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OfflineEvilGir
Im the on coming storm

Registered: 11/26/01
Posts: 1,301
Loc: Planet Irk
Last seen: 10 months, 23 days
Enlightenment Cant be reached
    #1623708 - 06/10/03 03:08 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Does anyone feel here no matter how many drugs you take or how many years you spend thinking and trying to work stuff out that enlightenment cant be reached while your alive. I think that during life stuff may be worked out but its only realy when your dead you can permantly change things and escape the physical existence or maybe we all have to wait for somesort of technological advancement/evolution to free us all.


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Fighting the man the best way I can.


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Offlinelateralus
member
Registered: 01/29/03
Posts: 126
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: EvilGir]
    #1623719 - 06/10/03 03:19 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

The more I think about it I find myself coming to the same conclusion... It makes sense though, doesn't it? All ego games and needs of the body dissolve in death.

I sometimes wonder if theres an ultimate truth you could come to that would make you die instantly;)


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OfflineEvilGir
Im the on coming storm

Registered: 11/26/01
Posts: 1,301
Loc: Planet Irk
Last seen: 10 months, 23 days
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: lateralus]
    #1623751 - 06/10/03 03:37 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

I sometimes wonder if theres an ultimate truth you could come to that would make you die instantly;)




I think thats totaly possible I think the death could be somewhat bizzar though.
But look at terance Mckenna he died young think he was still in his 50s. The thing is did he discover something or was it just a coincedence who knows.
But I just feel like the only way out of this crazy world is either 2012 (not holding my breath though) or simply wait to die, hopefully in another 50-60 years. But I think you still need to prepare for death though, like what to think about when it happens.


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Fighting the man the best way I can.


Edited by jezu (06/10/03 03:39 PM)


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InvisibleArmFromTheAbyss
Old Hand

Registered: 10/09/02
Posts: 1,364
Loc: Down here in Babylon
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: EvilGir]
    #1623771 - 06/10/03 03:47 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Inner peace can be reahced within old age. But weren't you enlightened the day you were born? Light, life. Same thing.


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OfflineCougheeman
enthusiast
Registered: 07/03/02
Posts: 214
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Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: lateralus]
    #1623780 - 06/10/03 03:51 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

It was said that some Swami's years ago could instantly die right on the spot, they were said to have that much control over their bodies. Their senses and bodily functions could be switched off just like one would switch a TV off. Iam not sure of the creditability and forgot where i read it.

I personally think it is fully possible to reach so called "Enlightenment" in life; drugs themselves will not make one "awake" as the Buddha puts it. According to Buddhist belief, it says there are thousands of different ways to reach enlightenment(correct me if iam wrong on this).

Many people will feel its not possible, but then again this is not a easy task. Of the many Gurus, sages, Swamis and mystics out there only a handful of them that reach what is classified as true awakening; a achievement so large that they free themselves from the law of reincarnation and merge with the Cosmic forces.

Lastly Enlightenment is not the act of escaping one's body, its the union between your whole being; you realize that your body and mind are instruments and your soul is in fact the who you truly are. The purpose of Yoga practices (Yoga=Union)





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Aum Namah Sivaya


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Offlinequestforall
very-stranger
Registered: 11/22/02
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Loc: Vancouver BC
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Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: Cougheeman]
    #1623796 - 06/10/03 03:58 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Companionship With The Holy

Don?t take a wooden sword into battle.
Go, find one of steel;
Then march forward with joy.

The saint?s protection is Truth?s sword:
Your time with him
Is worth as much as the cup of life itself.

All the wise have said the same:
The one who knows God
Is God?s mercy to his creatures?

Companionship with the holy makes you one of them.
Though you?re rock or marble, you?ll become a jewel
When you reach the man of heart.

Plant the love of the holy ones within your spirit;
Don?t give your heart to anything,
But the love of those whose hearts are glad.

