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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #27010665 -

So, he did expose perjury.  That's one.  It didn't require the disclosure of millions of documents to do it, though.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27010675 -

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Near Dylan said:
Enlil said:
It doesn't show a crime, though.  Not paying a phone bill is illegal.  That's not a crime, either.  Snowden did not expose any crimes, but he sure as shit committed one.


Alright if this is gonna turn into another 15 pages of complete semantics ima delete this damn thread


:toast:


It really isn't semantics, though.  What the NSA did was illegal in the same way that not paying a phone bill is illegal.  To say that Snowden revealed government crimes based on that is simply bullshit.  A cop who turns his lights on just to get to mcdonalds faster is more of a government crime than what the NSA did in collecting metadata.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Enlil]
    #27010686 -

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Near Dylan said:
Enlil said:
It doesn't show a crime, though.  Not paying a phone bill is illegal.  That's not a crime, either.  Snowden did not expose any crimes, but he sure as shit committed one.


Alright if this is gonna turn into another 15 pages of complete semantics ima delete this damn thread


:toast:


Just semantics. criminal aliens.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Near Dylan] * 2
    #27010717 -

Near Dylan said:
Alright if this is gonna turn into another 15 pages of complete semantics ima delete this damn thread


New to politics? :lolsy:


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #27010776 -

Enlil said:
It really isn't semantics, though.  What the NSA did was illegal in the same way that not paying a phone bill is illegal.


You equate spying on all US citizens to someone not paying his or her phone bill?  Or are you just trying to use legal definitions to make a false equivalency?


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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27010785 -

First, I don't see what they did as "spying."  Second, what they did, they did pursuant to a warrant issued by a court.  Finally, what they did is exactly what the phone companies have been doing for a long, long time.

And no...I didn't "equate" the conduct.  I said they were illegal "in the same way."


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Enlil]
    #27010792 -

Enlil said:
Second, what they did, they did pursuant to a warrant issued by a court.


Yeetusdeetus said:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/03/edward-snowden-nsa-surveillance-guardian-court-rules


The Guardian said:
In a ruling handed down on Wednesday, the US court of appeals for the ninth circuit said the warrantless telephone dragnet that secretly collected millions of Americans’ telephone records violated the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act and may well have been unconstitutional.



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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #27010794 -

Fuck the NSA and fuck phone companies. And fuck how any move that I make is documented anywhere.

Again, woods.... im tellin you guys...


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27010797 -

And you believe that MSM source?  I don't.  I believe the actual court opinion which says:

Quote:
The government's telephony metadata collection program was authorized in a series of classified orders by the FISA Court under FISA Subchapter IV, the "business records" subchapter . . . The court orders authorized the NSA to compile the records into a database and to query the database under certain conditions to obtain foreign intelligence information.


Nowhere in the opinion does the court find that any of it was "warrantless."  You always seem to fall for fake news.

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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Near Dylan] * 1
    #27010990 -

Near Dylan said:
Fuck the NSA and fuck phone companies. And fuck how any move that I make is documented anywhere.


I agree with you here ND.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #27011053 -

Enlil said:
So, he did expose perjury.  That's one.  It didn't require the disclosure of millions of documents to do it, though.



I accept your apology.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #27011054 -

What apology? I didn't say you were lying.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Yeetusdeetus]
    #27011099 -

Enlil said:
Yeetusdeetus said:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Enlil said:
I don't recall anything he exposed that was actually illegal.  Can you refresh my recollection?


Warrantless surveillance.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/sep/03/edward-snowden-nsa-surveillance-guardian-court-rules


That case didn't involve warrantless surveillance, though.  That was all subject to a FISA warrant.


Ok, maybe I was wrong about the type of illegal activity he exposed, but the main point is that he clearly DID expose illegal activity.


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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27011105 -

Did they pay the phone bill tho?


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27011106 -

He did, and I'm not disputing that. He went way beyond that, however, and disclosed millions of classified documents having nothing to do with illegal activity. One or two good deeds doesn't absolve him of that wrongdoing.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Enlil] * 2
    #27011130 -

Who cares if what they were doing was technically legal, it's fucked up. Government does a lot of 'legal' shit that's fucked up. What the laws they wrote say make no difference in my judgement of that.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Near Dylan] * 1
    #27011133 -

Won’t you miss the shroomery when you’re off grid?


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Near Dylan] * 1
    #27011134 -

Which is why your opinion is wholly irrelevant here.


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Enlil]
    #27011135 -

Oh i didnt kno that i made this thread to exclusively discuss the semantics of the american legal system, I thought i was making a thread that said fuck joe biden and called him a retard


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Re: Joe Biden? Really? [Re: Near Dylan] * 1
    #27011139 -

If you're serious about opting out of society, your opinion of how society should be governed is useless.


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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