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InvisibleMr_Gubjet


Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 323
Loc: Infinitus Kosmos
0 is relative
    #2486034 - 03/31/04 02:43 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

So 0 doesnt actually exist. Its just a concept.

So there is no centre to anything really.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2486042 - 03/31/04 02:50 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

First of all, how do you figure that 0 is relative? Second, why do you assume that "relative" is the same as nonexistant? Third, how can you say that there is no center to this image?


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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InvisibleMr_Gubjet


Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 323
Loc: Infinitus Kosmos
Re: 0 is relative [Re: silversoul7]
    #2486058 - 03/31/04 03:04 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

silversoul7 said:
Third, how can you say that there is no center to this image?





In physical space that is just an image thats very tiny. It has no centre in Space. It could be anywhere.

All I am saying Space has no centre. So there forth 0 is relative.


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InvisibleMr_Gubjet


Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 323
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: silversoul7]
    #2486062 - 03/31/04 03:05 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

1. Thinking and pondering 2. Relativity exists for sure.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2486115 - 03/31/04 03:30 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

If relativity exists, and zero is relative, then zero exists.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2486124 - 03/31/04 03:32 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

In physical space that is just an image thats very tiny. It has no centre in Space. It could be anywhere.



All that means is that its center is movable, but only insofar as the image itself is movable. As you scroll down the screen, the center moves, but it is still the center of the image nonetheless.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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InvisibleMr_Gubjet


Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 323
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: silversoul7]
    #2486161 - 03/31/04 03:55 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Its all semantics.

All I can say is zero doesnt exist.

Semantics, semantics, semantics.


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InvisibleMr_Gubjet


Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 323
Loc: Infinitus Kosmos
Re: 0 is relative [Re: silversoul7]
    #2486167 - 03/31/04 03:58 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

silversoul7 said:
Quote:

In physical space that is just an image thats very tiny. It has no centre in Space. It could be anywhere.



All that means is that its center is movable, but only insofar as the image itself is movable. As you scroll down the screen, the center moves, but it is still the center of the image nonetheless.




Yes for people who cant look out side the box. In there reality it is there centre of vision or an image. But besides that its a debate between centre and no centre.

Thanks for letting me look at other angles.

Im just confused now.


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Invisiblezeta
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2486319 - 03/31/04 06:01 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

0 sits on the datum
The datum sits wherever you put it
How does that mean 0 is nonexistent?


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2486472 - 03/31/04 09:12 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

> So 0 doesnt actually exist. Its just a concept

If you have just one apple, does one exist, or is it just a concept? If you eat that one apple, how many apples do you have left?

If zero is just a concept, then one must also be just a concept. In this example, the numbers (zero, one, etc) are measures of units (apples).

There is a large difference between nothing and no thing.


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OfflineLangis
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Seuss]
    #2487972 - 03/31/04 08:28 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

"If you have just one apple, does one exist, or is it just a concept? If you eat that one apple, how many apples do you have left?"

Depends on how you look at it.When I consume the apple it will always be a part of me.I'll use it's energy and dispose of what I don't need.If you assume any one part of a "apple" is still a part of it, then I can assume I will always have the apple.Supposidly matter can neither be created nore destroyed.That being so then how does zero exist except as a concept?


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OfflineFiddleMyDiddle
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2487997 - 03/31/04 08:42 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

You cannot visualize 0 in the physical sense, but you can explain it.

0 in real numbers:
0 represents a unit of measurement (i.e. none). It can be proven mathematically to exist.
Its an inductive proof. It is conceptual, but just because it isn't countable does not make it
non-existent. A proof, however, will show that it is valid.

0 in theory (math):
0 (usually described by phi/theta in symbols) represents the empty set.
The set with nothing in it. I.E. a set of 0 apples is a null set. You can also prove
this to exist using math.

0 in circuitry:
0 is the absense of a charge in the capacitor (give n take, for the most part).

In fact, without 0 you probably wouldn't be posting to the shroomery right now :-)
Remember, theory and complex mathematical data sets don't necessarily exist in the physcail world. But that doesn't prove its inexistence.

edit, forgot conclusion:
In my opinon, 0 is not relative to anything, since in any case it represents the nothing of a set(countable or uncountable).


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You laugh at me because I'm different.
I laugh at you because you're all the same.
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Edited by FiddleMyDiddle (03/31/04 08:53 PM)


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InvisibleMr_Gubjet


Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 323
Loc: Infinitus Kosmos
Re: 0 is relative [Re: FiddleMyDiddle]
    #2488038 - 03/31/04 09:00 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Well the main point of this post. Was that there is no centre of what we call 'Space'. Physically 0 does exist then.

That is all.

Carry on...


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InvisibleMr_Gubjet


Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 323
Loc: Infinitus Kosmos
Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2488044 - 03/31/04 09:02 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

So I guess 0 and Void are they same thing. Then would Void ever exist it self?

Void = No input


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Offlinefalcon
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2488095 - 03/31/04 09:18 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

0 exists, what it represents by definition does not.


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Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
I have done it before and it never has an effect on the true believer so what is the point?




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OfflineFiddleMyDiddle
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2488633 - 04/01/04 12:16 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

>> Then would Void ever exist it self?

Before there was stuff to fill it (you might not be able to attach a time to this :smile: )

>> Was that there is no centre of what we call 'Space'

The center of anything, however, is relative to how 'center' is
applied to a given object.  (think centroid vs. center).
If the universe is finite, but expanding away from some point,
then it does have a center.

just my .02$
:crazy2:


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You laugh at me because I'm different.
I laugh at you because you're all the same.
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OfflineEvilGir
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: FiddleMyDiddle]
    #2495721 - 04/01/04 07:53 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

>Well the main point of this post. Was that there is no centre of what we call 'Space'. Physically 0 does exist then

Well the universe is infinite, kinda of expanding and looping in on its self as for 0 well that simple does exist. It can mean balance like if something can have a + charge or - charge or it can have neither ie 0.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: EvilGir]
    #2498573 - 04/01/04 09:15 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

> Well the universe is infinite

Why must the universe be infinite? Seems to me to be the opposite, finite. We know how much mass the universe has, which is finite. We know how big the universe is, which is finite.


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Invisiblemr crisper
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: EvilGir]
    #2498691 - 04/01/04 09:19 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

the universe breathes out.
the universe breathes in.

nature runs in cycles.

the days and nights of brahm.


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: 0 is relative [Re: Mr_Gubjet]
    #2505448 - 04/01/04 01:38 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Mr_Gubjet said:
Well the main point of this post. Was that there is no centre of what we call 'Space'. Physically 0 does exist then.

That is all.

Carry on...




You are assuming the universe expanded equally from its center ?
Well, i guess it didn't but i believe everything started at coordinates {0,0,0} .
Btw, physically 0 doesn't exist, 0 exists as a concept to idealize the non existence of things .... very handy when it comes to math :wink: ....

MAIA


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Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
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