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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: therewatchingme]
    #781642 - 07/28/02 08:02 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Fair enough.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Offlinewhiterastahippie
lover

Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 718
Loc: look into a child's eyes,...
Last seen: 21 years, 4 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: therewatchingme]
    #781689 - 07/28/02 08:38 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

the truth will set you free. hmmmm...is it me? or is that a bible verse?

so faith is blind? and logic is the only religion??? I'M CONVERTED!!I SHALL NO LONGER BE A CHRIS....wait, and here i was thinking you were an open minded person after reading yur long story post all about drugs helping you see things from every angle. but then i come in here and i see you make close minded statements like that.

who likes pizza? damn it, i'm hungry!


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Peace and Love to all!

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Offlinetherewatchingme
The GreatMilenko

Registered: 07/09/02
Posts: 217
Last seen: 21 years, 7 months
Post deleted by Moe Howard [Re: whiterastahippie]
    #781701 - 07/28/02 08:45 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)



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[Everything stated above is, fictional, and is a result of a delusional mind, role playing]

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Offlinewhiterastahippie
lover

Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 718
Loc: look into a child's eyes,...
Last seen: 21 years, 4 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: therewatchingme]
    #781725 - 07/28/02 09:02 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

oh. ok braa! that's totally cool. the way you phrased it seemed kinda harsh. but who hasn't been guilty of that once or twice eh? not everybody believes in God and that's cool with me. i go to mass today, and i had a thunderstorm of a religious experience that just proved to me that no matter what logic may say, i know what i feel, hear and see when God wants to talk to me. i am racked with sobs and tears (lemme tell you, in a CATHOLIC church, people looka t you funny for this.)
but hey my brother. you have a wondeful day. because i know i will. peace!


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Peace and Love to all!

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OfflineDroz
Love of Life
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/15/00
Posts: 2,746
Loc: Floorida
Last seen: 8 years, 8 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #781820 - 07/28/02 10:03 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I once had this jehova's witness say i was closed minded to the truth of god and jesus christ. I tried to explain to him if he never heard of the bible would the same god in his mind exist. He gave no reply.

God and the Bible are just human ideas. Some humans think that there is truth in our minds when hey... who the fauk knows? Not i.


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Evolution of Time.

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Offlinewhiterastahippie
lover

Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 718
Loc: look into a child's eyes,...
Last seen: 21 years, 4 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Droz]
    #781840 - 07/28/02 10:12 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

hey braa! did you know that for the first three hundred years of christianity all the christians have was a few letters from the apostles, and the jewish torah, which they didn't really use? did ya did ya did ya? yep, that's right braa, no bible for the first three hundred years, then they wrote the bible to fit their beliefs so they could pass them on to later generations...so what was God in thier minds? exactly what they wrote about him in the bible. them JW's need to learn history. love and peace brothers!


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Peace and Love to all!

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Invisiblebuttonion
Calmly Watching

Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Kansas
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: whiterastahippie]
    #781923 - 07/28/02 10:56 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

yeah, but buttonion, we must remember to call no one a fool. that is for them to decide in themselves.

Totally dude.


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Concepts which have been proved to be useful in ordering things easily acquire such an authority over us that we forget their human origins and accept them as invariable.- Albert Einstein

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Offlinewhy
journeyman
Registered: 06/03/02
Posts: 50
Last seen: 21 years, 8 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Droz]
    #783152 - 07/29/02 01:36 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I once had this jehova's witness say i was closed minded to the truth of god and jesus christ.


I once tried to get a couple of them to take hallucinogenic mushrooms, they politely declined. (and never came back)

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Invisiblemisterogerz

Registered: 06/07/02
Posts: 1,433
Loc: Gulf Coast
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #783380 - 07/29/02 05:22 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

im not sure if anyone has said this point yet, but i got the idea from one of Evolving's posts:
The believer's are selfesh because they try to have their sins forgiven to save themselves in the afterlife, thus implying they cant deal with what they deserve, i think it's more infavor of the nonbelievers because they try not to redeme themselves and are prepared for what they deserve, and the believers are just adding selfishness of not wanting to deal with what they've done to their so called 'sins'


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:potleaf: :tendshroom: :potleaf:
:leaf::peyotespectrum::leaf:

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: therewatchingme]
    #783416 - 07/29/02 05:41 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

You are an egoist, and therfore, quite deluded. Your ego, or viewpoint is precariously inflated (I recommend you read the Myth of Icarus and Daedalus sometime soon). No one's ego is it's own guiding light. Reality dosn't work that way, and of course, if you believe that your own ego is a 'guiding light,' which is a metaphor for God, then I have come full-circle - you are deluded.

