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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784801 -

Broad brushes paint poor pictures.

Isn't that a generalization?

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784822 -

If you are insinuating that my statement is untrue or violates some law of logic, please by all means, instruct us. Or were you merely being didactic?

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784827 -

You missed my point.
Perhaps, but I will try one more time here to make my position understood.

It is one group of dogmatists killing another group of dogmatists. I am NOT a part of ANY group with an agenda. I am a group of one. Christians (and Communists) have a fairly clear-cut agenda to mold others in their image and likeness.

In any event, while generalizations are helpful to a degree they are not completely accurate when dealing with individual members of a group.
Of course they are not completely accurate, but by belonging to a group, that signifies that the groups actions are by-and-large acceptable else one would not belong.


Summation:
Christian moralizers have indeed impacted my life on both a personal and political level. My lack of belief in the Christian view of God affects no one but myself.




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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #784877 -

I think this is one of those mobius dialogues where both parties think they are misunderstood.

For the record, I did not misunderstand the point(s) you were making. I was simply pointing out aspects of your statements that you made while you were placing your emphasis somewhere else.

Of course they are not completely accurate, but by belonging to a group, that signifies that the groups actions are by-and-large acceptable else one would not belong.

That is incorrect. If a person belongs to a large category s/he are not responsible for the actions of the group as a whole or for the actions of any one particular person in the group.

Example: I am a Christian. But I do not act the way others in that broad category do. I do not force my beliefs on others but only give answers to questions that are asked by people that are sincerely looking for them. I define sincerity as the ability to listen to my answers without being offended. If you live a life of love and compassion people are drawn to you and you don't have to force religion down their throat.

Christian moralizers have indeed impacted my life on both a personal and political level. My lack of belief in the Christian view of God affects no one but myself.

Also incorrect. When you make immoral choices you have an effect on the world. That in turn affects everyone including Christians.

Example: If you have ever voted for a pro-abortion candidate predicated on your lack of Christian faith and that candidate helps create and sustain laws that cause the life of humans to by killed by abortion, yo uhave indeed affected many people.

Swami, most of our actions affect others, and sometimes very significantly. There is no escaping that.

Cheers,

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784904 -

I merely find it humorous that you were discussing generalizations and then you used the phrase, 'Broad brushes paint poor pictures' in reference (I assume) to generalizations. That statement is itself, a generalization.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #784908 -

No, your lack of belief in a TRULY Christian view of God is a loss for everyone. As to an agenda: you are uncritcally seeing anyone who confesses Christian faith as one of 'them,' which is simple prejudice. I am a Christian who has no agenda; moreover a Real Christian Knows that only God supplies the Consciousness [Spirit] that converts or transforms humans. Anything else is just ego that some loser has identified with being Christian. Christians are supposed to bear witness, not knock on your door early in the morning and challenge you. I respond when asked or provoked. All else is inappropriate.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #784916 -

Yes, my word friggin carried some emotion - but that does not mean my statment about not caring was dishonest. Why would I lie about that? I gain nothing from it. Why I posted about not caring: because I wish that atheists would take the same mindset and not care if I believe in God. (Not that I do, but) If I were to say I was christian, but not do anything that the bible tells me then thats my problem. Why should you care? Question the individual, not every christian.

Are you now saying that it is NOT a basic tenet of Christianity to "spread the word"?
Yes it is... but I've been taught in all my years of christianity to not forcefully tell people about the word, but perhaps sugest comming to church sometime. A simple 'yeah I go to church, ya wanna come with me sunday, or sometime?... No, well, if you ever change your mind I go every sunday' sorta thing. Believe me, I hate it just as much as you when mormens/jehovah witnesses come to my door and tell me that what I believe is wrong.

You find those statistics I seriously would be interested in seeing them. However, I'm not interested enough to count fat people in my church, or people who smoke.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784939 -

I see. Do you know of the branch of analytic logic that deals with such statements?

Was that humor risible? I couldn't tell from your posts.

