogen I rekon.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17919176 -

It modifies the pH and adds a bit of a nute boost.
Which nutes exactly, i don't know. Nitrogen for sure though.
It speeds colonization along nicely vs no coffee.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #17919339 -

TranscendingLife said:
FrankHorrigan said:
dlaz said:
As with grain, do you simmer for 10 minutes?


No, I dump it as soon as it starts to simmer.
My WBS comes out very sticky when I simmer it like rye, making the batch unusable.


:imwithstupid:

I tried boiling WBS for 7 minutes after an 18 hour soak.
No bueno.


I soak for 20-24 hours..... No rinsing prior.

1 3/4 cup of WBS gives me 3/4 a full liter (once simmered/pressure cooked)

The trick to simmering W.B.S is to bring the water to a gradual boil, start at medium, wait for it to steam and then throw it on max and keep stirring until it bubbles then turn off the heat and let it sit for 10 minutes.

Then its time to rinse the hell out of it with boiling hot tap water.....

But im sure your way works just as well but the "floaters" as people call them, and sunflower seeds all will work just fine once sterilized in a pressure cooker. I do not throw away any wbs, sticks and all go into the jars and I've yet to have a problem.

Just me two cents.


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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: HybridprX]
    #17919420 -

I noticed the same thing about WBS. With rye 1 cup of rye = 1 quart jar. WBS takes significantly more so in the end is it REALLY THAT much cheaper?

I can get a 25 lb bag of rye for $30 and a 20 lb bag of WBS for $8.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17919622 -

Jar for jar, it does save me money to use WBS at 14 per 40# instead of 1.29 per 1# rye.

I did the math once, but I have no idea where my paper is with it :lol:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17919687 -

Perhaps and I haven't used the WBS without the cracked corn but as much PITA as cracked corn is I'd pay double for rye lol.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17919880 -

A really amazing grain is soft white winter wheat. If you try it, you'll be happy you did


--------------------


spread love
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Oeric McKenna]
    #17919966 -

the wbs i get has lots of winter wheat and its 14 bucks for 40 lbs, cant beat it.:thumbup:


--------------------
“Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna

Edited by SHROOMYG (03/08/13 01:58 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: SHROOMYG]
    #17922387 -

Wait, frank, you use coffee in your tek? I thought you were against coffee, or is it just the grounds you didn't like? I plant on soaking my rye in diluted coffee, but should I also add a little diluted coffee to the jars before pasteurizing? Sorry about the Q's I'm going to re-read through this wbd tek again. I'm not sure if you just used the coffee with the rye or with the wbs too.


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17922396 -

ok, reread and saw you do use the coffee as just a pre-soak. Also, I don't have those fancy lids, can I just use tyvek and normal lids with a few holes punched in?  I have some envelopes but I dunno if they are tyvek or not, it doesnt say. they don't seem very breathable. I dont know how I would be able to inject through it and not have a hole?


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17922900 -

Make the lids dude. Its easy & will increase your success and ease of application


--------------------


spread love
love is everything
2013 finds
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Oeric McKenna]
    #17922936 -

make the plastic ones with the silicone? its just I am super broke, maybe after I get a run done I can afford it but I'm pretty muched tapped out right now. I have $3 to my name. I do have a job interview tomorrow, so even if I can't come up on a hustle(I think I'm gonna help a buddy move some outdoor) I should hopefully be getting a paycheck again soon.

Is there a good tek you recommend for making those lids? they do seem like they create a more sterile environment for 'nnockin up grain spawn..

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17923575 -

odbsmydog said:
make the plastic ones with the silicone? its just I am super broke, maybe after I get a run done I can afford it but I'm pretty muched tapped out right now. I have $3 to my name. I do have a job interview tomorrow, so even if I can't come up on a hustle(I think I'm gonna help a buddy move some outdoor) I should hopefully be getting a paycheck again soon.

Is there a good tek you recommend for making those lids? they do seem like they create a more sterile environment for 'nnockin up grain spawn..


The tek is basically this, and I keep meaning to write this up because it would take me like 2 minutes:
Get yourself some lids, metal or plastic. I prefer plastic myself for ease of drilling and sterile work.
I drill a 1/2" hole for my filter and a 1/4" holes for my inoculation port.
Silicone the filter to the lid around the edges of the 1/2" hole.
Then apply a thick bead of silicone to the 1/4" hole and use your fingers to make it into a nice, thick ball.
Let it sit for 24 hours and cure.
Lid complete :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17923638 -

Hell yeah. A forstner bit really helps keep the edges smooth & you could do really small hole for innoc with a nail or 16th bit if you wanted also.  If you can't afford synthetic filters, the ez felt (or most any felt) is pretty damn good too.  I used no name dollar store felt when I started. No problems with it.  So pretty much, if you already have jars, just use the lids that came with them.
  I dare even say that the concept of these jars works so well that you could mostly get away with open air innoculations.  In fact, a red hot needle would melt the white rtv I used to use but the blue rtv handles it like a champ and sticks to both plastic & metal quite well also.

  In summary, these lids ARE THE SHIT.


--------------------


spread love
love is everything
2013 finds
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Oeric McKenna]
    #17923669 -

Peeps should try just throwing hard-boiling water onto their grains in a bucket/tub, like newbs do with coir brick "bucket tek"

After 8 hours they're simply strained well and loaded into jars/containers for 24hrs of bacterial endospore germination, then PC'd….

Perfect every time, not as leached-out of nutrients, or wily hydration which needs surface drying as if boiled.

Doesn't matter which grain you use. WBS needs a bit less time after pour like 6-9 hours, Rye 8-12 hours, corn 12-20 hours


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Oeric McKenna]
    #17923853 -

Oeric McKenna said:
Hell yeah. A forstner bit really helps keep the edges smooth & you could do really small hole for innoc with a nail or 16th bit if you wanted also.  If you can't afford synthetic filters, the ez felt (or most any felt) is pretty damn good too.  I used no name dollar store felt when I started. No problems with it.  So pretty much, if you already have jars, just use the lids that came with them.
  I dare even say that the concept of these jars works so well that you could mostly get away with open air innoculations.  In fact, a red hot needle would melt the white rtv I used to use but the blue rtv handles it like a champ and sticks to both plastic & metal quite well also.

