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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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"The god theory" a short video
    #6306101 -

This video just took the words out of my mouth!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9feXeL-3XA


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"That's the story moving from the NO to the YES. All of life is like, no thankyou, no thankyou, no thankyou. Then ultimatey it's YES i give in, YES I accept, YES I embrace."

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Amethyst]
    #6306115 -

Excellent points brought up, although even if the multiple universes theory is true, there can still be room for God.


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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Amethyst]
    #6306197 -

Of course God and science cannot be reconciled. How can the scientific method that examines this universe and its properties (and soon other universes? :strokebeard:) be used in an attempt to examine something that probably does not exist?

They make it sound like the Many-Worlds Theory of quantum mechanics and the existence of God are two equally logical paths, except the existence of God is not logical at all and only creates far, far more questions than it would ever answer. Scientifically, the simplest and most consistent explanation with quantum mechanics is the theory that there is more than this single universe, that quantum fluxuations produce other universes just as this one was formed in the Big Bang. What field of science is God compatible with? Certainly not quantum mechanics, astronomy, cosmology or physics.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Ravus]
    #6306216 -

Ravus said:
They make it sound like the Many-Worlds Theory of quantum mechanics and the existence of God are two equally logical paths, except the existence of God is not logical at all and only creates far, far more questions than it would ever answer.


Only if you make a number of assumptions about God's nature.

Quote:
Scientifically, the simplest and most consistent explanation with quantum mechanics is the theory that there is more than this single universe, that quantum fluxuations produce other universes just as this one was formed in the Big Bang.


Then how come more quantum physicists support the Copenhagen interpretation?

Quote:
What field of science is God compatible with? Certainly not quantum mechanics, astronomy, cosmology or physics.


How so?


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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Ravus]
    #6306237 -

Bottom line is no one knows if there is God. He could easily operate above our sciences. This question cannot be answered. We will however (most of us) waste our valuable time in the attempt. Just choose to believe and act accordingly. It doesn't matter to anyone else.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Silversoul]
    #6306269 -

Only if you make a number of assumptions about God's nature.

When discussing 'God' is it possible to not make assumptions about his/her/its nature?

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #6306273 -

MushmanTheManic said:
Only if you make a number of assumptions about God's nature.

When discussing 'God' is it possible to not make assumptions about his/her/its nature?


No, but if we take the word "God" out, and simply use words such as "designer" then it is possible to more specific without the baggage that comes with the G word.


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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Silversoul]
    #6306359 -

The baggage is the problem. Everyone gets to humanize the term God according to his or her needs. It's so human to most of us because of the religions we were programmed with.

Even designer seems to have a human intent to me. How about consciousness or Tao?


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Icelander]
    #6306379 -

Yes, I couldn't quite come up with the right word for it, but if we simply say that there is an intelligence to the universe, I think that avoids a lot of the pitfalls the come with the common notion of God.


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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Silversoul]
    #6306397 -

At the moment it seems to me purely "incomprehensible" this designer, ultimate intelligence, etc.

At least we can swim back most the way up the stream of consciousness, to get close to the source.


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"That's the story moving from the NO to the YES. All of life is like, no thankyou, no thankyou, no thankyou. Then ultimatey it's YES i give in, YES I accept, YES I embrace."

Edited by Amethyst (11/27/06 10:56 PM)

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Amethyst]
    #6306415 -

BTW, anyone interested in God and science should read some of Alfred North Whitehead's works.


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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Silversoul]
    #6306464 -

Thanks :smile: I'm considering getting the book "The god theory"


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"That's the story moving from the NO to the YES. All of life is like, no thankyou, no thankyou, no thankyou. Then ultimatey it's YES i give in, YES I accept, YES I embrace."

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Silversoul]
    #6306471 -

Silversoul said:
Excellent points brought up, although even if the multiple universes theory is true, there can still be room for God.


I agree, the "designer" has infinite potential, (relative to us) and it would make sense that this intelligence could of made countless universes, even at random, until the perfect one was created to harbor consciousness.....This one! :smile:


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"That's the story moving from the NO to the YES. All of life is like, no thankyou, no thankyou, no thankyou. Then ultimatey it's YES i give in, YES I accept, YES I embrace."

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Icelander]
    #6307038 -

Icelander said:
Bottom line is no one knows if there is God.