Cheers,

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #784942 -

No, your lack of belief in a TRULY Christian view of God is a loss for everyone.
Please explain.

As to an agenda: you are uncritcally seeing anyone who confesses Christian faith as one of 'them,' which is simple prejudice.
It is not an attitude I adopt lightly nor uncritically. Am I to discard my thousands of negative experiences which are on-going and reinforcing?

I realize that anecdotes have little weight, yet this is what I have to go on. Recently a born-again Christian was propounding on Christ, sin and being saved. I asked him if theft was sin. He said yes. I asked if theft of a service was as much of a sin as theft of a good. He said yes. Then I asked why he was using my apartment weight room facilities (not as a guest). He explained that he used to live here, but moved across the street to save money. I explained that I was paying higher rent for these facilities and that he was stealing from me. Then I asked if he would continue to use them knowing that it was theft? Of course he would. Ah the power of rationalization.

Lead by example, not by hollow words!

I am a Christian who has no agenda; moreover a Real Christian Knows that only God supplies the Consciousness [Spirit] that converts or transforms humans.
Guess I have never knowingly met a real Christian.

Christians are supposed to...
Reality and shoulds are frequently at odds.

All else is inappropriate.
Agreed.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784964 -

Do you know of the branch of analytic logic that deals with such statements?
Irony?

Was that humor risible?
No, it was visible, I saw it in your post.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #784974 -

I think Satan has you by the balls.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #784987 -

Irony?

No, it's a little more evolved than that.

Ah yes, visible. I see what you mean.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #785019 -

I think Satan has you by the balls.
Not one of your deeper responses. Care to elucidate?

I think one of the great myths held by Christians (as a group) is that because atheists don't believe in God and heaven/hell, that they have no moral compass which is totally untrue. I consider myself a person of the highest order of integrity. My word is my bond. I will do anything for a friend and I do not want that I have not fairly earned.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: ]
    #785022 -

Aristotle believed in Satan?
Oh, wait... was that a metaphor?


I'm slowly seeing the real intentions behind the play... now I have to wonder why.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Sclorch]
    #785042 -

No, Aristotle believed in Santa, but he was dyslexic.

Edited by Evolving (07/29/02 07:12 PM)

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Sclorch]
    #785060 -

You guys had better tone it down or I'll sic Shroomism on ya!

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #785076 -

I was joking. LOL!!!

I have known many atheists whose moral compass was so much better than some supposed Christians it was embarassing.

Of course very few people think they are bad people. We all tend to see ourselves in a good light. Some think that when Christ said love your neighbor as yourself that is what he meant. View them as you do yourself.

Cheers,

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #785084 -

That really seems like an insignificant thing to hound on someone about.
On several threads pertaining to Christianity I've seen you pick out a statment made by a Christian and make a sarcastic remark about how unkind it is. Such as the 'can you feel the love pouring out' quote from eariler.

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: TeKHeAD009]
    #785093 -

I think 'ol Swami's trying to point out the hypocrisy in some self described Christians' behaviors. I would think that it would be welcome if you were truly trying to improve yourself.

Edited by Evolving (07/29/02 07:27 PM)

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Re: The Christian and the Atheist [Re: Swami]
    #785094 -

Ummmm.....
I think that any static philosophy is gonna weaken you...
Really....you don't know.
The pope doesn't know...
Jimmy Swagart know's booty is good, but still doesn't know...

Really, the Christian CHURCH has very little to do with Christianity. I don't think that you're looking at Christianity in the proper light (not that i blame yoU, lot's of CRAP out there)...I think Christ ROCKED! Many of my favorite lessons in compassion come from the Christ mind...
But being a STAUNCH beliver in Christ is as stupid as being a STAUNCH athiest.

I don't think that..
k...
let's finish this one with a line from the JEWS...
When given a choice between two options, choose the third.

Hope that clears this up...

Hmmm...
also wondering why so many christians are here (ie, @ the shroomery)...
Is this like some religious right teen evangelism initiative?

hahahahhahahhahaha!

Thx,
the pale e

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