  In summary, these lids ARE THE SHIT.


So you think the blue is better than the white/red? 

If I start out using ez felt or filter disks, do I just poke through them with the syringe to inoculate them?


Thanks again for the help frank, if you do make a lid tek with pics that would be awesome, but I think I get the jest of what your saying. I wish IK could afford some silicone... oh well, maybe in the future when I by petris and order stuff for agar I will order a few plastic lids/filter disks.


--------------------
"Eternity is an awful long time to wait, especially near the end" - Woody Allen
"it's like that drug trip in that movie I saw when I was on that drug trip!" - Phillip J. Fry

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: odbsmydog]
    #17924335 -

I just got the blue because it was what they had at Ace hardware. Definitely better than the white I previously tried in both adhesion & melt resistance. Haven't used the red so idk .
If you're planning on stabbing thru the filter just make a small injector port. This "tek" has already been laid out many times. Look up transcending life's lid tek. It's the same thing.


--------------------


spread love
love is everything
2013 finds
medicinal psilocybin tincture drops
cannabis pics

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Oeric McKenna]
    #17924385 -

regular clear window silicon can witstand heats up to 500 degrees so no need to buy the exspensive stuff IMO


--------------------
“Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: SHROOMYG]
    #17924405 -

RR keeps reiterating that same idea but the rtv works so damn good I just won't change a thing at this point. I do believe it's true tho


--------------------


spread love
love is everything
2013 finds
medicinal psilocybin tincture drops
cannabis pics

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Oeric McKenna]
    #17924490 -

:grin: right on man whatever works, I used the regular on my lids and worked out great didnt lose 1 jar out of 2 cases.


--------------------
“Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: SHROOMYG]
    #17924768 -

I use the clear silicone. No problem as long as you rough up the surface on plastic lids.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17940060 -

Can I load the WBS into 300/370 mL jars? Would there be a problem with inoculation? My PC is only 4,5L.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #17940071 -

so sterilize in small jars transfer to big jars and steam sterilize a second round. just a thought


--------------------
It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

I'M A MEMBER FIRST, TC WHEN NEEDED AND MOD WHEN I HAVE TO BE !!!

Edited by cronicr (03/11/13 06:51 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: cronicr]
    #17941314 -

You certainly can, just make sure to not load more than 2/3-3/4 full. You'll need to be able to break up the grains :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #17943087 -

And what should the Substrate:Spawn ratio be?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #17943441 -

Netinterspac said:
And what should the Substrate:Spawn ratio be?


Whatever your heart desires.

The more spawn the quicker it will colonize.


--------------------
                 
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #17944016 -

You can, it will be just a ton more shaking lol.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #17944100 -

Nice, I've found some 0,5 liter jars, bought 7 of them.

I've been looking for WBS, but I've been having trouble. I find food for all types of birds, so many variety I don't know which to chose!

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #17944275 -

If you have a walmart by you this is the stuff you want. No cracked corn!

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Pennington-Seed-Wild-Bird-Ration-20lb/17256228

It may come in a clear bag but it will have economy mix and you should be able to tell if there is no cracked corn inside if the bag is clear.


However even if it has cracked corn it is not the end of the world you can still use it just fine just DONT BOIL it, rather simmer it until it is about to boil.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17948401 -

zMan said:
If you have a walmart by you this is the stuff you want. No cracked corn!

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Pennington-Seed-Wild-Bird-Ration-20lb/17256228

It may come in a clear bag but it will have economy mix and you should be able to tell if there is no cracked corn inside if the bag is clear.


However even if it has cracked corn it is not the end of the world you can still use it just fine just DONT BOIL it, rather simmer it until it is about to boil.


I found one that says that's for "indigenous birds" that must be it, right?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #17949399 -



--------------------
“Plants are the missing link in the search to understand the human mind and its place in nature.” - Terrence McKenna

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: SHROOMYG]
    #17949684 -

Yes, I wish I could find that, but I live in Europe and this was the only different thing I found. There was food for parrots, canaries,  those colorful birds, ...

Tomorrow I'm going to an old shop that specializes in birds, maybe I'll find food that says "Wild" instead of indigenous.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #17950173 -

as long as it has millet in it you will be ok. Avoid cracked corn but you don't have to. You can also try getting rye berries, they are much easier to work with.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17950239 -

I have yet to find a bag of bird seed/feed that DID NOT have the ingredients listed on it.

Every one I've ever looked at had an ingredient list somewhere on it.

Just my personal experience in USA


--------------------
The Basics
A little civility goes a long way
The Noob Forum
The Hammock Hangers' Forum

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17950815 -

zMan said:
as long as it has millet in it you will be ok. Avoid cracked corn but you don't have to. You can also try getting rye berries, they are much easier to work with.


So, even if it's 100% millet it's alright?

I think this one has millet, at least it looks like it does... Brown seeds, bege seeds. black seeds, ... for european finches.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #17955240 -

Yes should be fine. As long as its not super pricey just test it out.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17969268 -

Ok, so I have the bird seeds in the strainer.

My bird seed has a lot of black and brown seeds, I think they are other types of millet. No problem, right?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #17969632 -

Sounds alright to me.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17969742 -

Nice, but after almost 2 hours it's still wet on the outside...

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #17969903 -

When you run your hand through the grains does it come out with water on your skin? If not you should be good, if there is an abundance of water then lay them out of newspaper or a beach towel.


--------------------
Information for everyone: http://www.mushroomvideos.com
Are your grains or spawn clean? CLICK THIS CHECKLIST

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: zMan]
    #17969967 -

I don't get much water on my hands, but the grains stick!

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Netinterspac]
    #18080676 -

Netinterspac said:
Can I load the WBS into 300/370 mL jars? Would there be a problem with inoculation? My PC is only 4,5L.


