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Re: Yes, God created evil [Re: shakercee]
    #7472918 -

Quote:
Does he point out amazing facts like this?


Yep. I'm told there's no point to worship as why does god need it's ego stroked? People building churches and temples do it to make themselves feel good and superior to the "uncivilised" (ie:different) folk.


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Re: Yes, God created evil [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #7473048 -

Quote:
Yep. I'm told there's no point to worship as why does god need it's ego stroked? People building churches and temples do it to make themselves feel good and superior to the "uncivilised" (ie:different) folk.



There's one kind of love for animals, there's another kind of love children, there's another way for your spouse, another way for your neighbor etc.

Worshipping God is the Love that God deserves. He's that awesome, and nothing else would be right.

And it feels so great to know that you are loved and belong, and that God appreciated your love for him. Because what can we offer to him, that he hasn't given to us first? But the sacrifice of our lips in worship and obedience from a pure heart is something that is priceless.

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Re: Yes, God created evil [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
    #7473092 -


Of course God can prevent evil. He doesn't because he allows the natural consequences of things to happen, and because if he judges us all for sin then we would all be destroyed a long time ago. God is patient, and he has chosen to save the final judgment until the end. But he does work in human affairs to this very day, and he establishes justice and government.


Sez you. I think you make this all up for your personal comfort. Once again we have people telling us all what the so called omnipotent creator is all about. I think it's a form of death anxiety. I for one take the challenge of living with chaos and uncertainty. For me the rest is spiritual cowardice. But to each his own.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (10/01/07 10:04 AM)

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Re: Yes, God created evil [Re: Icelander]
    #7473195 -

Icelander said:
[I for one take the challenge of living with chaos and uncertainty.


We're here anyways, right? :headbang:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Yes, God created evil [Re: vigilant_mind]
    #7473320 -

vigilant_mind said:
Quote:
I don't believe in a dualistic morality. If good and evil balance each other out, then they are equal, and good is not any better than evil. In that case, they are either both good or both evil, and to call them 'good' and 'evil', respectively, is to create confusion linguistically speaking.


So you would see no difference in having consensual sex with a girl you love versus having your bones broken by an enemy? Clearly there must be some division of terms here...


You're missing what I'm saying here. You were defining good as the opposite and equal force to evil. I was replying that they are not equal, and could not be, by definition. It's the difference between consensual sex and rape. Something about the latter makes it worse, from within our experience. It's not a totally objective thing, but it's just different. It's a matter of distinguishing the feelings of both from each other. How could you say that consensual sex (which is good) is equal to rape (which is bad)? You said that moral good is the equal and opposing force to evil, which I don't see. (And even if somebody felt that consensual sex and rape were equal, they would then be saying that either both are good or both are evil. Unless we want to destroy an aspect of our language, one could not be good and the other evil.)

But I was saying that if you're using the terms 'good' and 'evil' to describe two things which are equal, then you're not defining them by the conventional definitions of those words. 'Good' is, by definition, better, or else it would not be desired over what is bad. What definition of good is there but that? If you're saying they're equal then they're not good and evil, they're something else. Maybe mark-lar and mark-dar?


--------------------
"I threw a small stone down at the reflection of my image in the water, and it altogether disappeared. I burst as it shattered through me, like a bullet through a bottle... and I'm expected to believe that any of this is real!" -mewithoutYou

"To believe in the wide-awake real, through all the stupefying, enervating, distorting dream: to will to wake, when the very being seems athirst for godless repose: these are the broken steps up to the high fields where repose is but a form of strength, strength but a form of joy, joy but a form of love." -George MacDonald

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Re: Yes, God created evil [Re: stellar renegade]
    #7473370 -

Quote:
You're missing what I'm saying here.


...as you are missing what I am saying.

Quote:
But I was saying that if you're using the terms 'good' and 'evil' to describe two things which are equal, then you're not defining them by the conventional definitions of those words. 'Good' is, by definition, better, or else it would not be desired over what is bad. What definition of good is there but that? If you're saying they're equal then they're not good and evil, they're something else. Maybe mark-lar and mark-dar?


When I say equal, I mean in terms of rate of occurrence (of course this is a little difficult to verify statistically; I'm speaking from personal experience), not in terms of preference. The distinction I am capitalizing on is the disparate nature of different experiences we have while here on Earth.

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Re: Yes, God created evil [Re: vigilant_mind]
    #7473414 -

Ah, okay. I apologize then. I thought you were saying, as I take dualistic morality to mean, that good and evil are equal and opposite forces in the sense that one does not (even conceptually) have the upperhand over the other.


--------------------
"I threw a small stone down at the reflection of my image in the water, and it altogether disappeared. I burst as it shattered through me, like a bullet through a bottle... and I'm expected to believe that any of this is real!" -mewithoutYou

"To believe in the wide-awake real, through all the stupefying, enervating, distorting dream: to will to wake, when the very being seems athirst for godless repose: these are the broken steps up to the high fields where repose is but a form of strength, strength but a form of joy, joy but a form of love." -George MacDonald

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Re: Yes, God created evil [Re: a_guy_named_ai]
    #7475145 -

I'm afraid that all of your anthropomorphizing about God (not to mention attributing a male pronoun), based on ancient Hebrew midrashic writing is as puerile as the rest of the multitudinous 'Peoples of the Book.' Get a grip and stop attributing your literalization in the 21st century to the mythic and metaphorical midset of ancient Hebrews. They, almost certainly (except for children and tribal idiots, never took all their God-talk literally. Even ancient people had enough sense to use linguistic devices to describe the Mystery of existence and the even more Incomprehensible Mystery of its origin.

Your current theology is on a par with a child's 'Big Book of Ancient Gods and Goddesses.' Take note that the disappearance of God's Divine Consort, YHVH's Asherah was a male fear-based reaction to the Eternal Feminine in all of its classic forms: Isis, Ishtar, Asteroth and its variation Asherah. Bearded boys masquerading as grown men while fearing the feminine. The twin cherubs on the Ark of the Covenant were doubtless Egyptian in appearance like the numerous Isis figures of ancient Egypt stretching forth winged arms - symbolizing male and female aspects of God (implicit in the Name Elohim - masculine and feminine). Symbolism then, symbolism now.

God is not the animation of Zeus (Greek, compare with Deos, Latin) found in Walt Disney's original 'Fantasia' and if one is going to use the word God at all (I prefer Being personally), one should realize that it is metaphysics one is discussing, not personality theory. Metaphysical language recognizes that God is formless and as such personality, attributes, actions and anything else described by the verbiage of verbs (e.g., loving, wrathful, jealous, forgiving, etc.) is the pathetic attempt of the human mind to project its own content onto the Formless and Incomprehensible.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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