Don?t go to the neighborhood of despair:
There is hope.
Don?t go in the direction of darkness:
Suns exist.
Mathnawi 1, 714-717, 721-724



Find a teacher who is an integral being, a beacon who extends his light and virtue with equal ease to those who appreciate him and those who don't. Shape yourself in his mold, bathe in his nourishing radiance, and reflect it out to the rest of the world.


Nothing kills the ego but the shadow of the shaykh(spiritual master): Cling tightly to the skirt of that ego-killer!
(The Sufi Path of Love: The Spiritual Teachings of Rumi, p. 193)


God does not speak to everyone, just as the kings of this world do not speak to every weaver. They appoint ministers and representatives so that through them people may find the way to them. In the same way God has singled out certain servants so that everyone who seeks Him may find Him within them. All the prophets have come for this reason. Only they are the Way.
(The Sufi Path of Love: The Spiritual Teachings of Rumi, p. 122)


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Please look within. Try. Try more.


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: questforall]
    #1624156 - 06/10/03 06:28 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

i think that, if you think drugs are going to bring "enlightenment" (whatever the fuck that is), you have some serious problems.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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InvisibleRevelation

 User Gallery

Registered: 08/04/01
Posts: 6,134
Loc: heart cave
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1624178 - 06/10/03 06:37 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

I disagree.


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Anonymous

Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: EvilGir]
    #1624191 - 06/10/03 06:43 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

-deleted-


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Offlinepeacinanarchy
member

Registered: 04/16/02
Posts: 114
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: EvilGir]
    #1624248 - 06/10/03 07:17 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

i think enlightenment is a misconception. i dont think you should try so hard to find it but rather relax and be positvie and it will find you. ive seen alot of unhappy people try to "find" enlightenment and get depressed because they cant seem to grasp it. part of being enlightend is excepting faults and relizeing that no ones perfect so maybe being enlightend is realizing that no one can become fully enlightend because of basic human nature. well thats just my opinion anyway....i think you can definetly be enlighten by listening the to String Cheese Incident though.. :wink:


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Offlinepsilyhunter
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Registered: 06/27/02
Posts: 38
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Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: EvilGir]
    #1624326 - 06/10/03 08:02 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Some shamans have said that the purpose of life is to become familiar with the after-death body so that we will be ready (for McKenna's transcendental object?) . I would highly recommend reading Gary Zukav's "Seat Of The Soul". (And for those McKenna naysayers: Michio Kaku's "Hyperspace", James Gleick's "Chaos: Making A New Science", and Edwin A. Abbott's "Flatland".

Brother... revere, seek, think, unthink, and find.



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++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chart your own course... but only from here to there.


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: psilyhunter]
    #1624441 - 06/10/03 09:00 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

enlightenment is just a tool for religious control. monks claim to be enlightened so that communities give them economic support, its superiority needed to justify a spiritually elitest community's existance.

enlightenment is not magic, its very basic, this is enlightenment: a person understands their reality in way that makes them feel comfortable and happy, without needing anything external to make them feel this happiness.

its being cool with the universe, nothing more, enlightenment aint shit, westerns bastardize and romanticize eastern philosophy in order to justify and romanticize their own existance.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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Offlinenubious
1up on the rest

Registered: 10/20/02
Posts: 534
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1624494 - 06/10/03 09:15 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Does anyone feel here no matter how many drugs you take or how many years you...

I think this post put it best...

Thats your first problem. Drugs cannot bring you to enlightenment.

Drugs are tools of development - paths unexplored by the vast majority of society. They twist your perception and can disolve feelings of self - some people call that enlightenment - Some people call that addiction. If being enlightened requires using a substance foreign to the brain as a crutch to the door, then I don't want enlightenment.


BTW-FULL enlightenment cannot be reached in a human body.

I love how people who have no experience in the field are self termed pro's at this kind of thing. It's like talking about computers with a Futureshop salesman..


