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Invisible2Experimental
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Registered: 01/15/03
Posts: 18,073
religion rant
    #1790484 - 08/08/03 12:12 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)


*rant=on*


Some statements made recently here in S&P concerning christianity.

"i experimented with drugs, and studied all kinds of religions, and everynight i tell "god" i know if i die tonight and u do exist you will forgive me beacuse i have reason to belive what i belive" and my life took such an upward in freedom after i lived by this belief."

"but then again, my moral dilemma comes into place and I find myself stressed about it..the bible says to respect them, but how can you possibly? Not that I live my life by what the rest of the bible says, this seems to be such a sensitive subject for me and it sucks."


"and honestly, no where in the bible does it clearly state.."do not do drugs." that would be nice if it did, to clear up some of my guilt"


"I do smoke weed amongst other things too...its just the guilt man, 90% of the time I end up writing about issues and get all sketchy about the world coming to end and me dying in it"


This demonstrates how being raised christian, is like mind control, how someone feels the need to pray every night, and that if there is a god he will "forgive me because I have reason to beleive what I believe". You can see yourself how christianity thrives on the deep subconciouss level of fear of going to " eternal hell of all damnation and horror"... not as extreme on the outward social level, but by the quotes, you can see his stress and guilt about this, and a need to feel release from this "impending doom" that will happen to them if they dont follow the god in the sky who brings justice to all and will stop the bad guys from hurting us. NOT.. Im so glad I realized what I think is the begining of truth a while ago, and freed myself from what this guy is talking about. It makes me wonder how people can raise kids and not give them another option besides christianity, dont they know its mind control? Or are they so caught up in it they dont even realize. OR do they have thier own beleifs, but decided its the mentality of the son/daughter they want to raise, knowing that it would be imbdedded into thier minds, so they playyed along all these years? I feel silly just saying these things, but its just something I was thinking about. Thank goodness I saw through it and realized the truth, or rather, what is false...but I wonder... how many people are actually caught up in religions like catholic and christianity and stuff and are basicly programmed against thier will(unkowingly)...? And how many people just go to church because of kids/and or social activity, friends, a sense of "spirituality", or one of many other reasons, even though they dont beleive the stuff.?
Rant=off


*disclamer*
Dont get me wrong, I think relegion has a lot of good values and stuff, and this is in no way a flame to any christian or the speaker of the quotes.



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Invisibletak
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Re: religion rant [Re: 2Experimental]
    #1790577 - 08/08/03 12:45 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Religion is based on good values, and probably on God as you see him. After years of this and that, and some more of this and a little bit of that its become what it is now. I do not attend church, and if I do, its in off hours to do my thing personally, not go to bible school.

Its funny, most people dont even pay attention in church, they go cause if they dont, they are going to hell. haha.

I think in the bible it says to treat your body as a temple? Or is that the book of mormom? I dunno.

That isnt bad advise, but to not do 'illegal' drugs then load up on caffiene, nicotine, alcohol, and perscription pain pills is kinda silly. I support drug use, its your god given right, but try and be safe about it. Good thing most illegal drug are safer than legal ones for you :wink:

I dunno what to say other than go with whats inside you. If you believed in someone elses god, you would be in church. You believe in your god, wich is probably the right answer man. You dont need to be the pope, or have a phd, or work for the government to see the truth, it has a way of finding you. If you can find god through your own feelings, and personal truths, im sure you can find morals there too. Let your heart be the guide.


--------------------
The DJ's took pills to stay awake and play for seven days.


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InvisibleLazerouth
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Re: religion rant [Re: tak]
    #1790628 - 08/08/03 01:01 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

good post! ive always laughed at christians and i was pretty mortified when my brother said he converted. it just seems so weak minded to me. but like you said fear of hell fury is enough for alot of people.

do you really think christianity would have many followers if it werent for eternal damnation? i mean god hasnt smitten anyone in years.

even if im going to hell at least i get to commit all the adultery i like. christians arent allowed to do any of the fun stuff in life and once they get into heaven i bet it still isnt allowed!


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: religion rant [Re: 2Experimental]
    #1790654 - 08/08/03 01:14 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I was raised a Christian as a Roman Catholic, and whent to Catholic school until I was 19.

