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InvisibleViolet
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PODS TEK – Invitro tek growing with BRF or Grass Seed: a simple, self-contained, single-step method * 14
    #21390984 - 03/11/15 03:29 AM (6 years, 3 minutes ago)

Hi!  This will be a simple post about how to do a complete and powerful grow with just 2 materials - quart containers, and substrate; either grass seed, or typical brown rice flour & vermiculite mix.

I've really been enjoying this style of invitro.
Lately I've felt that this method, shared briefly in my culturing tech as an invitro version of "v tek", really deserves its own post.

It is a very simple method that I feel should be the go-to first method for prospective growers.
Those who cannot yet or do not intend to get a pressure cooker can use the well-known "PFtek" substrate recipe and steam sterilization.
Those who have or intend to get a pressure cooker can enjoy the simpler undiluted power of whole grains, starting with straight grass seed.

But its usefulness doesn't stop at accessibility for beginners!- over my years of growing, having tried essentially every grow tek I've ever seen, this has actually become my most preferred method of cultivating Cubensis.

These containers work as perfectly self-contained tunable fruiting chambers, making each one a single instance of the complete growing process.  Success rate is extremely high with proper inoculation, yield-per-grain can be near ideal with lucky multi-spore or with a strong isolated culture, and it's ridiculously quick and easy. Combined with bottom-watering it is an ultimate neglectable tek.
It's also the most simple and stealthy that a grow can get.

Additionally these have great value as a culturing shortcut. For cloning, pins plucked from these containers can be transferred to agar with ease with no contamination, and pieces of tissue from larger fruits can be taken with greater ease than an in-the-open grow and with much less threat of contamination.
More about that can be read here.



These Ziploc quart size screw-top containers are recycling code 5 which holds up perfectly under hi-pressure temperature (as long as the cooker doesn't run out of water)
Requiring no modification, they are sterilized with the lids slightly cracked loose. Do not attempt to sterilize them while sealed!

On the left, a sealed container. Seal them while removing from the sterilizer until and after inoculation.
On the right, a container with the lid very loose but still threaded in to where it does not come off when lifted. This is the loosest it should be for sterilization, but it's more loose than it should be for anything except maybe growing cased grains invitro.
In the middle, how I suggest keeping lids cracked - for sterilization or when this project is ready for gas exchange for fruiting.

Glass jars can work for this technique also.  While adding air filtration and injection port modifications can make them a bit easier to safely handle and inoculate for very beginners,  they're not quite as good for providing a good fruiting condition once the substrate is colonized.  The white plastic lids for wide-mouth quart jars are the best of both worlds.




For No-Pressure-Cooker Brown Rice Flour & Vermiculite containers
For the very new beginner, the substrate recipe and sterilization is exactly that of the well-known PF tek.
(The recipe for 5 PF jars, for instance, is:  2 cups vermiculite, 1 cup water, and 1 cup brown rice flour, which can be made by finely grinding brown rice in a coffee grinder.)
Put the vermiculite in a bowl, add the water, and mix well.  Add the 1 cup of brown rice flour and mix well onto the wet vermiculite.

Line the bottom of a pot (with a fitting lid) with something to space your containers from sitting on the bottom.  Jar lid rings work perfectly.  Other things like certain wire racks can help.
Place your containers in the pot with lids loose, and add water until it comes up to the bottom of the containers.
Run your stove on high until the water is at a steady boil, and reduce heat to keep a simmer.  If steam escapes the pot, be sure that your pot does not run out of water during the run.
Set a timer for 90-120 minutes once the pot is full of steam.  After this time has passed, turn off your stove and wait a couple hours for the containers and contents to cool.  Near your clean transfer workspace (such as still-air box), remove the lid from the pot and transfer the containers into your workspace.
You're ready to inoculate! Skip down to the part below that says "Inoculated by any method of your choice."



For Grass Seed containers

Grass seed is a tiny grain that is very powerful for use in mycology and is easy to prepare.
It cannot 'burst' like the other cereal grains typically used for mycology.  It is a very simmer-friendly grain: it can be boiled hard and strained thoroughly, or just boiled sufficiently and strained enough to toss the excess water off, so that the water stuck among the seeds finishes hydrating and expanding the seeds in the cooker.


Measure out about 110-120 mL volume of dry seed for each container you intend to make, presuming that the seeds will expand to over double their original dry volume.
Measured by weight, this would be 50-60 (~55) grams of grass seed for each container, about 1/8 of a pound of seed.


Start with 4 times the volume of water as the seed. Keep in mind some may steam away while boiling.
Bring the water and seeds up to a boil in a pot.

Once at a boil, reduce the heat some to maintain a steady rolling boil, not a crazy wild boil that could build up and spill out.  Just enough to keep it rolling.