I don't see any reason why you couldn't do this in smaller jars, just means less spawn to play with at the end up if you just do more jars and/or using a lower spawn:bulk ratio like 1:2 when you come to birth them in tubs/trays, just will take longer to colonise.


--------------------
Ecuador BRF/PF
Golden Teacher Monotub

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Chilled] * 1
    #18080869 -

Chilled said:
Netinterspac said:
Can I load the WBS into 300/370 mL jars? Would there be a problem with inoculation? My PC is only 4,5L.


I don't see any reason why you couldn't do this in smaller jars, just means less spawn to play with at the end up if you just do more jars and/or using a lower spawn:bulk ratio like 1:2 when you come to birth them in tubs/trays, just will take longer to colonise.


It's the truth! :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18166083 -

I updated the OP a bit today, added offending objects section :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18230352 -

Frank thank you so much for your guides, btw. They have been extremely helpful in getting me on the right track. My first attempt was just terrible but following your guides made my 2nd attempt so, so much better.

Quick question for you. Do you use a pint of coffee per 4 cups of dry seeds or do you use a pint of coffee no matter the amount of seeds?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: itriedtoquit]
    #18230396 -

it's per the 4 cups :thumbup:


--------------------
have a look at my grow.

"genius by day, junkie by night"

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: fungitarian]
    #18230409 -

Got it, thanks!

In the middle of prepping some seeds. Was hoping for a quick response from someone lol.:thumbup::thumbup:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18429413 -

Do I leave the foil on the lids of my jars after inoculation since im just using a regular lid with four holes in it

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: jmoney757]
    #18429421 -

jmoney757 said:
Do I leave the foil on the lids of my jars after inoculation since im just using a regular lid with four holes in it


:awkwardconfusion:


--------------------
It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

I'M A MEMBER FIRST, TC WHEN NEEDED AND MOD WHEN I HAVE TO BE !!!

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: jmoney757]
    #18431754 -

jmoney757 said:
Do I leave the foil on the lids of my jars after inoculation since im just using a regular lid with four holes in it


You have to have a GE filter of some sort.
PF tek lids do not work for this tek.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #18431809 -

:whathesaid:

I actually just pm'd him about this, I didn't realize he also posted the question here :lol:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18471918 -

Hey Frank, I believe I got the same brand of WBS as you. Does yours have what appears to be little rocks in it?  I thought this was burned/burst grains at first but I think its just little pebbles.  I don't think its a problem, j/w.


--------------------

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: thundahoof]
    #18472113 -

It's calcium carbonate :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18472352 -

OK cool thanks.  Couple more questions if you would please, sorry if it's been covered here.  I know you said you can just use a blow dryer, can or shouldn't I just sit the grain in front of a fan?  Or would this dry them out too much.

Also, I remember ( I think it was you) you saying you used a lot (like 50/50) and  strong coffee in your rye soak.  Do you use less/weaker in wbs?  If so why?  I just used 2 one cup packets of instant in 8 cups worth this time.  Thanks for all the help, I've been through a couple bags of rye, but just now starting wbs.


--------------------

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) *DELETED* [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18546474 -

Post deleted by JPDancer

Reason for deletion: .



--------------------

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: JPDancer]
    #18548467 -

Yes, it will totally ruin your moisture content. Rinse before the soak, never after.

The heat from the simmering water "steams" the exterior of the grains dry. You can only shake so much moisture off the surface.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18549752 -

Wish I would have saw this before I made my jars and inoculated this morning. I used Doc's tek, didnt call for gypsum or coffee. I bet my colonization would have been a lot faster had I used the gypsum at least. Bookmarked for next time. :thumbup:

FrankHorrigan said:
Yes, it will totally ruin your moisture content. Rinse before the soak, never after.

The heat from the simmering water "steams" the exterior of the grains dry. You can only shake so much moisture off the surface.


Great. Doc's tek said to rinse with cold water after simmering so I did. These old teks should be deleted! :sad:

Edited by bEelzeBosS (07/12/13 05:06 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: bEelzeBosS]
    #18551654 -

I have used docs WBS tek since 2004 without problems. Im not sure about using Gypsum or Coffee, in the WBS, as I have been on growing hiatus. Im interested on how this works, but I still would't discount those "Old Teks", they are the foundation of what we know today!


--------------------
Though you can't go back and make a new beginning. You can start today to make a new end.

Traveller, there is no path, paths are made by walking

If Jesus was jewish...Why does he have a mexican name??

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: oddiseus]
    #18611967 -

During inoculation, do I need to have a glove box or is it ok without?

Also, can I use folgers instant coffee? how many teaspoons?


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18612372 -

mthawkins said:
During inoculation, do I need to have a glove box or is it ok without?

Also, can I use folgers instant coffee? how many teaspoons?


You need to do all your work with sterile media, grains included, inside a still air box.

And I would not use instant coffee nor do I have any recommendation on how much to use.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18613832 -

Why is my WBS frothy like this after only 20 hours :\ can I still use it?


--------------------
TEKs I like
Trade list (inc)


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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: jkz]
    #18613835 -

Looks like you could have done a better job at rinsing them.

Yes you can still use it.


--------------------
                 
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #18613853 -

Okay good. The water was as clear as the tap water I used tho, maybe something in my water?

And that's good. I just got home from work and didn't want to have to start another batch of this stuff.
Thanks, yet again, Hacker.


--------------------
TEKs I like
Trade list (inc)


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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: jkz]
    #18613857 -

The water will typically get "dingy looking" during the saok, but mine never gets that bad.

Mine gets to be a nasty rust color and that's it.

Just rinse them a little better next time, that's all.

I like to keep them in a big pot under the faucet and stir them, dumping off the water until it dumps off clear.

My WBS is really dirty, so usually takes 10-15 minutes of filling the pot, stirring and dumping.


--------------------
                 
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***

Edited by PussyFart (07/26/13 09:24 AM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #18614041 -

Yeah, I agree, mine takes a lot of rinsing too.