If nothing else, a little bibliotherapy from a source that can help you cognitively understand the difference between ego, and the vaster field of Psyche which ego is 'born from,' say Edward Edinger's 'Ego and Archetype' - the first chapter.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: misterogerz]
    #783444 - 07/29/02 05:57 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I have an Egyptian papyrus depicting the soul of the dead being weighed on a scale against a feather. This papyrus [reproduction] pre-dated Christianity, and much of Judaism as well. The notion of being pure, and like unto God Himself is a very, very old idea. The light, airy, non-earth-bound soul has become 'lighter-than-a-feather - figuratively. It is not about being selfish, it is about being selfless. One's 'self' does not 'get into' Heaven - only one's Love 'gets in.' This is why the high religions stress Compassion and Love so urgently - that is the Nature of Ultimate Reality, and one's spirit must be transformed, transfigured, transubstantiated - into the Nature of Ultimate Reality, which is God.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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OfflineTeKHeAD009
Stranger
Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 760
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: whiterastahippie]
    #783662 - 07/29/02 08:23 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

we make each other seem ten times worse than we really are.
I agree... I got sick of reading this after the 3rd page.

Great swami, your atheist, and I'm religious. Some Christians arnt really christians - thats nothing new. I have no problems with athiests - I dont friggin care what you believe or dont believe. I would like athiests to have the same ideas about me. No need for this. If from what you've experienced Christians and athiests dont seem different maybe you've only been meeting not so real Christians.

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: TeKHeAD009]
    #783985 - 07/29/02 11:02 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I dont friggin care what you believe or dont believe.
(Feel all the love pouring down...) You are being dishonest here else you would not have posted.

I would like athiests to have the same ideas about me. No need for this.
Funny, but it is ALWAYS the Christians trying to impose their views, not the other way around. It would be nice if there were equal respect, but there is not.

Do atheists go on missions to brainwash the primitive heathens? No.

Do atheists go door to door to try to tell you about their views of religion? No.

Is the mushroom illegal because of atheists or because of the Catholic Church? (Read up on Coretez and the Aztecs - the first drug prohibition.)

Do atheists tell you that you will go to hell while adopting a superior attitude, but committing the exact same sins? No.

Abortion, Gay rights, pornography, marijuana... Who is meddling with whom?

If from what you've experienced Christians and athiests dont seem different maybe you've only been meeting not so real Christians.
That is an incredibly weak argument. Why don't statistics show any difference? This is NOT just my opinion or life experience!

Christ was NOT a Christian!


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Anonymous

Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #784466 - 07/29/02 02:58 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Wow Swami!

Many of your very own posts could be considered to be proselytizing for atheism. I cannot count the times when I have encountered arrogant atheists consumed with their empirical evidence putting down the ignorant Christians on the Internet.

So much so in fact that I delight in carving them up with Occam's razor.

Atheists are not better people than Christians, even hypocritical Christians. History is replete of the slaughter of Christians by atheists. Today, in China, they martyr Christians.

Your diatribe is a little one-sided.

Cheers,

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OfflineTeKHeAD009
Stranger
Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 760
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #784581 - 07/29/02 03:53 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

(Feel all the love pouring down...) You are being dishonest here else you would not have posted.
I'm not being dishonest. Where did you read dishonesty from me? My statment was that I dont care what you believe or dont believe. How can you draw dishonesty from that without assuming something. I wanted to share my opinion about christians vs. atheists and that was: I dont care what you believe - I wont force my beliefs on you - if you dont ask questions in an attempt to scof at me or persuade me. That is what your doing isnt it? As for the pouring love, their is no real reason for you to sarcastically remark on my word friggin'. Their was no anger behind my post.

Funny, but it is ALWAYS the Christians trying to impose their views, not the other way around. It would be nice if there were equal respect, but there is not.

I'm not imposing anything their... Again your assuming something about me. Perhaps I worded it wrong - I would like athiests to have the same mindset as I for dealing with people of a different belief. Is that better? My way of dealing with people of a different belief: You believe what you want, and I'll believe what I want. Same as before.

