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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Does the truth matter?
    #2237002 - 01/12/04 02:13 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I was recently at a party where my friend ran into a girl he knew back in 8th grade, and she was surprised to find out that my friend still went to church. She said that she got over the whole Catholic thing long ago. This got me thinking: Does it matter who's right here? They both seem pretty happy with their beliefs.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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Offlinewhite_light
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237032 - 01/12/04 02:29 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

catholics have worse karma than other people at least I think. that can depond on personal virtues but as a general rule I think you are better off as a spiritual person on a good path instead of being in a religious catholic life.


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Offlinewhite_light
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237033 - 01/12/04 02:29 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

how do I get the picture beside my name?


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: white_light]
    #2237039 - 01/12/04 02:34 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I'm afraid I don't get what you're saying. My Catholic friend is a good person. Otherwise I wouldn't be friends with him. I don't see how he would have worse karma than anyone else. Sure, he tends to blindly follow a religion that I personally think is bullshit, but who am I to judge? He seems happy with it, and isn't harming anyone else with his beliefs.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237042 - 01/12/04 02:34 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I guess that depends on your priorities. If you just want straight up all encompassing bliss, perhaps adopting strong religious beliefs is for you. Or better yet, how about heroin?

If you are truly seeking answers, blindly adhering to any belief isn't going to get you there.


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Offlinebenjamin
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237043 - 01/12/04 02:35 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

oh my oh my, truth... don't get me started. truth is such a vague word it sickens me. what's worse is taking symbolic logic, which attempts to boil all ideas into stupid compacted syllogisms. the truest of ideas in my mind is that real truths don't exist except maybe in math, and even in math a solid proof beyond an elementary concept is rare and skeptical and probably false. its really impossible to say who's right in your case, both are probably wrong, but if they truly desire to be christian or an atheist or anything else then by being so they are affirming their own existence and are both right, in my opinion.


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Invisiblemuhurgle
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237049 - 01/12/04 02:38 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

That depends entirely upon what the "goal" is, doesn't it? You can't talk about right or wrong without something to measure it against.

If your goal is "search for truth", then it seems to me that accepting the idea of the catholic church is the wrong one just because it's an idea that incorporates blind faith in the idea itself.

Btw, not saying that the teachings of the catholic church is wrong, but the incorporation of blind faith rules out any further search for truth.


--------------------
"To make this mundane world sublime
Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

Aldous Huxley


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: muhurgle]
    #2237075 - 01/12/04 02:56 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

If your goal is "search for truth", then it seems to me that accepting the idea of the catholic church is the wrong one just because it's an idea that incorporates blind faith in the idea itself.



See, that's the thing: I'm wondering if the "search for truth" is really a worthwhile pursuit. Perhaps the search for happiness might prove more productive.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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OfflineFrog
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237082 - 01/12/04 02:59 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

silversoul7 said:
I'm afraid I don't get what you're saying. My Catholic friend is a good person. Otherwise I wouldn't be friends with him. I don't see how he would have worse karma than anyone else. Sure, he tends to blindly follow a religion that I personally think is bullshit, but who am I to judge? He seems happy with it, and isn't harming anyone else with his beliefs.




I've noticed that statement before in reference to someone following a belief, or religion. "Blindly following". Why do you say that? Does he really "blindly follow" the Catholic religion? Or has he chosen to go to the Catholic church because he is fulfilled by belonging to that church, after studying what it offers?

As to your friends, one done with Catholicism and the other not, we all have different beliefs. I quit going to Catholic church when I was 18. I have a friend who has similar beliefs to mine, but still goes to Catholic church. You don't believe in religion? Or just the Catholic religion?

See, I just respect people's beliefs, even if I no longer believe in them. Just because I no longer follow the Catholic faith doesn't mean I look down upon anyone else who follows it.


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The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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Invisiblemuhurgle
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237093 - 01/12/04 03:04 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

See, that's the thing: I'm wondering if the "search for truth" is really a worthwhile pursuit. Perhaps the search for happiness might prove more productive.

Yes, my point is that your goal is arbitrary. To measure if something is right or wrong, you measure it against your goal, but what do you measure your goal against?