If the water ran clear though, the water ran clear :thumbup:

I agree, you can use them jkz.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18615647 -

FrankHorrigan said:
mthawkins said:
During inoculation, do I need to have a glove box or is it ok without?

Also, can I use folgers instant coffee? how many teaspoons?


You need to do all your work with sterile media, grains included, inside a still air box.

And I would not use instant coffee nor do I have any recommendation on how much to use.



Alright. I was under the impression that glove box and sterilization wasn't needed when doing this with the pasteurized bulk method too (other than the needle.)

Any links on a suggested way to inoculate? and how to make a glove box?


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

Edited by mthawkins (07/26/13 03:42 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18615657 -

You can spawn to pasteurized bulk substrate in open air.

You need to prepare all of your grains and cultures under aseptic conditions like in a SAB regardless though.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18615702 -

Is there a way where I can avoid needed a glove box? Possibly clothless after a shower, sterilize the air and working area, gloves?
I'm using this tek for jar lids if it matters: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10628004#10628004


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18615744 -

You can prepare and sterilize your jars without one, but inoculating them in open air is totally different.

You can expect some success and a lot of failure without one.

This is one area you should not cut corners, inoculating grains and such.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18615892 -

Wouldn't a flame sterilized needed with self healing lids be as safe as a dry verm layer on pf cakes? Or are you specifically referring to G2G transfers and such.


--------------------
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: jkz]
    #18616555 -

It would be about as safe risky to inoculate cakes in open air as it is grains.

Sorry man, you won't find a way around this answer from me :shrug:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18617775 -

After inoculation where should I store the jars? Would a closet be ok? For how long, usually?


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18618522 -

mthawkins said:
After inoculation where should I store the jars? Would a closet be ok? For how long, usually?


On a shelf in room temperature getting ambient/indirect light until they are fully colonized.


--------------------
                 
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #18619094 -

Just wanted to share something I tried and see what you thought about it Frank.

Ive been following this tek for my last 3 WBS preps but the last one I skipped the simmering part. After my 24 soak I drained, rinsed one more time, then let it drain for an hour shaking occasionally. After PC 90 minutes I filed my jars, g2g, and they have been colonizing just as well as the ones I simmered...maybe even a little faster. Do you think the simmering step is really necessary?

Edited by bEelzeBosS (07/27/13 10:06 AM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: bEelzeBosS] * 1
    #18619102 -

I do think it is necessary if you want proper moisture content consistently.

Moisture content that is off will still work as long as it isn't too bad.

But there is only so much water that can fall off or be shaken off the exterior of the grains due to molecular cohesion.

Steaming them dry is the most effective and quick way to achieve proper moisture content IMO.:thumbup:

PS. Never rinse the grains after the soak, you are washing off all of the beneficial gypsum that they are coated with :shake:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18645402 -

I read somewhere that when inoculating 1 quart WBS 2.5cc would be ok, is that right? Also, is there a certain amount of time you can leave them alone after the jar is fully colonized without it getting ruined?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: jackalope9517]
    #18669460 -

do you soak in hot water...or cold water?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: eelrd72]
    #18669541 -

Cold tap water is fine.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: winstonbox]
    #18672271 -

Can I use polyfill and a rtv port for jar lids ? Do I need to tape the polyfill before pc, or will it be ok?


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18672376 -

jackalope9517 said:
I read somewhere that when inoculating 1 quart WBS 2.5cc would be ok, is that right? Also, is there a certain amount of time you can leave them alone after the jar is fully colonized without it getting ruined?


1 quart should only need .5cc of spore solution or 1-2cc of liquid culture. And you can leave them for a few days after full colonization but I would use them ASAP. No need to consolidate them or anything.

eelrd72 said:
do you soak in hot water...or cold water?


Hot water.

winstonbox said:
Cold tap water is fine.


I use hot water to start every soak because I am trying to get a nice bacterial bloom in there before sterilizing. Cold water does not encourage this like hot or room-temp water does.

mthawkins said:
Can I use polyfill and a rtv port for jar lids ? Do I need to tape the polyfill before pc, or will it be ok?


Stuff the poly as tight as you can possibly stuff it and it will work fine as a filter. Just put foil over your lids before PC'ing.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18672490 -

Thanks frank.
I just made a booboo. Washed my seeds after simmer.. Realized I shouldn't do that and now I'm just letting it sit in the strainer


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18672573 -

I accidentally got water all over a batch once, while it was in the strainer.

I cheated, I filled a pot back up with water, put the grains back in, and brought to a simmer then dumped and let it steam. It worked :shrug:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18672589 -

Ok that's what I'll do.. Let resimmer


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18672603 -

I've also cheated with a blowdryer on low, but you risk drying your grains out more that way...not ideal :lol:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18672627 -

Hoping my gypsum didn't go to waste :frown:


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18672633 -

It did.

Throw a handful into your new soak water. Problem solved.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18672641 -

Meh, I already removed the pot from the stove top and poured the wbs into my strainer. Bit topple I'd assume ?


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18672644 -

Don't worry about it in that case, it's not a huge deal.

Shake your jars when they are still hot (a few hours after PC'ing) to make sure they don't clump up.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18672908 -

Frank, if I go with WBS do I shake the jars like I would rye to avoid clumping??

Edited by Magicman69 (08/07/13 11:36 AM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Magicman69]
    #18672914 -

Like every day

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18673217 -

One more oops..
For some reason my 9 cups of dry wbs only = like 3
Quart jars. Can I leave the wbs in the jars (without using pc yet) over night while I soak up more goodies? Or should I pc this stuff and leave it out while I make more ?


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18673251 -

Magicman69 said:
Frank, if I go with WBS do I shake the jars like I would rye to avoid clumping??


If you are using a spore syringe to inoculate, you only need to shake the jars once at 20-30% colonized :thumbup:

mthawkins said:
One more oops..
Can I leave the wbs in the jars (without using pc yet) over night while I soak up more goodies? Or should I pc this stuff and leave it out while I make more ?


