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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: lvleph]
    #1231741 - 01/19/03 04:37 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: World Spirit]
    #1231829 - 01/19/03 05:00 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Enter: "I guess" is quite primitive in thinking. "I believe" is a bit more mature.

If he said "suppose", you wouldn't be able to carry out such subtle personal attacks. But I suppose lvleph would have a more "mature" perspective if he agreed with you, now, wouldn't he?

I won't tolerate you pulling out any bullshit stops.
Especially on newbies to S&P&S (and the Shroomery at large)... it only discourages (a violation of the "Be Nice" policy you're so quick to quote).


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: Sclorch]
    #1232028 - 01/19/03 05:59 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

no way, Sclorch....

I guess Enter's correct. He's rock-solid :tongue:


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: Sclorch]
    #1232038 - 01/19/03 06:02 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: World Spirit]
    #1232040 - 01/19/03 06:04 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Knowing, it would seem, comes by degree. It is a word that is equivalent to the notion of being Enlightened. For individuals who do not believe in God, there is no awareness of God, and hence no conscious interaction with God, which is prayer.

It is futile to debate the existence of God with a person whose makeup is purely 'existential,' rather than 'ontological' (ontos=being) or 'spiritual.' They will speak primarily in materialistic terms, citing the obviousness of birth, life, death, decay, etc. One who is unaware, or unconscious of the Eternal in the midst of everyday existence will therefore not endeavor to Know this Ultimate Reality in a deeper way. A believer can understand the non-believer's viewpoint, as it is based upon simple sensory data. The non-believer is not capable of understanding the believer's viewpoint FROM the believer's viewpoint. [S]he can only hold an opinion or a perception ABOUT the believer's viewpoint that is not grounded in a transcendental perspective. This includes any theistic believer versus the non-believer.

The issue of the existence vs. non-existence of God should not become a debate. It is not an argument that can be won because the 'proof' can be discovered only by each individual's own experience of Knowledge. In other words, one's proof is discovered only in the 'before belief' and 'after belief' quality of one's own life (inner and outer). Proof cannot be presented, nor accepted one person to another. Any improvement in the life of the believer could be attributed to multiple external causes by the unbeliever. That our being derives moment-to-moment from the Ground of Being, is evident to the believer by Gnosis, or Faith, or Intuition (mysticism). For the unbeliever, the awareness of the connection between our spirit and Spirit, is not present. Do not expect to connect with that individual in the depth of that awareness of Spirit that Christians call Christ, or which other theistic believers name the Holy interface between God and humans.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1232058 - 01/19/03 06:11 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

I never really thought that delusions could, in fact, be proof.

Huh... you learn somethin' new everyday.


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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1232063 - 01/19/03 06:13 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: World Spirit]
    #1234128 - 01/20/03 11:44 AM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Well, if you ARE a social masochist, then feel free to knock yourself out, but it's your own Fight Club. As for myself, I am more than willing to answer any questions about my experience of religious life (such as it is), if I feel the questioner is sincere, but I'm not going to 'cast my pearls before swine,' or attempt to plant 'seeds of faith,' in the stoney hearts of those who scorn [" : an emotion involving both anger and disgust : contempt : disdain"]. I learned long ago not to lay my trip on people without invitation.

Naturally, when one takes an open approach to such things, the subsequent vulnerability allows the occasional individual with sociopathic tendencies to enter into a dialogue with an  agenda to manipulate and deceive for his perverse pleasure. But meeting with the occasional sincere soul outweighs being fooled by many a**holes. In this format, I must learn simply to pass over various forms of 'baiting' for useless argument, but of course there are a few master baiters here who are difficult at times to ignore :smile: 


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1234176 - 01/20/03 12:06 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Speaking as a masterbator I resemble that remark! :mad:

Yes, I concur with your statement about truth telling to those who wish to abuse what they cannot understand and in turn rending the messenger.  I have no use for such folly.  It does neither them nor me any good.

This is why I prefer to speak metaphorically or parabolically or sometimes I'll just state a broad principle and let it go at that.

Peace

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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: ]
    #1234870 - 01/20/03 05:42 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

rofl Mr. FUNgus


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE

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InvisibleXibalba
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: World Spirit]
    #1235008 - 01/20/03 06:50 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Enter- please define the thing you call "God," and I'll tell you whether I believe in it or not.

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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #1235147 - 01/20/03 08:44 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Satan is good 4U.

He never did anything except make people think.


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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: Xibalba]
    #1235438 - 01/21/03 02:48 AM (21 years, 4 months ago)

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OfflineGazzBut
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: World Spirit]
    #1235459 - 01/21/03 03:02 AM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

"I guess" is quite primitive in thinking. "I believe" is a bit more mature.





It might be a better world if everyone realised most of our beliefs are only guesses at the end of the day...

Perhaps people wouldnt be so eager to defend their guesses with the blood of others?


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InvisibleXibalba
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: World Spirit]
    #1236179 - 01/21/03 08:25 AM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Ok...

Quote:

?
It's funny how so many humans have so much personality, so much intensity living within them. Yet, for all that, they ignore the personality and personification of God Almighty.
If you can't picture God in a human body, at least try to temporarily picture God as a life force with a name, a will, desires, emotions based on will, and identity. God's actions and creations are apart of His work. Separate the work from the Worker and you will find Someone with exceedingly awesome intelligence and power.





You call God "Him". Do you do this out of convenience & tradition or do you believe your god is, in some meaningful sense, male?

Ok. So far, we have- It's male, it has a personality like that of a human, and there is only one. Already I can pretty confidently say I don't believe in any such God myself.

But that's still pretty vague. Could you specify his desires, his will? Where he came from? The limits to his involvement in human affairs? What exactly he does to influence the universe, apart from having created it? And how much he is, or is not, in your mind the Hebrew tribal god YHWH and / or the supposed father of Jesus?




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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: Xibalba]
    #1236246 - 01/21/03 08:50 AM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Xibalba.... I thought you knew that Enter's "God" is really JHVH-1, an alien space monster.  Non-Yeti (it is a theory that some Yeti can) can't change the SKOR, but JHVH-1 can.  His "Heavenly Host," consisting of sub-neutrinos, "Wotrons" and "bobyon" particles, can shred the channels and pathways of the Skor as easily as a SubGenius would hoodwink a Pink.  Yes, the Luck Plane is edited.  So it would be a good idea to have a divine copy editor on the dole :wink:


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Anonymous

Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: Sclorch]
    #1236416 - 01/21/03 09:48 AM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Stop it! :mad:

You're making me giggle like a giddy schoolboy over here!

:grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:

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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: Xibalba]
    #1236829 - 01/21/03 12:12 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: World Spirit]
    #1236847 - 01/21/03 12:18 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

Enter, you are getting so annoying..... I thought you actually knew something for a while a couple months back, but dude you're leading everybody around in circles.


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Don't believe in God?Shouldn't you have an answer? [Re: Strumpling]
    #1236854 - 01/21/03 12:20 PM (21 years, 4 months ago)

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