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Will you accept ----- as your personal....
    #5597837 -

Just wanted to make a point.

The general vibe of this forum seems to be to complain about how christians are always trying to convince other people to join in their worldview...

So christians blame others for not thinking like them, and the same people here who are complaining about that also blame others for not seeing things their way, and often calling people who think differently un-awakened, less aware or whatever

Show those christians a good example by NOT trying to make them see why drugs are good for you and telling them they should get layed more often..


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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #5597906 -

Everyone has a world view and we are here to promote and debate them. I am willing to have any Christian tell me their story and debate it as long as they don't threaten me or anyone else with eternal damnation and fiery torture. I don't believe it but I worry that some might and I'm always going to present a counterpoint to threats like this.

Outside of that, (and that is personal for me) I don't mind some heated debate as long as we try to keep the personalisms out.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #5597911 -

That's the problem with believing in made up things that don't exist, like religion. Everyone is right and accuses everyone else of being wrong. And since the beliefs are based on invisible beings not in evidence, no rational thoughts or common observations are possible to refute them and people are left without any sort of commonality. This breeds adversaries.

Let that situation fester for a while, and you get denial, wars, witch burnings, oppression, prohibition, suicide bombers and all the rest.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Edited by Diploid (05/06/06 07:05 PM)

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Diploid]
    #5597919 -

I've seen far more evangelism from atheists here than I have from the faithful. I personally see little difference between these two forms of evangelism. It's all just a battle of egos.


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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Icelander]
    #5597920 -

The challenge lies in accepting someone's world view without arguing or debating it.

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #5597921 -

I no longer use drugs, and can't really see why Christians would want to use them. Even though Marijuana gives you a sort of spiritual experience, just as the mushrooms do. For me being sober all the time I feel great. I feel healthy.

The Christians that I can think of, take the word of the bible over anything. Sort of closed-minded. As the preacher starts his Sunday morning.

You could say that us shroomerites are free-thinkers. Who haven't been filled with Christianity.

That's about all I can think of at the moment,
Octavius

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Silversoul]
    #5597923 -

Yes, exactly.

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: moog]
    #5597928 -

SilverSoul can you explain Evangelism to me?

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Silversoul]
    #5597930 -

True, but I haven't heard any athiests threaten anyone with hellfire and brimstone like fivepointer does with his petty little god.

Chime in here fivepointer and tell us what you think.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Silversoul]
    #5597932 -

I've seen far more evangelism from atheists here than I have from the faithful

Asking for evidence in good faith is not evangelism. It's the bedrock of critical thought. You used to know this.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Octavius]
    #5597933 -

Octavius said:
SilverSoul can you explain Evangelism to me?


Evangelism is essentially the continual attempt to convert people, or establish one's beliefs as superior to another's.


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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Diploid]
    #5597941 -

Diploid said:
I've seen far more evangelism from atheists here than I have from the faithful

Asking for evidence in good faith is not evangelism. It's the bedrock of critical thought. You used to know this.


I still know this. But it is rather dishonest of you to act as if this is the only thing atheists such as you are doing on this forum. You and several others here have made every attempt to ridicule faith and portray atheism as the only possible sane position. That is evangelism.


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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Diploid]
    #5597953 -

Quote:
That's the problem with believing in made up things that don't exist, like religion. Everyone is right and accuses everyone else of being wrong. And since the beliefs are based on invisible beings not in evidence, no rational thoughts or common observations are possible to refute them and people are left without any sort of commonality. This breads adversaries.

Let that situation fester for a while, and you get denial, wars, witch burnings, oppression, prohibition, suicide bombers and all the rest.


But that is only half of the truth.
Every inflated ego conceals objective truth, may it in spirituality or rationality.
The inflated rational ego says "Money makes the world go round and money is the mean to superiority, wealth and pleasure for everyone. Hierarchic material power systems will keep every man in line and partake in the monetary system. And I have nuclear weapons, too."

Wise spiritual and rational men and women tend to let everyone cook its own soup, as long it doesn't negatively interfere in the others objective reality.

edit: Oops, I am quite late with this. One time, half an hour nothing happens and then 5 people answer in three minutes :wink:


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

Edited by BlueCoyote (05/06/06 03:30 PM)

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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Silversoul]
    #5597961 -

You and several others here have made every attempt to ridicule faith...

