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Invisiblespudamore
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Exsistance
    #3453186 - 12/06/04 03:39 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

does anything exsist before they are discovered?

like radio waves before marconi discovered it?


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InvisibleSuper_Blunt
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Re: Exsistance [Re: spudamore]
    #3453199 - 12/06/04 03:44 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

:twirlyface: yes


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Invisiblespudamore
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Re: Exsistance [Re: Super_Blunt]
    #3453218 - 12/06/04 03:49 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

how do you know if you haven't discovered it?


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OfflineCanonPants
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Re: Exsistance [Re: spudamore]
    #3453457 - 12/06/04 06:27 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

This thread is stupid...

Did America exist before it was discovered?


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Invisiblespudamore
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Re: Exsistance [Re: CanonPants]
    #3453462 - 12/06/04 06:33 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

stupid???how so?

if it wasn't discovered how would you know it exsisted?


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Exsistance [Re: spudamore]
    #3453477 - 12/06/04 06:46 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

Obviously you wouldn't know that it existed, but that certainly doesn't mean that it wasn't actually existing beforehand. :wink:

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Offlineheadset
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Re: Exsistance [Re: spudamore]
    #3453478 - 12/06/04 06:46 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

You wouldnt know it existed, but it would exist without you knowing. YOU are not the centre of everything.


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Invisiblespudamore
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Re: Exsistance [Re: fireworks_god]
    #3453485 - 12/06/04 06:50 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

would that be the same if you created something aswell?


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InvisibleFreakQlibrium
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Re: Exsistance [Re: fireworks_god]
    #3453499 - 12/06/04 07:13 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

Obviously you wouldn't know that it existed, but that certainly doesn't mean that it wasn't actually existing beforehand.

Sort of interesting you put it that way man, as i guess that is the entire crux of my recent conversion and hence my (reality view) on the independent existences of all those "things" lol i have mentioned elsewhere, now see? Am i not showing the restraint i promised? :wink:


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Exsistance [Re: spudamore]
    #3453500 - 12/06/04 07:14 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

spudamore said:
would that be the same if you created something aswell?




That gets a little more difficult because you have to draw a distinction between the creation when it comes to be, the creator, and all of the influences on the act of the creation.

I'd need an example to go on. I have troubles seeing independant, completely seperate and distinct objects and phenomenon in reality. :grin:

However, it certainly doesn't exist until the moment in which it comes to be, whether it is a continous process of creation or not. Knowing of existance and existance itself are different things (although knowing of existance is obviously a part of existance itself, to continue onward in that direction) :nut: :grin:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleFreakQlibrium
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Re: Exsistance [Re: headset]
    #3453503 - 12/06/04 07:17 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

headset said:
You wouldnt know it existed, but it would exist without you knowing. YOU are not the centre of everything.




That was interesting as well as that TOO(in addition to FWG's post) is also the crux of my position: That there are THINGS(yes, including places :wink:) that exist totally outside of whether we want to believe them or not or whether we CHOOSE* to believe them or not and that we ourselves are NOT the centre of everything


*Okay so i am excercising restraint but i guess my sense of sublety and nuance needs a little work :grin:


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Offlinetrinity7
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Re: Exsistance [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #3453628 - 12/06/04 09:22 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

That kinda reminds me of this Zen Koan:
If a tree fell and nobody`s in he woods to hear it, would there be a sound ?


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Exsistance [Re: trinity7]
    #3453671 - 12/06/04 09:45 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

""If a tree fell and nobody`s in he woods to hear it, would there be a sound ? ""

would it still have fell?


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Exsistance [Re: Gomp]
    #3453682 - 12/06/04 09:52 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

""does anything exsist before they are discovered?

like radio waves before marconi discovered it? """


have you ever heard people talking about how it really just is this moment? and everything happen when everything happen?
when you ex-hale do you stop in-haling?
when you ex-hale do you in-hale, depending on how you frame it?

inventing.

hearing the word, make me say in vent what already was in vent ing..

and that is a Norsk English mixs of IN WAIT ING
like it was in standby modus and such?

"we are allways here, always there"
-Unknown :P


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InvisibleFreakQlibrium
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Re: Exsistance [Re: trinity7]
    #3453700 - 12/06/04 10:04 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

What if there WAS somebody in the forest but the tree hit them on the head B4 the tree hit the ground, would it have made a sound then? :grin:


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Offlineoceansize
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Re: Exsistance [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #3453708 - 12/06/04 10:09 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

On the quantum level, no, things don't necessarily exist until you go looking for them. On the macroscopic level, they do. For example, electromagnetism and radio waves- Maxwell disccovered them I believe? The theory of radio wave just explains an already exisiting phenomenon or evidence. Before Maxwell, we had the etheral theory.

You never really discover something, just what it is.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Exsistance [Re: oceansize]
    #3453727 - 12/06/04 10:21 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

some of creation is always in formation
the example of america is meaningful only on a more cosmic scale.
stil a fractal aspect of personal existence makes valid example but only metaphorically.
the extension would relate to our cosmos as a fractal totality yet mere subunit within a larger fractal element of ongoing creation - etc.


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Exsistance [Re: spudamore]
    #3453895 - 12/06/04 11:40 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

Is there any reason whatsoever that it would not exist before discovery?  :rolleyes:


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Exsistance [Re: Gomp]
    #3453898 - 12/06/04 11:42 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)

We should all chip in and buy Gomp an English dictionary!  :grin:


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OfflineGomp
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Re: Exsistance [Re: zorbman]
    #3453924 - 12/06/04 11:53 AM (12 years, 6 days ago)



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Edited by Gomp (12/06/04 12:06 PM)


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