I think everyone deserves the right to practice whatever religion they wish, without ridicule or harrassment for their choice.

That being said...

After living the life of a Catholic for fifteen years I finally realised what had been pulling at the back of my mind the entire time. What was taught, was taught to be listened to and believed without question. Authority rules.

I cannot believe without question, so I did question my religion from before I can remember. I continued to learn the religion, though, because I needed the whole picture before I could make the best choice. I finally found my answer: the Catholic religion, and all the Christianic religions I know of, are not the right answer for me. They require beliefs which are quite often not justified enough for my belief. I find the rules too stringent and out of place with what I feel to be God's true nature. There are just too many cracks, for me.

Without going off on a rant of my own, I want to say one thing:
I think it would be better to speak of Faith and Religion separately. I believe that Faith is something of a "gift", perhaps from our Creator (should one exist). I believe Religion is a construct of Man, a system built around the Faith that we are born with, a way of connecting with eachother in our spiritual beliefs. Man is flawed, however, and anything he creates is thus flawed...so Religion is flawed.

I have much Faith...but I have no patience for Religion.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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Offlineneutralizer
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Registered: 06/17/03
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Re: religion rant [Re: trendal]
    #1791225 - 08/08/03 08:27 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I agree with what everyone has said so far :smile:

I do think it is despicable that people do that to their children.  I am still trying to get over the fear of Christianity being real after all, and me deciding that it's not and then going to hell.  But according to the Baptist religion which I was a part of, since I was sincere about it when I asked to be saved I should be safe, once saved always saved:).  Though, I did have a problem with ALWAYS questioning wether or not I was really serious when I prayed the prayer to get saved.  I could never really be sure, and it was a huge horrible mindfuck because I would end up asking to be saved several times each day for many months, if not over a year, because I really wanted to be saved, but I knew that deep down I was not happy about having to give up my identity (i'm gay).  I eventually decided that I had to "just trust" that I was saved, so I made myself stop and assume that I was saved.  Then I moved to college, decided being gay was okay, and put religion on the back burner, and I find myself leaning away from what I used to believe toward more logical explanations and beliefs.

Even now, as I type this, I have a scared, fearful feeling in the pit of my stomach.  It's guilt at what I'm saying, and fear that I'm wrong and that I'm making the wrong decision.  See what I mean, a mind fuck.  @_@


--------------------
There are things known, and there are things unknown, and in between are the doors - Morrison


Edited by neutralizer (08/08/03 08:29 AM)


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Invisible2Experimental
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Re: religion rant [Re: neutralizer]
    #1791633 - 08/08/03 11:53 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

"See what I mean, a mind fuck"

Great reply, and I see what you mean by that totally. I try not to get angry at my parents, but sometimes I wonder what thier intentions were. When I finally stopped going to church, my mom kept nagging me to go and giving me a bunch of BS about how if I was saved I had to go to church. Kinda makes me sick they used religion to control me basicly, but now I am free.


And what trendal said about faith, that is a good way of putting it. "feeling" what you beleive is most important, not having some preacher telling you how your supposed to feel.


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Offlinegnrm23
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alan watts quote [Re: 2Experimental]
    #1792141 - 08/08/03 02:46 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

give us this day our daily faith
but deliver us from our beliefs...


--------------------
old enough to know better
not old enough to care


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OfflineSpokesman
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Registered: 08/05/03
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Re: alan watts quote [Re: gnrm23]
    #1792385 - 08/08/03 04:11 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I used to ask for forgivness for alot of things untill i found out God knew i was just bullshitin wit him.


