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Christianity + Buddhism
    #7220544 -

Are there any Christians here that do not condemn eastern philosophy?

My Christian parents are getting on my case about my Buddhist beliefs...

I believe there may have been a Jesus who who had a significant role in teaching spirituality in human history, but do all Christians believe that you will go to hell, unless you worship the Christian "God"?

I guess I'm posting cuz my dad got me this disgusting bible with all kinds of threats of eternal hell for being anything less than perfect.

Edited by Alnico (07/24/07 11:35 PM)

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7220564 -

sad to hear, but i know alot of "christians" that also take great interest in buddhism, they are out there

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7220572 -

I don't think all Christians believe that.
And I don't think there should be anyone telling you what to believe and how and why. I think that you should tell your dad that you're entitled to believe in whatever appeals you. :shrug:
Keep your eyes open and be flexible about everything, your beliefs, likes/dislikes can change all the time and when something doesn't suit you anymore, time to let it go. This life is too damn interesting and beautiful to stick to only only one belief/opinion for your whole life.
Explore :mushroom2:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7220723 -

Yeah, I'm open to Christianity. I'm even looking for a translation of the bible to read.

I am pretty firm about my beliefs, but at the same time I feel bad because my parents think I'm going to hell. They're conservative Christians and when anything bad happens ever they blame it on the devil. They think Satan has gotten a hold of me to make me think the way I do.  :whatever:  Really it was LSD.

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7220732 -

Yeah well I wasn't talking about being open to Christianity... I was talking about being open to life in general. And everything it has to offer. Believing in a dogma (be in Christian, Buddhist or whatever else) limits our views on life. Stay open to new concepts, the options are infinite. :sun:

Ohh and yes... I don't think it's a healthy attitude to think that LSD pushed you into doing anything. It was you who wanted to see things from a new perspective. It was your choice, not the acid's choice. As well as it was your choice to try LSD in the first place. Or anything else.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7220832 -

how old are you?

this may somewhat be unrelated but my parents are pretty conservative and whenever I speak my mind about certain matters with my dad, he'll say blabla "liberals" bullshit etc...

Just talk... my mom wants me to meet a jewish girl so badly and I don't really give a shit about anyone's religion as much as what type of person they are. better yet, give examples of buddhism compared to christianity and ask a fuck load of questions until, hopefully, they question themselves... or lash out against you and send you to christ camp.

at bonnaroo this was written on a port-o-potti

if only more ppl could understand it.

Quote:
Believing in a dogma (be in Christian, Buddhist or whatever else) limits our views on life. Stay open to new concepts, the options are infinite.



amen


--------------------
The best way to live
is to be like water
For water benefits all things
and goes against none of them
It provides for all people
and even cleanses those places
a man is loath to go
In this way it is just like Tao        ~Daodejing

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7221207 -

I am a Jewish-Christian Gnostic who wears a Buddhist bracelet, who has Buddhist art and statuary inside and out, and who flies two 7' Tibetan Buddhist prayer flags in the back yard, soon to have a 26" statue of Buddha placed between them.

For me, which is idiosyncratic, Buddha and Plato are the world's two greatest philosophers, East and West. They lived at the same time. It is quite possible that some of Plato's thoughts were influenced by visiting Buddhist disciples. Plato has greatly influenced Christianity.

It was the writer who called himself Matthew who stressed the Hell-fire stuff, not the other canonical gospel authors. Bear in mind that out of dozens and dozens of gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John were selected to make the New Testament Bible, the others were destroyed! It wasn't until 1945 at Nag Hammadi that many of those other gospels were discovered in a jar, in a cave under a bunch of bat guano - The Nag Hammadi library. Emperor Constantine who forced the Church Fathers to create a book that unified the crumbling Roman Empire under a Christian banner of religion, selected books to frighten people and keep them under the power of the Church of Rome. This is historical. When you take it upon yourself to learn more than your folks OR your pastor how, when and why the Bible was created, your bubble will burst. You will learn how much about Jesus has been mythologized by Greek mythic ideas, and how much has been 'embellished' by Hebrew midrash. You will discover that multitudes of people cannot discern the mythic truth from the historical events in their Christian faith, but clearly see it in other faiths. HUGE psychological blind spots are in place for those with 'blind faith.' One's faith needs to grow like everything else. The multitudes still have very stunted spiritual development. Try to see this as simple fact, not as arrogance - it is a statement about what is, not about the one stating it.

I wish you God's speed with your learning. Perhaps you should refuse to learn algebra because it was developed by Muslim mathematicians. If algebra isn't going to help you get into school or get work, you might find it useless, after it helps you develop 'formal operational thought.' Buddhist principles may help you with The Middle Way which is part of healthy Christian living whether it's articulated clearly or not. Learning how to meditate will help you clear your mind as prerequisite for Christian contemplation. The major obstacle for you will be how to reconcile the Transpersonal Absolute (Sunyata) of Buddhism with the Personal God of Christianity. This too has a solution if you study Christian mysticism and discover that our conceptions of Ultimate Reality can and do take both Personal and Transpersonal aspects. The Transpersonal Godhead is beyond God. Nothing can be posited about the Godhead any more than of Sunyata. Both words indicate the SAME Ultimate Reality, approached through different psychological ways. But, I've said too much already.

