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Shop: Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: converge_]
    #6708306 -

"Man tries to make for himself in the fashion that suits him best a simplified and intelligible picture of the world; he then tries to some extent to substitute this cosmos of his for the world of experience, and thus to overcome it. This is what the painter, the poet, the speculative philosopher, and the natural scientist do, each in his own fashion. Each makes this cosmos and its construction the pivot of his emotional life, in order to find in this way the peace and security which he cannot find in the narrow whirlpool of personal experience.”


-Albert Einstein

http://www.cs.ucla.edu/~slu/on_research/einstein_essay2.html

:uptosomething:


--------------------
Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
  The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
  The frumious Bandersnatch!

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: converge_]
    #6708310 -

Or look at the species referred to in the article quoted above. I was going to link you to the thread in which it was posted until I finally realized it was this same thread. :grin:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: converge_]
    #6708647 -

As I stated in my original post so called "micro-evolution" (changes within a pre-existing kind of life form) does exit, but "macro-evolution" does not. Where does the information come from to go from a lower order life form to a highter order more complex life form? How do you go from a single cell to a whole human? The information which is more ordered and extremely complex can not simply appear out of no where. Simple logic just on this one point alone blows the theory out of the water. Many other points can be brought up that conflicts with the theory.

The real reason for the resistance to challenging the "theory" is men have preconceptions, and these preconceptions prevent them from seeing simple logic.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6708724 -

"How do you go from a single cell to a whole human?"
Much much time is required, and then there is a power of 'organisation' that works against entropy.
It is assumed, that in very ancient cells, there even weren't any mitochondria (the power plants of our cells) and that they were a separate 'life-form' which in some time of evolution combined its existence in a symbiotic way inside of our former cell, the bacterium, where before, they existed quite more independently.
So we not only exist of many many single 'bacterias' which evolved and organised into body-cells, but also of organs, which are also quite independently living inside us, like 'animals', and even in each of our cells,  there lives a former independent organism, the mitochondrion.

Organisation over time, according to the environment, which fits best to the occurring mutations in contrast and addition to the existing and working model of life form, from where the mutations grew of, is that what you call impossible.

That is in no way separate to some idea of creation, btw.
It is an AND and no OR.

The idea of our conscious intellect, which seems to 'separate' us from animals, is that what brings evolution to its explanatory limits of finding some prior model to fit into and where this phenomena stems from :smile:


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #6708728 -

I think this may be an appropriate place to dump this link about the origin of the species.

Its called "The Retinal Blind Spot in the Scientific Vision of our Origins ". I found it very interesting. Allan Wallace is an excellent lecturer.

http://www.uctv.tv/search-details.asp?showID=6442


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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6708735 -

Scientists are people with predisposed assumptions based on personal beliefs.

I agree. I mean, just look at all the crazy scientists who think the world is round. The Bible clearly talks about the four corners of the world and that's good enough for me. Besides, any fool can just look around for himself and see that the world is obviously flat.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6708758 -

The problem with fundamentalists is that they have so completely identified with their chosen religious/social group that their mind is completely shut and other alternatives will be considered...even if they are presented with concrete proof.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #6708784 -

Fivepointer, it seems to me like you feel that evolution is a one-step process. You make it sound like one day a tuna fish randomly spit out a koala bear and that's how evolution works.

Richard Dawkins uses an analogy that I'm quite fond of:
Think of a mountain. On one side of the mountain you see the top and a relatively flat, very steep and completely unclimbable surface. The bottom are micro organisms from which we came. The top are modern-day species which include ourselves. You cannot reach the top from the bottom. It would take a leap that superman would be proud of and we know that's impossible.
However, if you go around to the other side, you'll find that rather than a sharp drop from the top to the bottom, you have something of a slope. You begin to follow this slope, and slowly but surely, over a long period of time, you make your way halfway up the mountain, 3/4 of the way, and eventually, you have reached the top.

That's the theory of evolution. Slowly but surely, new traits appear in species. Some are beneficial to its survival, some are harmful. The traits which help the species survive are passed on because that species was able to survive and reproduce. Then the offspring develops another favorable trait, passes it on, and so on and so forth.

One last thing: My biology teacher was a Christian as well as a firm believer in evolution. She told us that her first though when she got to her biology class in college was "Oh man, my professor is going to hell." because he was teaching evolution.
Later on, she went to church and saw the same professor singing in the church choir. That's how she found a combination of believing in God and evolution at the same time.

She would tell us that her comfort came from knowing that even though the bible says the earth was created in 7 days, the word used for days can mean anything from a day to 1,000,000 years or so. Like many other words in the bible, it's very difficult to translate.