Grass seed doesn't need long to hydrate, especially if you just intend to shake off excess moisture and load into the containers for them to absorb the rest in the cooker, but it's good to hydrate them thoroughly and then just shake off as much water as you can to be sure.

20-25 minutes at a boil is a good time to keep in mind for grass seed.


After this period of time, pour everything from the pot through a strainer to catch the seed.

- and preferably, catch the dark and nutrition-rich water the seeds were boiled in with something like a bowl below the strainer.  After settling, the top liquid can be used for agar dishes, and the thick bottom liquid can be used for poms 1 tek, which is useful culturing tek agar tek capable of producing mushroom yields, and is also great for beginners (even without a pressure cooker since they can be prepared with a microwave!)


Toss the grains around in the strainer for a bit, until you see that little drips from it each shake. I usually do this for about a minute.

I have too much seed in the strainer in this picture, but it's okay.  I just let it sit for a good while like I do when the seed is boiled extra well - making sure to let the wetter grain in the very bottom of the strainer dry some more before I use it if so.


At this point you're ready to load your containers with the seed, then sterilize.

Boiled & strained grass seed is loaded up 1/4 the way.  This should be 1 cup of grain, or up to 250mL volume.

With my fast colonization times, I get consistent success sterilizing as little as 60 minutes at 15psi. Beginners may do well to start with 90min and reduce from there in 5 minute intervals over months, once they know they're pressure cooking correctly. Signs of sterilizing incompletely are often not seen until further down the line especially if the grains will be added to another substrate as per typical bulk substrate methods. Remember to blast the heat and let the air vent out until there's pure steam coming out of the vent, probably longer than you think.  You don't want to pressurize air, only pure steam.
Glass jars require at least 80-90min when loaded this lightly.


_____________________________________________________________________


Your containers are sterilized and ready to grow mycelium!
Inoculate by any method of your choice.


For very beginners, a short squirt from a clean spore syringe can be squirted by lifting the edge of the lid and squirting spores in thru the gap.
This is best done in a still-air box, but has a good chance of success in any still-air condition away from carpets and rugs, or immediately after (even during) a rain outside.

For more assured success, make a STILL-AIR BOX
The still-air box is made out of clear plastic totes with shoulder-spaced holes for arms to reach through.  On a metal, plastic, or glass table etc. or a damp towel, the tote is placed upside-down, then is sprayed thoroughly on the inside with water or diluted bleach, allowing for air to settle at least 10 minutes (arm holes are sealed/covered in some way) causing contaminant mold spores or bacteria endospores to settle onto the moisture in the bottom of the work area.
This leaves a clean air condition where controlled gentle motions can be made to:  make clean injections of spore solution onto grains, make transfers from agar dishes to other agar dishes or to grain, or to pour broken-up colonized grains from one container into newly sterilized grains in many others.


Once your containers are inoculated,
Allow them to fully colonize the grass seed.


When fully colonized, crack the lids loose by turning counter-clockwise a couple inches. Allow to sit under direct "blue" flourescent light.  Ambient flourescent room lighting is plenty for most results.

(Don't mind the tweezers, I was taking a clone.)

The fruits will grow inside! No chamber required, and contams will be staved off quite some time.


Water while pins are growing, especially during the second flush and later flushes.
With grass seed (or any whole grain), watering this way replaces BOTH bulk substrates AND dunks which bulk substrates still need.
If you're using brown rice flour and vermiculite (PFtek sub mix) this eliminates handling and dunking the cakes.
This makes the whole grow much simpler, and will almost certainly provide a better yield.

The most important time to water is when pins are starting to grow.

You can even do this during the first flush, if your cake allows it by shrinking away from the sides of the container once the fruits start expanding.

That is the ideal time to water.  Adding water when the pins start to expand upward can provide more water to the cake at the time it needs it most, which can have a positive effect on the yield.

If you do this, the cake should still have enough moisture at the end of the flush to maintain humidity and start the next flush.
But you might still have water left in it that wasn't absorbed.  It's fine to leave it in there when you harvest,
but f you see the water is not absorbed after a couple days, you can pour the water out until mushrooms are growing.

Otherwise this might happen.

Not a major problem, but obviously the water isn't being used, so it's worth it to pour that water away before this happens.

Once you have done this watering process yourself, you'll easily know when you don't need to leave water in, and you can then make your job even simpler by removing any excess water when you harvest the flush!


HAPPY GROWING!


Here are some photos, by Chk, of Cubensis B+ on a well-watered grass seed cake.


_____________________________________________________________________



Grass seed grown this way requires no casing layer or bulk substrate. It will achieve its full yield with only the steps given above.

Given that a cup of seed sub contains about 50-56g of dry grain matter, you can expect a yield of something like 6-16 dry grams each typically, depending on your culture.

