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OfflineFliquid
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871252 - 09/09/02 08:00 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Read my signature for the answer...


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:dancing: My latest music! :yesnod:


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Anonymous

Re: Truth? [Re: Fliquid]
    #871253 - 09/09/02 08:03 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Good heavens, not another absolute truth!  :shocked:

Yes, I think you have something there.  Truth, by definition, needs definition. :wink:

Cheers for defining, 


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OfflineFliquid
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871259 - 09/09/02 08:09 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

It is logical, and sounds to me like the most likely answer.

Do you disagree?  :confused: 


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:dancing: My latest music! :yesnod:


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OfflineFliquid
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871264 - 09/09/02 08:13 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

not another absolute truth!


indeed.
As stated, it depends on the persons self created definition of its own truth.
Truth is a generate ripple in our water, generate by speculation of one or more indeviduals.

KKK members fully believe that black people are the cause of a lot of terrible things.

Isn't that a good example?  :smirk: 


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:dancing: My latest music! :yesnod:


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Anonymous

Re: Truth? [Re: Fliquid]
    #871279 - 09/09/02 08:48 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Not only do I agree, I wholeheartedly concur or something like that that.

"Such a relation which relates itself to its own self (that is to say, a self) must either have constituted itself or have been constituted by another."

Kierkegaard


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OfflineFliquid
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871282 - 09/09/02 08:59 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Its both, and its compiled through observation and conclusion based on examples.
General conclusion is always generate from a minor or more examples given by a constitute from another.


--------------------
:dancing: My latest music! :yesnod:


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Anonymous

Re: Truth? [Re: Fliquid]
    #871290 - 09/09/02 09:07 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Oh well done!  I thought you might enjoy a quote from my favorite Danish Theistic Existential philosopher. :wink:

Cheers for Soren, 


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OfflineFliquid
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871294 - 09/09/02 09:12 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Please give me some feed back on my previous post. Make it still concerning the truth issue you threw on the forum...  :crazy: 


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:dancing: My latest music! :yesnod:


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OfflineLOBO
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871318 - 09/09/02 09:33 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

"All truths, are semi truths"
The Kybalion


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OfflineFliquid
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Re: Truth? [Re: LOBO]
    #871328 - 09/09/02 09:42 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Be a tree, be a bee, be a bee on a tree...  :smirk: 


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Truth? [Re: infidelGOD]
    #871329 - 09/09/02 09:42 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

By the strictest definition of "absolute truth" - only "existence" is certain.

I agree.


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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Offlinevaporbrains
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871444 - 09/09/02 11:19 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

he who knows, speaks not. he who speaks, knows not. -Lao Tzu

also, see Nietzsche for the most revolutionary thought on truth in the past 100 years.



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All refrences to and statements concerning mushrooms, mushroom cultivation, and mushroom related paraphrenalia refer specifically to the cultivation of legal species.


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Anonymous

Re: Truth? [Re: Fliquid]
    #871472 - 09/09/02 11:40 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Alrighty then:

"General conclusions are always generated from minor premises that arise from other premises?"

Is that what you are saying? That is my comment tucked inside the statement you made. I don't know where you are going with this but as long as you don't ask me for gas money it's cool.

Cheers for constitution,


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InvisibleWhiskeyClone
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871489 - 09/09/02 11:47 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

To me, truth is just those things that I have come to believe (for whatever reason) beyond a reasonable doubt. In this sense, truth is ultimately subjective. To a Christian, God exists. That is the truth; there is no argument. To me, God does not exist; that is the truth. Since every individual mind has its own unique perspecitive of the universe, there can be no real standardization of truth. We can share the same beliefs, but that's about as close as two separate minds can get to mutually 'knowing' something is true.

Science is a method of testing based on these shared beliefs, until it can be shown that something is true beyond a reasonable doubt. Again, 'reasonable' is subjective, but I still feel confident enough saying that if I throw some balsa wood in some distilled water, that I am CERTAIN it will not sink.

I'll start by saying that not all truths can be shoehorned into a 'scientific' paradigm or schema. In other words, you may know something is true without analyzing it using scientific instruments. Various experiences that we all have fit into this category. For example, I know that I love various people. The fact of that evidences itself in reality by the actions I take toward them. I don't use beakers and test tubes to know this. I simply observe the actions I make and conclude it is true.

