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Re: Judgement & Spirituality [Re: dorkus]
    #8307205 -

klimt, many find that living the life of passions gives theyre life no meaning, they turn 50 and have a nervous breakdown.
Can this be said to give life meaning in the long run? When living in epmitness, in a detached & aware space the body still carries out its "passions" and enjoys life (more so than before i may add) but you no longer believe that you posses this body/mind as you are no longer associated with the body/mind.

You attitude of defensivness is only natural, it is the ego defending itself, which is fine im not even labelling ego bad, im saying misidentification with belief in being the ego causes much misery in the long run, by all means live a life of passion, but enquire from time to time who isit that is living.

Its all about whether there is an inner ache within you of a certain unfullfillment that makes want to go much deeper, or if fear comes when you look deeper, if fear is there ask who is scared? The ego. If you wish to delve deeper into the truth of life then you have to start looking past your own ego's passions & desires.

It just simple if you want to be enlightened then your ego has to die, the ego is terrified of this.
I dont have time to make it sound nice anymore :wink:
You have to mentally die before you physically die.
The one who "wants" has to die, the one who wants is ego.

To become one with all, all must not be separated, if absolutely nothing is separate how can you desire that which is already you? Many have gone into meditation where nothing is separate and there is no desire, as desiring yourself is ridiculous! This ties in with Lao Tzus statement of "do nothing, acheive everything"


I play guitar, keyboard, record bands, write alot, read alot, smoke a bit, drink a bit, trip on shroomz, have great sex when i get the chance, go on road trips, i have seen over half the world, i dont believe you have to separate from the world, once you are in emptiness, abiding in the self, the body is left to play out its wondrous life & alot more energy is available when you arent drawn into your desires, ironically giving you much more energy to fullfill these desires.

:peace:


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Re: Judgement & Spirituality [Re: Chronic7]
    #8307296 -

Chronic777 said:
...
It just simple if you want to be enlightened then your ego has to die, the ego is terrified of this.
I dont have time to make it sound nice anymore :wink: ...


liberation is not death
ego is not an enemy
the whole thing here is
simplistic, argumentative, and overly rational while dealing with things that are entirely related to direct experiencing.
the important terms are surrogates for something indescribable but they are being used as if in a high school essay as if they were actual definable terms comprehensible by a quotidian mentality.

also
if you don't take more time
you wont get enlightened
the reactions and rebuttals are too swift and unecessary.

you do have time.
that is all you have to share


--------------------
:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Judgement & Spirituality [Re: redgreenvines]
    #8307321 -

I know all this effort is futile, i guess im just tired of people who claim to want enlightenment then cling to theyre ego's desires thinking this way they will be enlightened, heres a nice quote from my teacher about enlightenment to show it is very easy and the belief that i am what i perceive (body/mind/ego etc...) is a big hinderence


Question:

Mooji, is it really possible to become or to gain enlightenment ? Has there be anyone who has become enlightened or awake through coming to Satsang and if so, could you say who ? ( All laugh )

Mooji:

In truth it is not possible to become enlightened as you put it because no one is there as such to become enlightened in the first place. The firm recognition or realisation that there isn't a 'somebody' in reality to gain enlightenment, and that there can never be an entity at any time, either now or in the future, to gain any such state, is what amounts to enlightenment. This direct realisation occur and become revealed, confirmed and convincing truth through the process of self enquiring. 'Self-enquiry', also called atma-vichara, is one effective means of exposing the unreality of the 'I-concept', or ego, ordinarily felt to be the fact of oneself, leaving the pure immutable Self as the single an perfect reality. This is the ultimate truth.

You ask: 'Is there anyone who through attending Satsang has become awake'. This has already been addressed in my previous statement but I will further add here that there has been and continues to be the constant recognition of this fact that the ego identity is a myth, a fictitious character. That individuality as such is an expression of pure consciousness/beingness and not the fact or definition of that Beingness. That oneself remains behind as the witness or the noticing of the phenomena arising spontaneously in consciousness. That ones true self is formless and nameless presence only which arises or shines as peace, joy and happiness felt as loving contentment. When this recognition occurs within each individual point or expression of consciousness known as a person, that state is called 'awakening' or 'enlightenment'.
You ask that I point out if there is such a person present here ? In common language I will say a number of persons here have arrived at this point of clear seeing/being beyond mere intellectual or academic understanding or acceptance. However, the mental tendencies and identification aren't instantly or completely destroyed and the ego-sense, posing as the seat of reality, though expose through enquiry as mere illusion, continues to appear; this is natural. The duty and challenge here is to repeatedly bring this I-individuality sense back into the heart/source whenever it arises and by training the attention to stay in the source, which is your true self, it gradually merges in the source and become the source itself.

Now from this placeless place in total emptiness as emptiness, beyond the concept of emptiness, you effortlessly are. You didn't become this or gain this because there is no one here to gain anything. Out of, yet within this indescribable awareness the consciousness rises and shines as I-ness perceiving. And whatever arises here are mere apparent forms of I-consciousness being perceived.

:peace::heart:


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Re: Judgement & Spirituality [Re: dorkus]
    #8307434 -

Some of you tried to clarify that in Buddhism you can have healthy desires, pleasures, and attachments (so long as you never become too attached). But I get the sense that the goal is to become desireless and passionless.

I will not follow any philosophy that tries to suppress our passions (desires, emotions, attachments). I find it wrong for reasons I stated multiple times. That is not to say I don't think we should avoid unhealthy desires and emotions.

I like my path. You like yours. I don't find myself suffering.

Put simply, as Socrates said about truth, I say this: The passionless life isn't worth living.

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Re: Judgement & Spirituality [Re: klimt]
    #8307548 -

Ok... just make sure you stay out of those Doritos, once you eat one you can't stop - unless you exert some sort of self-control/suppression.


--------------------
As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.

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