I have many suspicions that various "knowers" I have spoken with can relate to the same inner experiences of the Divine that I do.


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"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Basilides]
    #6307075 -

I have many suspisions also. :grin: Some of my friends and lover have differing ones and they are at least as intelligent and sensitive as I.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Silversoul]
    #6307077 -

Silversoul said:
Yes, I couldn't quite come up with the right word for it, but if we simply say that there is an intelligence to the universe, I think that avoids a lot of the pitfalls the come with the common notion of God.


Maybe it avoids some, but it still leaves other problems. AFAIK, we animals on planet earth are the intelligence of the universe. Maybe there are intelligent beings on other planets too. In fact, it's quite possible. But we certainly don't know that. To say that 'there is an intelligence to the universe' makes it seem as though there is some sort of intelligence outside of us. Which still brings all of the problems associated with "God". Unless I'm misinterpreting what you say.

Also, the notion of a "designer"...as in an intelligent "designer" has no basis in fact, so it would not be appropriate to say that there is one.


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"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Icelander]
    #6307090 -

Quote:
How about consciousness or Tao?


Consciousness also has human intent: humans understand consciousness according to human consciousness. Also there's the little problem of saying that the entire universe is consciousness itself.

Tao sounds nice, but there are too many who would be eager to give it their own self-serving meanings since they aren't entirely clear on what it actually means. Besides, the tao that can be named is not the real Tao.

If one has to name it, and it seems one does, then perhaps Reality or True Nature might work well?


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"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: dblaney]
    #6307099 -

Yeah, or maybe we need to just drop the subject. :grin:


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Icelander]
    #6307551 -

to whomever concerns:
It is a blessing, that we aren't really able to name 'it'.
This works like a barrier, where our ego has no real 'grasp' on the 'matter', even if the greek 'word' for GOD is also 'logos' what in second meaning is another 'name' (/'word') for 'word' itself.

So even here, both perspectives are combined and not really separable.

So..so in general, I am a big fan of a scientific approach on 'g*d', or any spiritual ('g*dly') approach on science.

What pleasure lies in there (here), where I am in lack of words :heart:

Aren't they crutches and means anyways ?!

Ps:Oops, I have to watch that video now, I think, :lol:


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

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Re: "The god theory" a short video [Re: Silversoul]
    #6308626 -

There is also 'process theology,' which I was introduced to in seminary 30 years ago. I didn't get much out of it then because I was coming right from my undergrad philosophy studies and psychedlic overuse, and I was focused on what Meister Eckhart referred to as "the Godhead" (the changeless, eternal Verity) as opposed to Eckhart's "God" which is the creative aspect of The ONE. Charles Hartshorne's A Natural Theology for Our Time and Cobb's & Griffin's Process Theology: An Introductory Exposition were apparently both influenced by Whitehead's philosophy.

"Process theology is sometimes called 'dipolar theism,' in contrast to traditional theism with its doctrine of divine simplicity. For Charles Hartshorne, the two 'poles' or aspects of God are the abstract essence of God, on the one hand, and God's concrete actuality on the other. The abstract essence is eternal, absolute, independent, unchangeable...The concrete actuality is temporal, relative, dependent, and constantly changing. In each moment of God's life the are new, unforeseen happenings in the world which only then have become knowable. Hence God's concrete knowledge is dependent upon the decisions made by the worldly actualities. God's knowledge is always relativized by, in the sense of internally related to, the world.
Whitehead's way of conceiving the divine dipolarity was not identical with Hartshorne's. Whitehead distinguished between between the Primordial Nature of God and the Consequent Nature...The latter is largely identical with what Hartshorne called God's concrete actuality." p. 47-48 Cobb & Griffin, 1976.

I have been reading a book on 'the two and the One' - Shiva-Shakti, Yab-Yum, Logos-Sophia, YHVH-Chokmah, Nirvana-Samsara, Purusha-Prakriti, etc., the apparent duality of spirit and matter and I've always found myself drawn to the former Yang over the latter Yin. I'm more an Ontologist on the side of Being than an existentialist on the side of existence. I wonder how you take any of this. I still strive to somehow be absorbed into God, Sat Chit Ananda, whatever, while still living my life here. "Enoch walked with God and was not, for God took him."

Comments?


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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