Contrary to belief, science is NOT a method of determining 'the truth' with quantitative instruments such as beakers and test tubes. Our culture has associated white labcoats and bubbling Erlenmeyer flasks with 'science,' but it's more of an ideology than anything else. Science is two things: a) a body of 'knowledge' that has been tested to the extent that one can feel safe assuming it, and b) a method of testing this knowledge such that one can believe it beyond a reasonable doubt (the scientific method). The reason quantitative measurements are most often used for science they allow us to share certain beliefs with little subjectivity; a milliliter to me is almost certainly the same as a milliliter to you, or to Nelson Mandella or Michael Jordan. Standardization like this makes communication much easier. We can't really accurately relate emotions to someone else, as we can with figures and quantities. There are established processes for determining what is valid scientific data and what is not, and so far this system has worked quite well. Not many people would disagree that the oceans have salt in them, but it can never be truly 'proved.' To use our observations for any good, we must each individually decide what we are willing to assume and what we are not. If we assumed nothing, we would know nothing, and wouldn't be able to do anything science has allowed us to do (build complex structures, travel to space, etc.) In theory, we could be wrong about every single thing we 'know,' but I doubt it.

But who is to say that the psychological processes involving the emotion of love cannot be distilled down to specific neurons firing in specific, measurable ways? Just because humans cannot pinpoint the physical cause of 'love' does not mean we never will. You technically don't 'know' that you love a particular person; you are just aware of a particular emotion that your upbringing and education has taught you is to be labelled 'love.' It may be the same emotion others experience that they describe as love, or it may not be. So technically, you don't 'know' that you love a particular person any more than I 'know' that the coffee makes me hyper. You have just identified a particular emotion with your particluar schema for the word 'love', which may or may not be similar to another person's schema for it. But I'm sure that you KNOW that you do 'love' certain people. Certainly you believe it enough to assume it.

The term 'truth' is definately anything but concrete, because we cannot possibly all share the exact same schema for it. Or anything else for that matter. The best we can do is believe, but people have varying standards for what is believable or not.

Heheh that was long. Must be the coffee.


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:


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Anonymous

Re: Truth? [Re: LOBO]
    #871490 - 09/09/02 11:47 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Yes and all trucks are semis as well. Don't forget 4's, all 4's are semiphores.

Whatever are you talking about?

The statement itself is a truth is it not, or so you are maintaining? Well then, ipso facto it negates itself.

But thanks for playing. Here's a home version to amaze your friends with. Johhny, tell him what he's won......

Cheers,


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Anonymous

Re: Truth? [Re: vaporbrains]
    #871495 - 09/09/02 11:50 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

"he who knows, speaks not. he who speaks, knows not. -Lao Tzu"

Yet another statement whose existence negates itself. The idea that knowledge, which is a subset of truth, is incommunicable is in itself preposterous.

Next,


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OfflineFliquid
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871505 - 09/09/02 11:52 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Yes, thats right. And it starts from a very young age. So the child (even with a lack of much examples) shall generate its own conclusions, and store them as the basics for live. All based on first time experiences.

So truth is based on first time experiences that are reexperienced time after time, after time. Reanalysed and restructured in levels of truth.

Example:

1. Truth Horse. 10
2. Truth Fly 6

- Truth horse is encountered but seems to be a bit wrong. It is altered or removed if concluded from external input that it is totaly wrong.
- Truth Fly is encountered and reaction to Truth Fly is positive (rewarded by chemical pleasure reactions in the brain, happiness) so Truth Fly goes up a few points and grows to level 8

This means every tiny little thing is catagorised and recatagorised every milisecond of a second. Like a gameshow where people are running around reordering books in high and low shelves.


--------------------
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Anonymous

Re: Truth? [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #871514 - 09/09/02 11:55 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Good entry. I give it a 7 cuz I like the beat.

A cursory glance tells me you've been sniffing the wine corks again.

Seriously, there is a lot of substance in what you have said with a few things that I disagree. I want to give it a full treatment and not just rattle something of the top of my acidhead so I'll postpone a substantial review and commentary for later.

Thanks Cyber chump, that was pretty good by my lights.

Cheers for the Scientific Method,


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Anonymous

Re: Truth? [Re: Fliquid]
    #871527 - 09/09/02 11:59 AM (19 years, 23 days ago)

Whew, well at least I got it right. I was really sweating it there for a while. I see you picked up another mushroom to your rating. Here, let me add another.

We need to talk more about this. If English is your second language I am most impressed.

Sincerely,


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InvisibleWhiskeyClone
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Re: Truth? [Re: ]
    #871535 - 09/09/02 12:01 PM (19 years, 23 days ago)

I eagerly await the full treatment  :grin: 


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:


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