(Similarly, given that a cup of BRF/Verm sub contains approximately 36 grams of brown rice flour, you can typically expect a yield of 4-11 dry grams each.)


Grass seed is fluffy, and has a reduced amount of grain matter per volume than other grains.  This in addition to the much tinier size of each grain makes it quick to consume by mycelium.  This substrate will produce mushrooms more quickly than other grains, and can achieve most or all of its full yield in 3 or 4 flushes, leading to a quicker turnover time without sacrificing much yield.



Once learned, there are a couple optional modifications/upgrades to this tek.

Although not necessary for grass seed as it is for other grains,  after the substrate is colonized you can keep the containers shut tight for several days more - referred to as "consolidation" time.  This allows the mycelium to knit together further, consume the substrate more, and ready for fruiting.  This can produce a more strong flushing pattern in waves, and consolidation may have a hand in solidifying potency, though typically this is of little concern when substrates do not need much or any consolidation time.
You may allow them to consolidate as little or as much as you like, from just One day extra, to two weeks!

For a greater yield per container, and possibly a more potent result, whole brown rice can be used as a substrate.  It provides a greater yield per container because brown rice is significantly more dense than grass seed - 1 cup of prepared brown rice has about 125% times as much grain matter. Whereas a pound of seed makes 9 1-cup containers when fully hydrated, a pound of brown rice makes 6 or just over.  This means you're fitting the same amount of substrate into fewer containers, without those containers being over-loaded.
For this reason, however, brown rice requires a casing layer applied at the beginning or during consolidation to provide Cubensis the nutrition-expended site they want to pin nicely, even invitro.  Brown rice also will require at least 5 days of consolidation (I like 10 or more, why not?) after colonized to consume the grains while preparing to fruit.
Here is my first exploration into casing brown rice invitro.
Here is an excellent method for preparing casing layer for these containers.


Growers can choose to experiment with treating grain substrates with NPK fertilized water and given a two stage heat treatment pre-fermentation process.  Thermophilic "composting" bacteria are known to convert ammoniacal compounds, the likes of urea etc., and perhaps other nitrogen- and phosphorous-containing elements in blood meal, bone meal, and NPK fertilizers into proteins and other forms that mycelium can use.  In theory this can benefit mycelium by enriching the spectrum of available materials for metabolysis, potentially leading isolate cultures shown to have strong potency to produce the strongest fruits they're capable of.
This requires a grain preparation method to make use of this - do not simply add NPK fertilizers to substrates and use like that.
Here is my preparation method for grass seed and brown rice.



Thanks for reading!  I'm happy to answer any questions!


Edited by Violet (02/03/21 11:18 AM)


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Offlinemushpunx
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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Violet]
    #21391030 - 03/11/15 03:42 AM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Neat!


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: mushpunx]
    #21391076 - 03/11/15 03:46 AM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Nice seems like a good way to get a mushroom for a print I'm currently doing something similar with wbs flour.


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InvisibleViolet
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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: silverstem] * 3
    #21392173 - 03/11/15 12:47 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Indeed; fruits grown this way combined with sterile print-taking practices result in completely clean prints, effectively sterile except for our target specimen.
In fact this technique was first introduced in brief partially as a lead-in for my post about sterile spore printing in my culturing tech.
For that exact same reason, it's the second-best technique I know of from which to take good clones in a snap - well, the best is pretty much the same thing just 1/4 the substrate in the half-sized pint containers.  That can be read about in a post above the one I linked.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Violet]
    #21392209 - 03/11/15 12:53 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

may want to think about after the jar is colonized 100%, break it up and "dunk" the grains since you  are not spawning to bulk or another substrate that will hold water and nutrients. The dunk will rehydrate the grains and after 3 days the grains will be rejuvenated and ready to fruit with an ample amount of saturation. i just fill the jar with tap water, let it sit for half hour or so then drain straight from the jar. dunking grains seems to be beneficial in my experiments. and its still really easy, so will fit your tek well.. just a though.


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InvisibleViolet
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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Hashish]
    #21392259 - 03/11/15 01:06 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

No.  Bad.
The cakes are watered once pins begin growing, especially after the first flush, but during it too if the grower wants.
There's absolutely no advantage to be gained in breaking up the grains to soak them and put them back into the container, undone and sopping, and a number of detriments/disadvantages.  That's damaging to the mycelium and is completely unnecessary.

I'm plenty familiar with the idea of dunking grains.  It may be a good idea for teks where the grains must be broken up anyway, but not when they needn't.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Violet]
    #21392275 - 03/11/15 01:11 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Where can I find "untreated" grass seed?


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InvisibleViolet
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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: MBabble]
    #21392299 - 03/11/15 01:17 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Hey MBabble, this was actually one of the methods I was going to suggest for you.