Either way will be fine.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18675547 -

i rinsed the wbs..in cold water...cause thats what the tek said...wasnt sure about the soak...because tek left that out. I assumed needed some heat to get stuff going...brought to a simmer...which i am also assuming that means just short of a boil..then back it down ...for 10 minutes..did the shake..was plenty of steam...for about 30 minutes. I am pcing them as I type. Going to post this other pic..or Rye..inoculate 5 days ago..today..freakin contaminate.....web stuff...i had that on tray that was in same incubator...is it possible i get the contaminate..from the incubator...or Im thinkin these lids are contaminated....cant remember if i boiled them all..

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: eelrd72]
    #18677406 -

Wbs after simmer is a little sticky, but not bad. Just feels like a little sticky coating.
Might be gypsum ?  Is that ok ?


--------------------
“Never laugh at live dragons.”
- J.R.R Tolkien

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mthawkins]
    #18711893 -

if i have no gypsum will this still work?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: nepter627]
    #18712194 -

also could i use the regular metal lids with tyvek and a self healing inoc. point on top of the tyvek?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: dlaz]
    #18852570 -

when you say "9-10 cups of dry WBS equals 7-10 hydrated WBS quart jars " do you mean full measuring cup?


just couldnt imagine any brand of seed measured out to be 1 cup turn to 400 to 600ml of seed.


--------------------
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: nepter627]
    #18853508 -

The cup measure pictured holds 2.5 cups when brimming.

So I use it as a scoop.

4 scoops = 10 cups = 8-10 jars of hydrated WBS.

It's been my golden ratio for quite some time now.

mthawkins said:
Wbs after simmer is a little sticky, but not bad. Just feels like a little sticky coating.
Might be gypsum ?  Is that ok ?


Should be fine if it is a little sticky, that is normal. Just make sure there are not huge chunks after being PC'd.

nepter627 said:
if i have no gypsum will this still work?


Yes, it may be a little stickier though.

nepter627 said:
also could i use the regular metal lids with tyvek and a self healing inoc point on top of the tyvek?


Yep.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #18891053 -

Notahacker420 said:
So roughing it up would be better to say than to score it, because I thought of scoring a piece of drywall with a knife when I read that. :lol:



Scoring is exactly what you thought it was. It seems that there isn't a universal word for what they wanted done. Abrasion would be the closest thing however I am not sure if that properly would translate into other languages.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: jkz]
    #18891111 -

bought my WBS today, and will be ready to get it prepared soon. I still have the option to return it, but the pressure cooker I got was only 10 psi, but every guide seems to mention 15 psi. If I just PC for an extra 20 minutes or so, you think I'll be good? I'd rather not have to return this PC, long story short it's the only one I could find in my area that wasn't overpriced as shit. If possible I'd like to keep this cheap PC for now, then save my money to buy an actual nice one in the future. I don't have the money to spend on a nice PC right now, and I'd rather not waste money on a mid-tier one either.


--------------------

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Hazanko]
    #18893703 -

Quote:
10 psi will be fine to sterilize grains. Just go two hours. RR


yes


--------------------
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great links:
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: j3rk0ff]
    #18994675 -

Not saying its the right way, but just wanted to point out Ive been using this tek but skipping the simmering step for the last couple months and haven't had any problems. My WBS has plenty of moisture just from the 24 hour soak, and my colonization times haven't suffered at all.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: bEelzeBosS]
    #18994695 -

chaotic646 said:
Not saying its the right way, but just wanted to point out Ive been using this tek but skipping the simmering step for the last couple months and haven't had any problems. My WBS has plenty of moisture just from the 24 hour soak, and my colonization times haven't suffered at all.


That works if you don't end up with wet grains. The main reason to simmer is so the excess water can "steam" off the grains in the strainer. There is only so much that will drip off on its own.

A 5-10 minute simmer can also puff your grains up a bit, these colonize better IMO. But you risk bursting a lot of grains and releasing starches if you are not careful. Millet is especially prone to bursting quickly under a rolling boil.

If it is working for you, by all means continue on :wink:

I just prefer a simmer myself.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #18994763 -

That's why I stopped, because no matter how "short" I simmered, and how much I stirred, the bottom of the pot always had a bunch of gooey popped grains. I leave my lids loose when I pressure cook too, maybe the excess moisture is steaming out then? Not sure but everything is working great.

How is that gym you found growing on the door coming along? Have you tried to grow it out yet?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19111559 -

I just started my first WBS soak today. I'm converting from rye berries.


--------------------
The Basics
A little civility goes a long way
The Noob Forum
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #19118595 -

:bananadance:

You're gonna love it.

As to where I am...it's almost time to head home for Frank.

But I'm hesitant to leave until harvest time has past :volcano:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19165240 -

Read through the thread and saw the quick discussion about the plastic lids. The plastic lids I use do not create an airtight seal with the jar, and this inlet/outlet of unfiltered air has kept me from using them on my WBS jars.

Do you have the same non-gasket lids, or are your lids air/water tight?

And is this air exchange so negligible that it's not something I should worry about in regards to contaminations during colonization?

I use SFD for GE and injectable rubber stoppers for injecting spores. I have plastic lids on my LC's and only because they have a separate rubber gasket under the plastic lid to create that seal. Looking to use more plastic lids without the use of a gasket. If you have time to get back to me I would appreciate it. Just recently switched from rye grain to WBS and wish I would have sooner. Awesome write-up, thanks for spreading the knowledge.


--------------------
Happy growing!

Edited by BL00MERS (11/20/13 01:18 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: BL00MERS]
    #19172914 -

:thanx:

I tried rubber gaskets once, hated them :shake:

I've never, ever had an issue with using the plastic lids with no gasket. This is for grains and LC.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19177123 -

Thanks for the input, Frank

I am also not a fan of those gasket and can finally make the box of plastic lids in the garage useful.


--------------------
Happy growing!

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: BL00MERS]
    #19177136 -

I have a box like that :wink:



--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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You should take a look. :hehehe:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425105 -

Thank you FrankY!  :asianofapproval:
I'm thinking of just running under my faucet on high that water is well over 150F .


