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To Americans here who don't vote:
    #1355198 -

You deserve death, no less.

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1355248 -

That's why I do vote. So that we never have a government that kills a man for not voting.



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Mp3 of the month: Wild Things- Another Colored Ink Drawing (A.C.I.D.)


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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Learyfan]
    #1355267 -

I have so many friends who bitch about Bush and legalizing weed and everything from A to Z but don't vote. It set me off talking to one of them just now.

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1355321 -

I agree that all should vote. However, if there is no one you feel good about voting for, it is much better to write "none of the above" or "Homer Simpson" on your ballot and hand it in than to vote for a candidate you hate in the hopes of stopping one you hate more from winning.

I hear so many people say "I didn't vote, not because I am lazy or disinterested, but because every candidate on the ballot is either a vicious scum-sucking weasel with the morals of a Miami pimp or a stuffed suit with the IQ of pocket lint and a tinfoil beanie concealed under his hairpiece and I just can't bring myself to vote for ANY of them."

This was certainly true in the last presidential election (I mean really, when was there a more depressing list of chuckleheads on a presidential ballot than Bush, Gore, Buchanan, Nader... did I leave anyone out?), but if everyone who had expressed such sentiments had instead gotten off their butts and spoiled a ballot, it would have embarassed the hell out of the political establishment and maybe shaken them up enough to actually put up a candidate worth voting for.

I can just see the political pundits on the network "Election Watch" commentaries --

"So, with all polls closed and all votes in, it looks like Bush 33 %, Gore 33%, Nader 3%, Buchanan 1%, spoiled ballots 30%. Ummm... Chip, would you care to comment on these numbers?"

"Well, Todd, it seems that either three out of ten American voters are unable to figure out how to mark a ballot or they are sending a strong message of dissatisfaction to the establishment. Only time will tell which is the case."

pinky


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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1355338 -

I see the term "patriotic" thrown around a lot, and it usually annoys me, but I agree when they refer to voting as every citizen's patriotic duty.

I don't know if this is true or not, but I heard that in Greece it's illegal NOT to vote.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1355385 -

I've voted in every election since I was eligible. To me, voting is nothing more that an attempt at political self-defense (and a damn lousy one at that).
- Never once, were the results of a vote that I took part in as close as one vote.
- Numerous times, after the citizens in my state have voted on a certain ballot measure, either representatives from the government or the left have taken it to court and conjured up some bullshit technicality to nullify the people's choice.
- How do you know that the vote totals that are presented to the public are even real?
- Did you know that the Voter News Service (an organization set up by the two major parties and the official source for vote totals presented to the press) skews the percentages of voting results by ommiting some candidates from the totals?
- The powers that be learned a long time ago that democracy is an important safety valve that gives the masses an illusion that they have power. Voting is a very good political domestication tool.
- "...the vote of the utterly ignorant counts exactly as much as the vote of the exquisitely informed..." -- Alan Bock
- "Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner." -- Walter Block


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

Edited by Evolving (03/06/03 06:08 PM)

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1355422 -

Well, maybe not death. How about a spanking?

Of all the things to vote for/against on a ballot, the presidential race is one of the least significant because of the electoral college. In my state (Colorado) there is a significant Republican majority of the voters, so you can vote for whoever you want (how about Joe Shit the Ragman?) and, because so many of the sheeple will vote along party lines, it won't make a real difference.

But there are always plenty of proposals to amend this or that or tax something to pay for whatever that it's always worth going to the polls just to make sure that some local clique doesn't get a measure passed that raises your taxes to pay for (fill in really stupid thing you couldn't bear to see your tax money paying for).

For that matter, your votes are relatively very significant in various local political races. Even if you feel that this race or that race is so whatever that you can't bring yourself to vote one way or the other, it's still not the only thing on the ballot.

Go and vote on the other stuff.


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Happy mushrooming!

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1355994 -

Hats off to the voters here!

1. Think (or let someone else do it for you)
2. Vote (or let someone else do it)

Or

3. STFU!

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: silversoul7]
    #1356068 -

Well i know its definitely illegal not to vote in Australia. How the fuck is that democratic?


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Always Smi2le

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: silversoul7]
    #1356120 -

The worse thing that could happen to politics is to force idiots to vote.

We have enough of them voting as it is.

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1357874 -

If you vote there is better chance that your voice will be heard. Still you can't expect to change things in one year or even ten. Which I think is one reason people do not vote.

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: ]
    #1357998 -

I do not vote for any of them and have never voted in my whole life.

Why.

And when someone has to spend 100 million dollars to become President of this country then they are buying their votes and that is not democratic.

My son at an early age once ask, if we are a democ racy daddy, why do they tell us who we can vote for. Thus the ballot. which only so many names are allowed on.
Nadar fucked us all last election when he ran. He knew he could keep Gore form winning, and he knew he woiuld not get the electioon and I fully belive with all of my heart that he knew in advance that his running would give George Bush the election.So also. To Hell WWith Ralph Nadar. My ex and I are both sorry that we ever supported him in the past becasue he turned out to be no different than Bush.

mj

None of them are worth my vote.

I cannot elect, in good conscious, a single human being who would support laws that would put me in jail for my beliefs.