Keep these things in mind before you come in here hoping to make everyone believe the same things you do. You need to do your research first.


--------------------
Today while walking up the stairs
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
Oh how I wish he'd stay away

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #6708953 -

Huehuecoyotl said:
The problem with fundamentalists is that they have so completely identified with their chosen religious/social group that their mind is completely shut and other alternatives will be considered...even if they are presented with concrete proof.


The problem with fundamentalists (so called "scientific community") is that they have so completely identified with their chosen religious/social group (evolutionism) that their mind is completely shut and other alternatives will be considered...even if they are presented with concrete proof.

Exactly.

They can not see past their worldview despite the facts.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6708958 -

fivepointer said:
Exactly.

They can not see past their worldview despite the facts.


And you? Can you see past your world view?
Because you've already been confronted with so many reliable facts that you might be wrong.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: flower_child]
    #6708962 -

flower_child said:
Fivepointer, it seems to me like you feel that evolution is a one-step process. You make it sound like one day a tuna fish randomly spit out a koala bear and that's how evolution works.


I'm not saying that at all. I am saying NO life form "evolves" from a different kind of life form. All life forms are created.

You haven't addressed the problem of how more complex information with an incredible degree of order can be created by random shifting of information. Without this the whole theory sinks.

Plain logic applied simply debunks the theory.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6708964 -

It is said to happen over billions of years - starting from bacteria. A fish doesn't just turn into a mammal as you seem to think.

Either way - its still the best explaination we have. To say another being created us doesn't help understanding because then you have to say who created the being that created us and it goes on and on.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: Ego Death]
    #6708976 -

Ego Death said:
It is said to happen over billions of years - starting from bacteria. A fish doesn't just turn into a mammal as you seem to think.

Either way - its still the best explaination we have. To say another being created us doesn't help understanding because then you have to say who created the being that created us and it goes on and on.


So to help in understanding one must create a theory devoid of logic and truth.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6708980 -

no, that kind of avenue produces things like the bible.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6708986 -

Why do snakes have vestigial legs INSIDE their body resembling those of common lizards today? You talk about logic. Where's the logic in God making snakes with useless legs inside their body?

And before you go telling me that God condemned snakes who used to go on all fours to go on their belly instead, explain why those pre-condemned snakes do not appear anywhere in the fossil record?




--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: guitarguy0123]
    #6708990 -

Quote:
fivepointer, take a science class..


and while you're at it, take an anthropology class too!

Everyone says they're looking for that "missing link" but if you can't see the similarities in our skeletal makeup throughout the ages then I don't know what to say.


--------------------
The best way to live
is to be like water
For water benefits all things
and goes against none of them
It provides for all people
and even cleanses those places
a man is loath to go
In this way it is just like Tao        ~Daodejing

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: Diploid]
    #6708995 -

Why are there species of crayfish with no pigmentation, whose eyes are covered over by skin and who live in total darkness deep inside submerged caves? It's because they came from a common pigmented and seeing species long ago that split into the seeing ones who live in sunlight, and blind ones who live in darkness with no use for pigments or eyes.

Speciation right in front of you, yet you still deny it.

Here's one I photographed two miles inside an underwater cave in north central Florida last weekend:




--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: Cracka_X]
    #6709003 -

I want to know whether or not Fivepointer is of the Dr. Dino (Kent Hovind) philosophy?

the world is only 6000 years old? the grand canyon was formed in months? Satan put dinosaur bones in the earth? carbon dating is a conspiracy by the scientific community?

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6709124 -

The fundamental difference between what I said and what you said is this. If another solution was proposed for the diversity of life on Earth, as long as there was reasonable scientific evidence for the theory, I would be open to considering it. If it was a solution that negated the need for direct divine intervention or opposed the closed minded, fundamentalist view that you espouse then you would never consider that option. You would declare it heresy and have done with further thought. YOU KNOW that this is truth. See my thread on identification for further info.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Why people believe in evolution despite the fact it is a failed theory with no scientific basis? [Re: fivepointer]
    #6709133 -

Evolution is everywhere.

All you have to do is open your mind to the idea of it being true.

Since you are a fundamentalist the ability to open your mind has been evolved out of you, by money hungry preachers and church organizations.

Evolution is real my friend.......and it is driven by God.

God has rules he must play by also, and it takes millions of years to build/evolve a creature as complicated as us.

Open your mind.......open your mind..........open your miiiiiinnnnnnndddddddd


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Shop: Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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