Asking for evidence of a claim is ridicule? Pointing out where a system of beliefs contradicts itself is ridicule?

Where you see ridicule, I see critical thought and a search for Truth, whatever it may be.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Diploid]
    #5597969 -

You are again being dishonest in portraying your position. If you were merely asking for evidence, I would applaud you. But you have maintain the most condescending of attitudes towards beliefs which recognize a higher power. You are the second biggest evangelizer here, next to Skorpivo(yes, even fivepointer is not as bad as you). There are several skeptics here who maintain an honest skepticism towards others' beliefs(MushmanTheManic comes to mind), but you, sir, like to pretend that ridicule and hostility are the same as skeptical inquiry.


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Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Silversoul]
    #5597991 -

But you have maintain the most condescending of attitudes towards beliefs which recognize a higher power

Actually, all I do it put forth my ideas and let the natural selection of vigorous debate decide if they're worth holding on to. See, that's the difference between you and me. I would change my mind in a moment were a rational refutation to my ideas presented, but EVERY refutation takes the form of "I experienced it and it must be true even though nobody outside my head experienced it" or some variation of that.

The True Believer will not change his mind, no matter what line of reasoning is presented, no matter what evidence; not even if it makes perfect sense. They won't even discuss hypotheticals if there's any hint that the discussion might show a hole in their belief system.

It's the True Believers who are intellectually dishonest.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Diploid]
    #5598027 -

Diploid said:
That's the problem with believing in made up things that don't exist, like religion. Everyone is right and accuses everyone else of being wrong. And since the beliefs are based on invisible beings not in evidence, no rational thoughts or common observations are possible to refute them and people are left without any sort of commonality. This breads adversaries.

Let that situation fester for a while, and you get denial, wars, witch burnings, oppression, prohibition, suicide bombers and all the rest.


yea, but paranormal things asside, I was more thinking about moral issues etc. whcih seem to conflict between christians and avarage shroomer. Both have their views and beliefs, and I just think that a typical shroomer has no more right of pushing their moral convicitions than christians have pushing theirs


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Octavius]
    #5598035 -

Octavius said:
I no longer use drugs, and can't really see why Christians would want to use them. Even though Marijuana gives you a sort of spiritual experience, just as the mushrooms do. For me being sober all the time I feel great. I feel healthy.

The Christians that I can think of, take the word of the bible over anything. Sort of closed-minded. As the preacher starts his Sunday morning.

You could say that us shroomerites are free-thinkers. Who haven't been filled with Christianity.

That's about all I can think of at the moment,
Octavius


But shroomers are also closeminded toward christian views, so they are no more open-minded than anyone other. Have you actually seen someone change their mind during discussion here on this forum? That rarely happens, shroomers are pretty close minded people, just like everyone else.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: Diploid]
    #5598041 -

Diploid said:
But you have maintain the most condescending of attitudes towards beliefs which recognize a higher power

Actually, all I do it put forth my ideas and let the natural selection of vigorous debate decide if they're worth holding on to. See, that's the difference between you and me. I would change my mind in a moment were a rational refutation to my ideas presented, but EVERY refutation takes the form of "I experienced it and it must be true even though nobody outside my head experienced it" or some variation of that.

The True Believer will not change his mind, no matter what line of reasoning is presented, no matter what evidence; not even if it makes perfect sense. They won't even discuss hypotheticals if there's any hint that the discussion might show a hole in their belief system.

It's the True Believers who are intellectually dishonest.


Diploid, as much as I remember you, you were never wrong about asking for proof, it's just that you were always asking the wrong questions.

When someone says he thinks angels exist, you ask them to bring you a feather...

You are always testing peoples limited understandings about certains concepts instead of testing the concepts themselfs


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Will you accept ----- as your personal.... [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #5598054 -

Both have their views and beliefs, and I just think that a typical shroomer has no more right of pushing their moral convicitions than christians have pushing theirs

and

Show those christians a good example by NOT trying to make them see why drugs are good for you and telling them they should get layed more often..

Well, while I think everyone should put fourth their ideas and beliefs, especially if the intent is to scrutinize them in debate, the problem with not opposing fundamentalist anti-drug Christians and their ilk is that they aren't content to sit by and talk about their beliefs. They actively organize and try to foist their beliefs on the rest of us through legislation of morality and political influence peddling.

That's why free-thinkers get riled up over fundamentalists.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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Shop: North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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