--------------------


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OfflineSpokesman
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Re: religion rant [Re: 2Experimental]
    #1792408 - 08/08/03 04:18 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

2Experimental said:

*rant=on*

his demonstrates how being raised christian, is like mind control, how someone feels the need to pray every night, and that if there is a god he will "forgive me because I have reason to beleive what I believe". You can see yourself how christianity thrives on the deep subconciouss level of fear of going to " eternal hell of all damnation and horror"... not as extreme on the outward social level, but by the quotes, you can see his stress and guilt about this, and a need to feel release from this "impending doom" that will happen to them if they dont follow the god in the sky who brings justice to all and will stop the bad guys from hurting us. NOT.. Im so glad I realized what I think is the begining of truth a while ago, and freed myself from what this guy is talking about. It makes me wonder how people can raise kids and not give them another option besides christianity, dont they know its mind control? Or are they so caught up in it they dont even realize. OR do they have thier own beleifs, but decided its the mentality of the son/daughter they want to raise, knowing that it would be imbdedded into thier minds, so they playyed along all these years? I feel silly just saying these things, but its just something I was thinking about. Thank goodness I saw through it and realized the truth, or rather, what is false...but I wonder... how many people are actually caught up in religions like catholic and christianity and stuff and are basicly programmed against thier will(unkowingly)...? And how many people just go to church because of kids/and or social activity, friends, a sense of "spirituality", or one of many other reasons, even though they dont beleive the stuff.?
Rant=off


*disclamer*
Dont get me wrong, I think relegion has a lot of good values and stuff, and this is in no way a flame to any christian or the speaker of the quotes.






ACtually i deeply agree with you (thanx for quoting me) I was raised in a hardcore Christian home, but i knew i was diffrent, because i constantly asked my mother questions where she laughed and said "the lord saisd that questioning too much is a sin" But i belived this just couldnt be, what was suppose to be a god of love to me sounded like a totalitarian goverment who kept his people as brain washed slaves. And your right the reason i do feel the need to pray at night to a god i dont belive in is because that Christian, mindset is still programed in my brain, i wont deny that.


--------------------


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Invisible2Experimental
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Re: religion rant [Re: Spokesman]
    #1792627 - 08/08/03 05:10 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Ya, I wasent saying it was wrong, or flaming, or anything, just trying to put it out there in the open that this is the kind of thing that goes on in any persons mind raised, as you said "hardcore christian".... And honestly I dident used to question it, I just beleived what was told to me... I look back now and see so many things in the christian church that are just a plot to suck you in for life..... I just hope others realize....


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OfflineSpokesman
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Re: religion rant [Re: 2Experimental]
    #1793023 - 08/08/03 06:59 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah man, i hate when i try to debate with some of my family members and the debate ends in two minutes, with "you are going crazy" when everything i present connects logicly so clearly, and its all proven fact, See most of these people dont bother to read anything exept the bible, and dont know sh*t about any other religions in the world, now thats what i call closed-minded.


--------------------


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OfflineTheShroomHermit
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Re: religion rant [Re: 2Experimental]
    #1797506 - 08/10/03 08:11 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I think it's good to have "spirituality" but not "religion"
What this means to you, you're free to develop... but to me it means you should be free to contemplate your own existance and discover your own values without the contricts of organized religion. I don't think I'll ever let anyone else tell me what to believe again.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: religion rant [Re: TheShroomHermit]
    #1797523 - 08/10/03 08:31 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I think that Christianity, in the original days, was sort of made by an Enlightened person who wanted to give Enlightentment to those who are uncapable of finding it on their own, i.e., the majority of people here...

Of course, this requires the members to not question but to just blindly believe, because for them to question would undo the entire thing, since they probably wouldn't be of enough intelligence or understanding to find Enlightenment on their own.

The catch, of course, is that an Enlightened person would have to be in control at the top, so he could make sure the right things would be done... of course, others saw the power they could control by taking this in their control to manipulate the people, perhaps why the Roman Empire later embraced Christianity... eventually, the system becomes so convoulted, twisted, the purpose and meaning being lost in human's imperfections.

Some of the religious proceedings probably invoked alternate states of mind, when done with meaning and intent.. it eventually became: "We say this and this and this, it has been this way for so long, so we still do, it sucks, but it will save us"..

I think the most open-minded and truthful Christians are the ones who go off on their own, find their meaning in the Bible, and just recognize the fact that we are all imperfect, but that Jesus died for them... for them, that is all it takes. They will tell their story to others, maybe ask you of your beliefs.. and for the most part, they just live life as they wish, since free will is our gift.

I don't really claim to be that person, I believe in some of Jesus' ideas and such, but I have encountered them as described above, and they are really nice people. I'm more of a free-lancer myself, unaffliated.
Peace.


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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General Interest >> Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology

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