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No one knows the worth of innocence till he knows it is gone forever, and that money can't buy it back. Not the saint, but the sinner that repenteth, is he to whom the full length and breadth, and height and depth, of life's meaning is revealed. Good and evil loose all objective meaning and are seen as equally necessary and contrasting elements in the masterpiece that is the universe.


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OfflineHagbardCeline
Student-Teacher-Student-Teacher
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Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: nubious]
    #1624539 - 06/10/03 09:29 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

  BTW-FULL enlightenment cannot be reached in a human body.

I love how people who have no experience in the field are self termed pro's at this kind of thing. It's like talking about computers with a Futureshop salesman..




LOL, I totally agree with you.  They just know.... :grin:

Enlightenment can mean so many things.  But basically it is just a term.  Like someone said earlier, it can mean you have just accepted your position in your reality.

But to think that you must do drugs to reach some sort of higher plain is laughable. 


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I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine


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Offlinedebianlinux
Myconerd - DBK
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Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: psilyhunter]
    #1624570 - 06/10/03 09:41 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

James Gleick's "Chaos: Making A New Science



OMG!! I have never met anyone who has read this book. An excellent read! I'm not sure if I'd call it enlightening but it definitely changed my entire perspective on this world. The prinicples in this book can be applied to any, i repeat, ANY facet of life.


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OfflineHagbardCeline
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Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: debianlinux]
    #1624587 - 06/10/03 09:46 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

I'm not sure if I'd call it enlightening but it definitely changed my entire perspective on this world.




That's funny. That is exactly what I would call enlightening.


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I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine


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Offlinedebianlinux
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Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: HagbardCeline]
    #1624640 - 06/10/03 10:06 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

ahh, but if the principles fail to be applicable then it was false enlightenment. enlightenment imparts knowledge and knowledge involves experience. reading a book can give you the opportunity to choose a new or modified belief structure but only the test of time can determine enlightenment. IMO there is no such thing as instantaneous enlightenment outside of personal experience. one could say that the first time your tripping and come to the conclusion that you are the only existing entity and all other persons/objects/animals are merely a "figment of your imagination" is enlightenment. it may well be true but until one can verify such a "claim" i would hesitate to term it enlightening. it's a pretty ambigous term... enlightenment... it's really what you make it.


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: debianlinux]
    #1624675 - 06/10/03 10:19 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

yup, the ego posing as enlightenment... all part of a big cosmic joke...
"I feel the self drifting away...peace... serenity... love... nirvana.... a light...
a vision...it's... it's...it's...it's just me....damn fooled again..."


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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Invisibletekramrepus
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Registered: 02/20/02
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Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: debianlinux]
    #1624698 - 06/10/03 10:29 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

First off, I think 90% of the people on this thread are viewing enlightenment differently. Or maybe even more.


It depends what you term enlightenment.

Was it ram dass who said that words are like a bridge..and once you experience the concept that the word brought you to, you should get rid of the bridge?

WHat he meant was that words can throw us off so easily. We NEED words to express concepts to each other, but words dont do justice.


So when talking about enlightnement, we all are probably talking about different things.



I have experience enlightenment - the enlightenment i believe in, anyway.

In my belief, enlightenment is not necessarily, and even USUALLY not permanment. Anyone can have an enlightening experience. For it to last, that is the challenge.

EVERY human being is enlightened underneath their Ego, Perception, Perspective, Thoughts, Mental Blocks, and Ignornace. Enlightenment CAN be reached through psychedelics, but it CANNOT last from pscyehdelics.

IT can be reached from numerous things, yoga, meditation, psychedelics, etc.


I believe we are all born enlightened.


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OfflineSev
Astropath
Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 1,426
Loc: NY
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
Re: Enlightenment Cant be reached [Re: lucid]
    #1624710 - 06/10/03 10:32 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

I've got to agree that you can't reach enlightenment with drugs -- at least, not drugs alone. I think, however, that it is possible to reach enlightenment -- whatever that is, really -- with experience, and thought; drugs are certainly an experience.



--------------------
"Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury

All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.


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