Peace be with you.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Cracka_X]
    #7221277 -

Dude, it's not about Jewish religion unless one is an observing Jew, it is about Jewish culture which contains a whole world of values, emotional responses (often overly enmeshed with children), child-rearing attitudes (usually liberal), food types, and biases against different non-Jews (ALL of whom appear to be hostile!).

I refused Bar Mitzvah - flunked out of Hebrew school. As a founder of our temple, this did not make my father look good. After dating some Jewish girls in college in Long Island, NY (the one I fell in love with went on to become a hooker and then 'the Heidi Fleiss of Aspen,' operating the largest underage prostitution ring in this country), I could not stomach the Jewish American Princess syndrome. I eventually married a Scottish-Catholic bottle blonde, who was a bad choice because she was mentally ill (which I didn't realize at the time). Another nice Jewish girl in grad school gave me an STD (my own lack of prophylaxis, but, she knew she had it and didn't tell me). Clearly, I had some bad experiences with my own culture, but much of the difficulty is because of a lack of spirituality on their part plus a stereotypical preponderance of this-worldly materialism (with it concommitant selfishness).

[Attention Readers: I don't want any s**t about being a self-hating Jew. I don't hate anyone, least of all myself. I hate disease processes however, and these spiritual illnesses are just as rife as Tay-Sachs disease among Eastern European Jews].

Now, if one's security and self-esteem is not dependent upon financial status and its badges like luxury cars and name-brand townships in which to reside, then you may well find a "nice Jewish girl," but her niceness will depend upon YOUR values, NOT the ones your mother is laying on you. If your girl likes to trip, for example), and you do too, but Mom doesn't trip and would be horrified at the notion, whose values are closer to your own heart? Which relationship has a better chance, Mom's choice for you, or YOUR choice? Overly enmeshed mothers tend to select girls that the mother can identify with, see herself in. That reinforces the Oedipal attraction in sons who have not resolved Oedipal fantasies and they end up marrying their own mother, so-to-speak. One way that guys fight this tendency is to marry someone markedly unlike their mothers. The mothers get the point, which helps them to withdraw their suffocating emotional enmeshment from their sons. I see too much of this stuff in secular Jewish culture, not to mention in my own life!

Bottom line: don't reject girls because they're Jewish, but see if there's room for additional cultural and spiritual growth - hybridization makes for spectacular specimens at times!


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7222078 -

MushroomTrip:

I'm with you about getting caught up in dogma. Christianity has come into my life because of my parents and I wish to understand it so that I can understand them, and also because knowing is better than not knowing.

I don't consider myself a follower of any one belief system. I'm just interested in untainted truth and developing a means for finding that truth.

I think my attitude on psychedelics is fine. What I said about LSD was supposed to be a half joke. I take full responsibility for my actions, but at the same time, I saw one very deep truth in particular on an LSD trip that greatly influenced the way I look a things now.


Cracka_X

I'm 21. I do ask my parents a lot of questions and try to put things into perspective for them. Hopefully one day they can open their minds that have been closed by religion.


MarkostheGnostic

I was hoping you'd reply. Is there any one translation that you'd recommend?

Anyway, it's good to see someone well versed in Christianity that isn't closed minded towards everything else.

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7222178 -

Personally, I love reading the bible for its earth grounding lessons. We can all use a little humility now and again.

I also have an excellent translation of the Tao Te Ching which I read as often as the bible. I notice many similarities and parallels in the teachings between them.

My point is, you can read virtually any type of spiritual writings, and learn something, over and over again. The writings reveal new meanings applicable to where you are in life at any given time, if you are open minded to the possibility that this will happen.:sunny::sun::biggrin:


--------------------
You are a fortunate person indeed, if you can begin each day accepting the fact that during that day there will be ups and downs, good breaks and bad ones, disappointments, surprises, and unexpected turns of events.

When you have solved all the mysteries of life you long for death, for it is but another mystery of life.

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: hummermania00]
    #7222453 -

for its earth grounding lessons.

But remember not to spill your seed on that ground.:hellfire:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7222474 -

Keep blowing them off, teach them it's the same thing.
Warn them they are becoming the one world religion revelations warns people about. Hang out with the children and elderly and see where it all came from and where it's going. We must learn to live together and what beliefe is .. as important as it may be can't be shoved down peoples throats it has to be transcended.

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7222958 -

Christianity + Buddhism = Chudanityism.

Worship it at your local drugstore.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7222992 -

I can't speak for all so called "Christians", but you can't mix the two.

A regenerate person believes the scripture. Believing a combination of the two shows you do not believe the gospel. Those who do not believe are unregenerate, scripture is very clear on this point.

BTW, everyone is less than perfect. Salvation is not about being perfect, it is about grace despite being less than perfect.