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
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See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

Edited by mister brown 420 (01/15/14 10:35 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425285 -

mister brown 420 said:
Thank you franks!  :asianofapproval:
I'm thinking of just running under my faucet mon high that water is well over 150F .


To get them steaming after the soak?

You'll rinse all your gypsum off and they won't heat very evenly (at all). Bring it to a simmer :wink:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425295 -

Yea I didn't acquire gypsum until after they were already soaking...
But I will just simmer them I'm scared of bursting them.. :lol: :windowtantrum:


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
7/7/2014
See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425321 -

Why? They don't burst unless you boil them.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425328 -

Alright I'll admit its all the horror stories I've read, I don't want bird seed oatmeal.. I just switched to birdseed from popcorn.

Ill quit being a puss :lol:


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
7/7/2014
See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425335 -

Will adding the gypsum now do any thing?:mygoditsfullofstars:

P.S. It wasn't my choice on not getting Gypsum until today just for the record! :godfuckingdammit: Shitty service at hardware store :oldman2:


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
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See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

Edited by mister brown 420 (01/15/14 10:38 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425349 -

Oh yeah, just add it before you simmer. You'll be stirring a few times anyhow, it'll all break up just fine.

Bring it to a simmer, where it's starting to bubble regularly and there's a decent amount of steam. Then dump and strain and shake it up a couple times while it's steaming.

It'll be fine, I promise :wink:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425356 -

2 Tbs For 8.5 cups wbs?


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
7/7/2014
See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425361 -

Bah, just grab a big handful and toss it in :thumbup:

I haven't measured gypsum in over a year.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425376 -

lol I like your style


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
7/7/2014
See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425380 -

:smilingpuppy:

Gypsum is pretty easy to work with, you don't need a whole lot (a handful is perfect) but if you use too much, it won't hurt anything.

Pot of grains? Handful of gypsum.
Brick of coir? Handful of gypsum.
Bag of casing material? You guessed it, handful of gypsum.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425567 -

I added it! I went until I saw a ring of simmer sized bubbles!  Unfortunately the gypsum was like a gritty paste on the bottom of the pan :lol:


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
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See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425577 -

You should stir it before you dump :lol:

Don't worry, there is still a bunch left on the grains.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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You should take a look. :hehehe:

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AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425616 -

I gave it the stirring of a life time throughout the whole ordeal.. :lol:
Thanks again Frank! they didn't bust.
I never gave em' a chance to! :jah:


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
7/7/2014
See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425627 -

Then that's just excess gypsum, I always end up with some too :thumbup:

Let them finish steaming, then jar them up. Probably take an hour at most.

Shake the strainer after every couple of jars you load, this will distribute the moisture better. The bottom of the strainer will be more wet than the rest, but just give it a shake and don't worry about it :awesomenod:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425658 -

Ya it's my first time.. :slowreaction: with gypsum.


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
7/7/2014
See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425662 -

FrankHorrigan said:
The bottom will be more wet than the rest, but just give it a shake and don't worry about it :awesomenod:


That's :whatshesaid:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19425684 -

:somefunnyshit: Man! :lol:


--------------------
Estoy perdido y no me importa'
deje que se vaya y que sea.
hay amor.
Last on
7/7/2014
See you space cowboy!
:asianofapproval:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19425751 -

:ducklol:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: twistedty]
    #19425822 -

twistedty said:
:ducklol:


Oh my god, that has to be new. There is no way I've missed that graem for this long :lmafo:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19527195 -

Lid complete :thumbup:


FrankHorrigan said:
odbsmydog said:
make the plastic ones with the silicone? its just I am super broke, maybe after I get a run done I can afford it but I'm pretty muched tapped out right now. I have $3 to my name. I do have a job interview tomorrow, so even if I can't come up on a hustle(I think I'm gonna help a buddy move some outdoor) I should hopefully be getting a paycheck again soon.

Is there a good tek you recommend for making those lids? they do seem like they create a more sterile environment for 'nnockin up grain spawn..


The tek is basically this, and I keep meaning to write this up because it would take me like 2 minutes:
Get yourself some lids, metal or plastic. I prefer plastic myself for ease of drilling and sterile work.
I drill a 1/2" hole for my filter and a 1/4" holes for my inoculation port.
Silicone the filter to the lid around the edges of the 1/2" hole.
Then apply a thick bead of silicone to the 1/4" hole and use your fingers to make it into a nice, thick ball.
Let it sit for 24 hours and cure.
Lid complete :thumbup:


So if I'm using these lids for this or a rye tek no aluminum foil is required during pc?


--------------------
**MY TRADE LIST**

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: ayemoner]
    #19530597 -

Correct! They are the best, I've been using the same ones for almost two years now.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19541761 -

5 :mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2: to you Frank. Thanks for your great write ups!


--------------------
How Frank gets shit done (link list) bulk sub vs casings 
NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE  Mushroom Cultivation Guide V1.0

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19542259 -

You should try this out sometime to dry your grain:



It's a mesh sweater drying rack. You can stack 'em, too. I used to shake, but I've found this to be quicker and much less of a pain in the ass.:thumbup:


--------------------
Disclaimer: This post is a work of fiction, provided for entertainment purposes only. Any resemblance to actual persons or events, past or present, is strictly coincidental. All celebrity voices are impersonated. If you begin your ID request with, "I just ate a bunch of these mushrooms…should I not have done that?" I'm just gonna sit back and watch Darwin at work.:mushroom2:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: BittrBuffalo]
    #19542282 -

I used a mesh bag from a home brew store :thumbup: those are cool too.


--------------------
How Frank gets shit done (link list) bulk sub vs casings 
NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE  Mushroom Cultivation Guide V1.0

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: mister brown 420]
    #19542342 -

Gonna be trying this one soon :smile:. Ive been doing wbs with cracked corn until now. Looking forward to trying the corn free. I got the exact same "brand" as pictured in your tek Frank. Im glad I read through all of the posts in this thread though cause your tek doesnt say twice brewed coffee.