Have I imposed my religious beliefs on the primitive heathens? No.

Have I gone door to door trying to tell you about my views of religion? No.

Is the mushroom illegal because of the athiests or because of the Catholic church? Yes I have read about the first drug prohibition in the Americas, and the answer is: The Catholic church....

...but is that of any relevence? No.

Abortion, gay rights, pornography, marijuana... These are all different issues that everyone has different opinions on. They are also not relevent. Whats your point?

That is an incredibly weak argument. Why don't statistics show any difference? This is NOT just my opinion or life experience!
This statment is just as weak as mine. What statistics? Show me the statistics that dont show any difference between atheists and Christians. You cant gather statistics about that - and if you can I want to see it.

You seem arogent, I agree with Mr. Mushrooms.

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784670 - 07/29/02 04:34 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

History is replete of the slaughter of Christians by atheists.

The Christians were killed by other equally stubborn dogmatists with a political or counter religious agenda. I do NOT belong to any cohesive anti-God* group. I have NO dogma nor agenda (except to be left alone by ANYONE wanting to meddle in my personal freedom).

I think you are astute enough to realize that I have nothing to do with Communist China and you know that your argument has no legs.

*I am not anti-God at all, more agnostic than atheist. I am anti-"stop trying to change me and place your morals on me".



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The proof is in the pudding.

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Anonymous

Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #784702 - 07/29/02 04:47 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I understand your position and you have been sufficiently clear why you hold it. But I am not talking about you, I am talking about your idea that atheists are better people than Christians.

If I thought my argument had no legs I wouldn't have posted it.

Please explain why it is an insufficient rebuttal.

Cheers,

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: TeKHeAD009]
    #784718 - 07/29/02 04:54 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

How can you draw dishonesty from that without assuming something.
The word "friggin'" implies vehemence and distaste, which means that you in fact, do care enough to display emotion.

Have I imposed my religious beliefs on the primitive heathens? No.
Have I gone door to door trying to tell you about my views of religion? No.


Are you now saying that it is NOT a basic tenet of Christianity to "spread the word"?
Was I imagining it when the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses came to my door? I am imagining it that I stopped writing to my niece because in every letter she would tell me that I was going to hell and that I needed to be saved?

Was that you in particular? No.

Do you belong to an organization that attempts to spread the gospel? Most likely.

Do Christian get carried away in their "enthusiasm"? Frequently. (Read up on the history of the destruction of the Hawaiian culture by missionaries.)

...and the answer is: The Catholic church....
Which is a Christian organization.

What statistics? Show me the statistics that dont show any difference between atheists and Christians. You cant gather statistics about that - and if you can I want to see it.
I will see if I can find them. In the meantime, go to ANY church and check out the number of obese people. Then go into the parking lot and watch how many people light up. Then go to one of the singles events and check out the number of divorced parents.

You seem arogent.
Perhaps, but not so arrogant as Christians telling me that they know how I should communicate with God.

Like almost every other poster who's beliefs I have challenged, you get into my (perceived) personality traits which are irrelevant to the discussion.



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The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784738 - 07/29/02 05:05 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

But I am not talking about you, I am talking about your idea that atheists are better people than Christians.
I do NOT hold the idea that atheists are in anyway better than Christians - PERIOD. Clear enough?

I do hold the idea that Christians, for all their alleged superior connection with God and the Holy Spirit, demonstrate no moral superiority, nor do they (as a generalized group) even live according to that which they preach.

Christ came down pretty hard on hypocrisy. Was he arrogant?

If I thought my argument had no legs I wouldn't have posted it.
I thought I did. Do you truly believe that I am in anyway affiliated with comuunist China which has a very specific agenda of suppressing any beliefs counter to their own. I don't personally care what belief you hold as long as it does NOT overlap into my affairs. Tell me how to make this clearer.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Anonymous

Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #784783 - 07/29/02 05:21 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I didn't know you were a Communist. j/k

If those are your points then they are abundantly clear. However, it also appears from certain comments that you think atheists are superior people.

I did not say that you were a Communist or affiliated with Communist China. My argument was that atheists have killed Christians for their faith and therefore are in no way morally superior to them. You missed my point.

In any event, while generalizations are helpful to a degree they are not completely accurate when dealing with individual members of a group.

Broad brushes paint poor pictures.

Cheers,

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