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: fivepointer]
    #7223111 -

fivepointer said:
I can't speak for all so called "Christians", but you can't mix the two.

A regenerate person believes the scripture.  Believing a combination of the two shows you do not believe the gospel.  Those who do not believe are unregenerate, scripture is very clear on this point.

BTW, everyone is less than perfect.  Salvation is not about being perfect, it is about grace despite being less than perfect.


:omg:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: fivepointer]
    #7223240 -

Last seen 22 seconds.:monkeydance:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (07/25/07 05:34 PM)

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: fivepointer]
    #7223342 -

Did you even bother to read the actual body of his post or anybody else's post? He wasn't asking if it was ok to combine the two belief systems. No one was.

You should at least read what markthegnostic said. It might do you some good. Perhaps you'll begin to think for yourself.


--------------------
All I know is that I dont know.

Row, row, row, you boat, gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, life is but a dream.

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: fivepointer]
    #7223412 -

Those who do not believe are unregenerate, scripture is very clear on this point.

Oh, I agree.:inlove:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: Alnico]
    #7223426 -

I read the King James Version for the pleasure of Old English, but mostly for Old Testament books like Psalms and Proverbs. In the seminary I used the Revised Standard Version. However, in addition to the OT/NT one volume set, I learned to read Old Testament Pseudepigrapha and New Testament Apocrypha - all of which were left out of most Bibles (although some Bibles do have books included that other Bibles do not). Translations are numerous and within these translations, scribes who translated or copied NT books made copious additions and deletions. Not all of the books by Paul were actually written by the same person. Stylistic and attitudinal changes are profoundly different. For example,the original (real) Paul was egalitarian towards women. In letters written by others under the name Paul, misogyny towards women is blatent.

It behooves someone such as yourself who wants Truth to look to some scholars for assistance. Rev. John Shelby Spong's Liberating the Gospels: Reading the Bible With Jewish Eyes is perhaps the most important book I've read about the Bible since graduating from seminary in 1978! It's not easy, but it's eye-opening and it helped me to reconcile important conflicts between faith and reason. My faith in Christ has not been weakened, it has been strengthened if anything. Those who only grasp the outer form of Christianity, and who cannot discern midrash and mythos from historical event live in delusion. Delusion makes for fanaticism. Fanaticism is about power, control and hatred, not Compassion, Wisdom and [comm]union with God. Fanaticism is not about peace, it wrongly assumes the wrath and judgement of God, which is God's alone to mete out. Since scriptures are such a mess of translational errors, scribal insertions, misappropriated authorship and other errors, the BIG LIE of scriptural infallibility can be used to justify condemning fanaticism and it therefore cannot be trusted with the faith that one ought to have in God alone.

That relationship comes from 'being in Christ,' or having 'the mind of Christ,' which is to say, having the Logos as one's Center instead of one's ego. Personally, I must translate much Biblical language into psychological terms in order to avail myself of the teachings. Christ means 'anointed' with the Logos. It means having a Transpersonal, Transcendental Center as one's Master-motive (Compassion) by which all of our other motives are guided. If something is incompatible with Compassion it should be rejected. Most rejected motives are called 'sin' in the Bible, and being guided by the master-motive of Compassion is said Biblically as 'having Christ as one's Master.' Demythologize the language, destroy the imaginary images of the long-haired, bearded Jewish peasant from your early Bible story-book memory, and internalize what it means to "be in Christ," and you're beginning to make use of the archaic language of the Bible.

The Father in the sky is the same archetype as Zeus. Hades rules the underworld.
Hermes, the Messenger of Father Zeus decends to Hades to free Persephone, The Kore, the daughter of Mother Earth Demeter (which means The Mother in Greek). Nature is redeemed. The Child of Nature is saved. She symbolizes all of the Children - humankind. This is pure mythology. It is ancient and it is Pagan and it is still Holy, only the names have been changed to supply a new agenda, which has been in place for 2000 years. Zeus-God the Father, Jesus-Hermes, Hades-Devil, Demeter-Nature, Persephone-Humanity.

Church Fathers even created the notion that the Devil put all these obvious parallel stories in place to deceive people after Christ was to be born! The depth of deception has in fact come from Christianity! Roman Imperialism became Christian Imperialism. It is a colossal collective Ego, not the transparent Universal Truth that you seek, that is to be found "in Christ," and Christ is not found in a book. Christ is Present to you here and now, or Christ is nowhere to be found at all. "Go into your inner room/inner chamber/closet/private room to pray..." (Matthew 6:6) [See, there is still some good things in Matthew of the hell fire and brimstone stuff]. Cut out sensory input, go within, and seek Christ in the inner chamber of your Heart. This is what the Eastern Orthodox Christian Hesychasts have made perfectly clear if anyone wants to know about the deep forms of Christianity.

Peace Out.



--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

Edited by MarkostheGnostic (07/25/07 06:32 PM)

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Re: Christianity + Buddhism [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #7223733 -

Good stuff. That seems to be in agreement with how I think of it.

In any case I get most of my learnin from meditation.

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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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