I get my seed from feed stores.  I don't live in an urban area, and there are a few within easy range.  One sells it by the pound, and another in big bags.
Search for co-ops in your areas, I.E. farmer stores.  Stores like Tractor Supply may carry untreated seed.  I have found smaller bags of untreated seed from Ace Hardware.  At worst, giant stores like Lowes could be worth checking out to see if any of their seed is untreated.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: MBabble]
    #21392301 - 03/11/15 01:17 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

So I'll give this a go Violet in trying a new spawn medium.  I have only tried wbs which is eh.... I really like the ease and speed of getting this grass ready for pc'ng.

Any particular brand you prefer to use?


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Violet]
    #21392328 - 03/11/15 01:24 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

that may be.. i have never put dunked grains back in the jar and let it recolonize, but do find it very beneficial to dunk my grains before spawning to bulk. ive always found that the colonizing mycelium dries out the grains, and i thought that maybe re hydrating them might make for a better yeild.


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Hashish]
    #21392389 - 03/11/15 01:34 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

:takingnotes:


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http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/11525679
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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Hashish]
    #21392403 - 03/11/15 01:36 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

etc1time said:
that may be.. i have never put dunked grains back in the jar and let it recolonize, but do find it very beneficial to dunk my grains before spawning to bulk. ive always found that the colonizing mycelium dries out the grains, and i thought that maybe re hydrating them might make for a better yeild.



Violet adds water while in fruiting stage.. No dunk just add sterile water.


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: silverstem]
    #21392444 - 03/11/15 01:44 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Hey violet have you tried bottom watering with your grass boil water? Or do you think the risk of contams would be too great ? Even if you reboiled the water prior to use. I would think you could really give a great boost of nutrients for second flush .


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: tourrat]
    #21392498 - 03/11/15 01:58 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

tourrat said:
Hey violet have you tried bottom watering with your grass boil water? Or do you think the risk of contams would be too great ? Even if you reboiled the water prior to use. I would think you could really give a great boost of nutrients for second flush .



Once myc is fully colonized it no longer takes in nutrients. It just uses the nutes it has already stored... There is no point to bottom water with grain water. Sounds like a good way to cause bacterial growth.


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: silverstem]
    #21392514 - 03/11/15 02:00 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Word.


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: tourrat]
    #21392589 - 03/11/15 02:13 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

:takingnotes:

Seems easy and cheap. Ill do it.


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: tourrat]
    #21392623 - 03/11/15 02:19 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah I mulled it around once and came to that conclusion sortof, at least the part about bacteria.
Grain water is a highly bio-active medium like grains and agar - in fact I use it for agar!
Allowing it to be unsterile, or even sterile but in an unsterile environ, as a liquid would certainly allow a bloom of bacteria before it would be fully absorbed, depositing all contams to the side/bottom of the cake.

Though, I do feel that mycelium could utilize the nutrition.  If they didn't absorb it with the water, mycelium would fuzz up to reach out and take it.
Thing is though that my experiments have shown that only 4-12% of grain matter is lost to prep water, depending on the grain and preparation. To me this indicates that the potential yield boost in the roughly 80-150mL of the "clear" liquid post-settling fed to the cake couldnt boost the yield enough to be worth it, even if the contam risk was low.
I did play with the idea of sterilizing the "clear" grain water and watering the still-sterile cakes in still-air or sterile airflow, for kicks, but realistically it wouldn't be worth it.

So especially since I'd like to aim this thread for beginners, culturers, stealth lovers, lazy people, and those interested in exploring alternative teks, the official stance is going to be "don't water with nutritious liquid"

:thumbup:


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Edited by Violet (03/11/15 05:06 PM)


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Violet]
    #21393233 - 03/11/15 04:42 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

I like it!


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: Mushroom_J]
    #21393387 - 03/11/15 05:13 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

:takingnotes:


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Re: Invitro Grass Seed TEK – A powerful single-step grow method for beginners and beyond [Re: liquidclutter]
    #21425072 - 03/18/15 03:11 AM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Added the PF-tek recipe and sterilization to the tek!

This tek works wonderfully for absolute beginners who don't even have a pressure cooker!
It avoids the birthing, handling, dunking, and verm rolling of cakes before fruiting. BRF cakes can be submerged in their container before the first flush if desired, for an optimal first flush.
It also avoids the the complex, confusing, costly, annoying and only somewhat useful shotgun terrarium, as well as any unclear misting and fanning procedures that go with it and the original PF-tek cakes.

Beginners, and all growers, can now just watch the mycelium overtake their substrate (more quickly, too), then unscrew the lids and watch how the perfectly humid yet breathing conditions inside the simple container allows the mushrooms to grow with no effort from the grower.


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PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Mushroom Cultivation

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