Couple quick questions. First i dry mine by laying out on window screens with 20" box fans underneath blowing air up through till none sticks to my hand after being squeezed. DO you forsee any problem with that with your recipe?

Does pelletized or powdered gypsum matter for this or your coir tek? Actually having trouble finding pelletized. I assume not for this but more unsure about coir if only for the difficulty of even mixing.

Anyways man. Thanks in advance for the response and another big thanks for all the teks. I follow almost all of them now from wbs prep to substrate prep and pasteurization :smile:. Just getting into agar, ordered the stuff for pastyplates, but I like the looks of your slant tek too :jah:

Edited by Valyr (02/09/14 01:23 AM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Valyr]
    #19661178 -

Hello people, I've been searching the forums for an answer but can't seem to find Any info. I followed your wbs tek and was pc'ing my I pt jars. I put tyvek around the jars and also foil over them, I usually don't put the metal lid with holes on them and just have tyvek the ban and foil over but this time I forgot to remove the metal lid with holes in them. My question is, do u guys think my jars will be ok or should i re-pc it?

Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance.
Fat

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FatJack]
    #19661256 -

If you have lid, tyvek, band. Then you are fine.

If you just have a lid with no filter, then you have to redo them with a filter on.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: magickspore]
    #19661410 -

Ok Kool, thx for the prompt reply. Greatly appreciate it

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FatJack]
    #19680992 -

I'm want to give this tek a try for the first time, would it hurt anything to start out with hot water.  It appears that you start with cold water right?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: invitro]
    #19681064 -

hot water kicks ass


--------------------
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: cronicr]
    #19681117 -

I rinse with cold water and soak them in hot :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19681330 -

http://www.themadseason.com/90mm-Liquid-Culture-Jar-Lid-Wide-Mouth-Jars-p/3003.htmso this lid will work right? and no need for foil right? or should I make my own? Are these really reusable hundreds of times


--------------------

Edited by tombosley8 (03/11/14 03:30 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: tombosley8]
    #19681345 -

not for grains, not enough gas exchange there for lc's


--------------------
It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

I'M A MEMBER FIRST, TC WHEN NEEDED AND MOD WHEN I HAVE TO BE !!!

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: tombosley8]
    #19681348 -

That lid is for LCs, it would restrict too much GE for grains.


--------------------
                 
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT!
A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD,
SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List,
EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
*** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: PussyFart]
    #19681408 -

:whathesaid: :whathesaid:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19681428 -

ok cool thanks so would the bead of silicone would replace having to put the ship on? In other words is a ball of the red rtv over a hole just as good as a port i would buy and glue in? And last as long? looks like rr just slips the ship in without even gluing?


--------------------

Edited by tombosley8 (03/11/14 03:47 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: tombosley8]
    #19681434 -

Yep :thumbup:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19681449 -

Thanks sounds easy enough you saved me a headache figuring that all  out. three very easily obtainable supplies sounds perfect


--------------------

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: tombosley8]
    #19685810 -

So the WBS has soaked for 22 hours or so.  I looked up the definition of simmer and came up with something like 200F-205F, or just before boiling.  I noticed that bubbles started to come up rapidly at 170F
so I dumped it 195F or so because I really don't want to ruin the grains.  When you say simmer do you mean wait for bubbles or do you mean wait for 200F, I don't think I'm splitting hairs here either because 30F is a big difference especially since you say there is a danger of ruining the WBS if you let it "boil", if boiling means going past the point of where bubbles rapidly rise then I guess I went past.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: invitro]
    #19685849 -

the bubbles were from the WBS not the water. Simmering you'll just barely hear the tinging ping noise and maybe a bubble or two and its 200-205 ish 212 is boiling.


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: bodhisatta]
    #19690958 -

I pretty much stuck to the tek except I didn't pre-rinse at all.  I have a bunch of jars with no clumping, I can shake them just fine and I waited until 12 hours after I took them out of the pc.  I never rinsed my rye either when I did rye and never ever had clumping issues.  Not only it is easier not to rinse but that rinse water contains some sugars from the grains. 

The stock pot smelled pretty rank (sour bacterial smell) after the 22 hour soak, but that's typical IME.

I just popped open a jar that I pced last night to squeeze the grains.  The millet and wheat are Al Dante but the sorghum sure isn't.  It's really pretty hard, not as hard as fresh sorghum but it's way off from Al Dante.

I just opened another jar (still hot) from another batch and the sorghum was 80-90% Aldante with a few hard ones.

I just opened a third jar from a 3rd batch and the sorgum was in-between in terms of hardness.  I could get my finger nail to split the grain but only with serious force.  Not as hard as the first batch but still not Al Dante.  Al Dante to me means slight resistance.  This was clearly more than slight resistance.  The wheat is so soft that it's not offering any resistance.

I started with hot water in a 22 quart presto PC and put the whole bag of WBS in, 20 lbs, after the water was hot, probably near 170F. 

Edited by invitro (03/13/14 02:29 PM)

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: invitro]
    #19805325 -

Well I started my first bulk grow today and my WBS is soaking now.  Props to Cronicr for leading me to all your links Frank.  I didn't have gypsum to soak with the WBS but there is coffee soaking with it.  I was curious about tomorrow though.  I have my syringes ready from SporeWorks but I am a bit intimidated by which lids to use for my QT jars.  Could someone lead me in the right direction for getting them prepared.. It just has the standard tin lids on them that came with them.  Thanks!!