--------------------
"To make this mundane world sublime
Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

Aldous Huxley


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: Frog]
    #2237127 - 01/12/04 03:18 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Does he really "blindly follow" the Catholic religion? Or has he chosen to go to the Catholic church because he is fulfilled by belonging to that church, after studying what it offers?



Having known him since our freshman year of High School, I can say with certainty that he does indeed blindly follow the church. Not just that, but he seems to apply blind faith to just about everything in his life, even when I present him with proof that he's wrong. He doesn't even try to refute the proof I give him. He'll just say "nope," or "I disagree." It's almost like a willful ignorance.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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Invisiblemuhurgle
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237138 - 01/12/04 03:22 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

It's almost like a willful ignorance.

That's the defintion of faith, isn't it?


--------------------
"To make this mundane world sublime
Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleZero7a1
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237139 - 01/12/04 03:23 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I was watching the news the other day, and they were speaking about a report some scientists did on the affects of choice and consumerism and what not. They posed the question, "do more choices mean more happiness?"

The study response said no. The over abundance of choices seems to have made people MORE depressed. And you know what I think? I think they are right. "Life" is too complicated. I cant live in a simple quiet peace, cause i have to make sure my family is okay, by that i have to go to college, go to work, take care of car, drive car, be told what kind of stupid shit to buy for car. Told what kind of shoes i have to wear for work, i have to have black pants to fit the dress code for work. I have to sit in traffic for work, to be late cause other car doesnt wanna drive right, cause they dont think about other people!

Maybe im different, because im not content with my lifestyle, im not content with what was handed to me by the corporate dream generator. I wanna make my own life, I want to live in a world where people dont have to waste their lives stuck in traffic, or being bombarded by absurd radio and television commercials.

I dont really have any beliefs, am i destined to be discontent? Am I destined to have this insane jabber of bullshit ringing in my head for the rest of my life? I guess you could say im just loooking for the truth, im not happy though, maybe its just cause i havent got where i need to be, but maybe thats where having faith comes in... Maybe its taking a risk.

Anyone as confused about this shit as I am?


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What?


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Offlinebenjamin
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: Zero7a1]
    #2237143 - 01/12/04 03:25 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

has anyone here read descartes meditations on philosophy?


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2237148 - 01/12/04 03:27 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

See, that's the thing: I'm wondering if the "search for truth" is really a worthwhile pursuit. Perhaps the search for happiness might prove more productive.

Obviously, you can't truly come to a sweeping conclusion for EVERYBODY on this...For some people finding the truth, IS in itself a search for happiness...For some people, they'd rather grab the nearest moral morsel of belief that makes them happy, no matter how far off from reality other's may think it is. Everybody is different.
So I'm assuming you're speaking for yourself...
The way I look at it...is that everybody must find the truth within themselves...I don't believe anybody has the right to impose their beliefs on another human being, basically speaking. There's an infinite number of "truths" out there...Which ever one makes you the happiest.


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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Invisiblemuhurgle
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: Zero7a1]
    #2237164 - 01/12/04 03:34 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

If you want to find "truth", you're destined for discontent.

That it's better not to sit in traffic for work, is just another meaningless idea. Why is anything better than that? Because it makes you happier? Why is it more important to be happy? Why don't we all just do heroin (or soma)?

Life is a lot like watching tv. If you're not concentrating, you're sucked in by what's happening, it seems real and meaningful. If you think about it, it's crap.


--------------------
"To make this mundane world sublime
Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleZero7a1
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: muhurgle]
    #2237260 - 01/12/04 04:11 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Another bleak perspective. I give ya credit :wink:. But, why is that all there has to be? I guess the truth is just a white rabbit in a box, you cant ever see the rabbit, but they tell you its there. So your looking through a labyrinth to find it, and the journey is what its all about? And when you find "the rabbit" you find your "truth". Its like a really bitchy ass puzzle.


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What?


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Does the truth matter? [Re: Zero7a1]
    #2237284 - 01/12/04 04:23 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

What I find intriguing is how in smaller countries without a lot of choice yearn for more choice on average, and then once a country gets more choice, then you get the whole "too much choice to be able to choose" thing... it seems like most people like to have a happy balance between having too much freedom and not having enough freedom... or something.. :nut:
Peace.


--------------------
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If I should die this very moment
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For I've never known completeness
Like being here
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