--------------------

:1up:Improved melted SFD/lid tek:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters for Monotubs:1up:

:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters:1up:
:1up:DiaLiners:1up:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) *DELETED* [Re: Dilated]
    #19805360 -

Here's a link to my journal if anyone would like to follow along.  Thanks again for sharing your information Frank.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19805345


--------------------

:1up:Improved melted SFD/lid tek:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters for Monotubs:1up:

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:1up:DiaLiners:1up:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Dilated]
    #19805407 -

Use what's available to you. You can use the search to find info on the three main ones. Polyfil, SFD's, and tyvek (preferably from painters suits not the postal envelopes). If you're doing G2G transfers those only need the GE and the others will have an injection port made with High temp RTV gasket silicone or you can order injection ports.
sfd
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/11487044
tyvek
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10628004/fpart/1/vc/1
polyfil
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18278624


--------------------
How Frank gets shit done (link list) bulk sub vs casings 
NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE  Mushroom Cultivation Guide V1.0

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Happy Littletree]
    #19806357 -

hers a good tek i used: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/14722818#14722818 make sure you use the grain jar tutorial only. Oh yea and make the holes 1/4" or smaller. 1/4 works fine for me  I used plastic lids because they will never rust and worked out great. best part is each one only costed me aboout 45 cents to make including all supplies... you can't beat that... and they're reusable hundreds of times. make sure if you use plastic to rough up the surfaces where you glue with sand paper or it will not stick. our sponsors have cheap filter discs. get the biggest ones and cut them into quarter sizes. i get 19-20 cutouts per disc at $1.75


--------------------

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: tombosley8]
    #19809262 -

So I been following Franks guide so far and I already hit a slight snag.  I followed his recipe of 10 cups of WBS hydrated and it only yielded me this


Anyways I have another batch thats been soaking for 4 hours roughly.  Is the "12-24" hour soak an exact science?  Why so long?


--------------------

:1up:Improved melted SFD/lid tek:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters for Monotubs:1up:

:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters:1up:
:1up:DiaLiners:1up:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Dilated]
    #19809323 -

the soak is what hydrates your grains so if you don't soak long enough they won't get properly hydrated. A long soak also makes  endospores to easier to kill during the PC. I would say your jars are over filled.


--------------------
AMU
Bottle Tek
Liquid Inoculant Tek                                   
                     

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: MudaFuka]
    #19809343 -

The jars are over filled the foil doesn't need to be rubber banded on and the foil comes off right away after you sterilize. The endospore thing is pretty much BS you actually likely have more endospores in your grain after the soak anyway but yes the soak hydrates your grain, if you start your soak with warmer water it will take less time but I don't do WBS only Rye, if you start your soak with rye near boiling you only have to soak for about 3-4 hours.

you should have put those ten cups of wbs into like ~8 jars.


--------------------
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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: MudaFuka]
    #19809360 -

Also it's supposed to be 9-10 CUPS DRY = 7-10 HYDRATED QUARTS

Straight from the tek

About 9-10 cups of dry WBS equals 7-10 hydrated WBS quart jars (varies by brand)

Are you sure you measured properly, and I agree your jars look pretty full, I fill mine no more than 2/3 with hydrated grains then PC, they always seem to expand a bit after PC'ing


--------------------
"Not what could have been, or what should have been, but what will be" -Self
:superbanana::mjdance::dancer:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: lateforthafuture]
    #19809591 -

Yeah I measured 10 cups dry.. I mistyped and made it sound like hydrated cups.  It's alright I have another batch soaking as we speak and I'll be inoculating in the morning.  The sterlized jars should be fine till the morning right?


--------------------

:1up:Improved melted SFD/lid tek:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters for Monotubs:1up:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Dilated]
    #19809600 -

they're sterilized they'll be fine for weeks. Also take foil off after PC cools down (cools down naturally) don't need to secure foil just cover the top all it's doing is stopping water dripping from the top of the PC onto your lids during the PC cycle, Some people don't even bother with the foil when using polyfil gas exchange or SFD gas exchange but I think it's a good idea to foil the lids with polyfil.


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

My Q&A thread. Ask me questions here rather than in Private Message
Bod's chat thread

5g a day keeps the 5g away

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: bodhisatta] * 1
    #19809891 -

10 cups dry yields me about 7-10 quart jars filled about 2/3 full.

As I mentioned in the write up, your WBS will vary wildly by brand.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19809912 -

I used the same brand as you Frank lol I must have over filled them too much.. I filled them as if they were all masters.


--------------------

:1up:Improved melted SFD/lid tek:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters for Monotubs:1up:

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:1up:DiaLiners:1up:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Dilated]
    #19809973 -

The most I ever fill them is 2/3 or 3/4 full. My 10 cups almost never fails to come out to 7 or 8 jars. If I fill them 3/4 full though, I will end up short a jar or two.


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19810051 -

Oh, I forgot to mention, the seed will not only vary by brand but also by location and even by the bag. Bird seed is not really known for consistency or good quality control :lol:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19810393 -

So I've noticed.. I even found little pebbles in my first batch when I strained it too cool after my simmer.


--------------------

:1up:Improved melted SFD/lid tek:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters for Monotubs:1up:

:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters:1up:
:1up:DiaLiners:1up:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Dilated]
    #19810784 -

They've never caused a single issue for me :shrug:


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:

Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
    #19813154 -

I'm back on track now and I love that it only took 3.5 cc's to inoculate those 12 jars.  I'll be continuing with your guide once they colonize!


--------------------

:1up:Improved melted SFD/lid tek:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters for Monotubs:1up:

:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters:1up:
:1up:DiaLiners:1up:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Dilated]
    #19814007 -

Yeah I noticed my "economy" bag of seed has small grey rock in it.
At first I thought that it was undissolved gypsum granules but I did a batch today sans gypsum. If I forgot gypsum with one 6qt. jar batch is it a big deal do you think?

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: burtronn]
    #19814042 -

Yeah I had those little pebbles too but they weren't a problem as they stayed at the bottom of my stockpot when I strained them.  I didn't use gypsum and had no problems.


--------------------

:1up:Improved melted SFD/lid tek:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters for Monotubs:1up:

:1up:Dilated's Ironed Polyfil Filters:1up:
:1up:DiaLiners:1up:

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Re: Frank's WBS Prep (perfect every time) [Re: Dilated]
    #19814200 -

I was more curious as to what is lacking due to leaving the gypsum out. I have read it helps with clumping and adding minerals. Just don't know if there is more that I haven't read about yet.

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