Such as my right to smoke weed or to eat shrooms or any herbal plant on this earth.

SO you vote for them and they eat three good meals a day off of your tax dollars but not a single elected official would ever invite you or me to white house dinner or a city hall dinner for that matter.

They all once elected support and defent the laws and constitution of this country. And in those laws are laws that would harm you and me.

No. They are not worth the shit they shit.

You can have them. I am a free citizen of theplanet and owe allegeince to no one but my children and my God.

They have no respect for me or whaty I believe in and wish to do me harm without knowning me.

So I do not vote. They are all a bunch of shit heads who reat good, own nicce million dollar homes and fuck them
I love my country but no one tells me what I can or cannot do.
I do not rob, ri[p-ofrfkill or abuse others becasue they have different lifes than I do.

Of course tight now I am acting towards them the way they act towards me and I do not like being liek that because then that makes me much not different then them.

Anyway that is why they do not get my vote.

mj

Edited by mjshroomer (03/08/03 11:21 AM)

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1358042 -

Quote:
Nadar fucked us all last election when he ran. He knew he could keep Gore form winning, and he knew he woiuld not get the electioon and I fully belive with all of my heart that he knew in advance that his running would give George Bush the election.So also. To Hell WWith Ralph Nadar. My ex and I are both sorry that we ever supported him in the past becasue he turned out to be no different than Bush.


Nadar helped Bush to win this election, Perot helped the other Bush to lose in 1992. It happens. Do you really think Gore would have been any better than Bush. I guarantee you he is still against drugs, as almost every Republican and Democrat will be until lazy stoners get out and vote. Also, if you are against Nader because he allowed Gore to win, why didn't you vote Libertarian? They are even more anti-drug than the Green Party, and attracted very few votes.

The point is, even if there are no politicians with whom you agree 100%, vote for the one who has the most similar beliefs. A rather significant portion of America voted for Nader because a rather significant portion America is against the drug war. Unfortunately, those who are most outspoken against the drug war are those like me, who don't even do drugs! And we are a minority - I am the lone vote in my group of friends and I am the one who says, "No thanks," when the pipe is passed to me.

Also, don't you think there is some merit if I am trying to convince someone, who is obviously so against most of what I stand for, to vote?

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1358619 -

Quote:
A rather significant portion of America voted for Nader because a rather significant portion America is against the drug war.


Precisely, and many more. The problem that arose out of the last election was whether or not a vote for Nader would be a vote for Bush. I think this entire argument was ridiculous. The ONLY way a third party would ever be elected would be if the citizens actually begin to show interest IN THAT PARTY.

It takes time. A new party doesn't just suddenly "win", they promote themselves over many separate elections until voters begin to feel a bit more comfortable with them. I knew Nader wasn't going to win, but if I had been old enough to vote at that time, I would have voted for him. Just as long as some type of yearning for a new party is communicated.....

Now that I'm a registered voter, I still don't feel very powerful (thanks to the electoral college) which I believe is archaic and needs to be discarded with immediately.


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The proper penalty of ignorance, which is of course that those who don't know should learn from those who do... - Plato

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1359174 -

John, I have immense respect for you as a mycologist. I have appreciated your contributions to mycology ever since I learned of them. So you know what I am about to say has nothing personal in it.

You are wrong.

I understand your thinking and I have run into it time and time again but there is no defense for it.

Especially in your state, Washington.

You are aware that your state is one of the few that consistently puts public initiatives on the ballot so that the people can decide the issues.

So, by not voting what have you refused to lift a finger to help?

AIDS legislation.
Suicide legislation.
Gun legislation.

And even medical marijuana legislation!

Just a quick google search turned up these in one year alone!!!

The presidential election is only once every 4 years. Between them other people are elected that significantly affect your life and other issues like public initiatives are passed or failed without your help.

You need to vote on those issues brother. We need your help.

Peace,

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Angry Mycologist]
    #1359452 -

Wasn't Abraham Lincoln was elected from a third party?


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

Edited by Evolving (03/09/03 04:13 AM)

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Angry Mycologist]
    #1359483 -

The point of voting for a third party is to show support for their ideas. If enough people come out voting Libertarian or Green, the Democrats and Republicans will start to learn more towards ending the drug war or limiting government in order to get more votes.

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Anonymous]
    #1359642 -

Sorry Mr. Mushrooms, Washington is not my state.

I am only living here temporarily becasue this is where my children live.

I eventualy plan on moving permanently to Thailand. AS I said I do not vote. I am a free spririt and if I vote than that means I support the system and I do not.

Yes I pay taxes but that is about it.

I will however leave this country earlier if George Bush is re-elected presidenbt and I will renounce my citizenshi[p if he does get reelected. I woul;d not want to be part of it again as long as he is in office.

And still I will not vote. That is their game, not mine. And that is all it is, a game. I was born free of all of them and if I votre for any of them then that means i support their games and I do not. I believe in me. First last and always. Then i can believe others, for a while.

They are the government, not you or I and only I can speak for myself.

mj

Those are my personal views.

mj

Edited by mjshroomer (03/09/03 06:55 AM)

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: Evolving]
    #1359684 -

Nope just a young  Republican party. This link goes  to page that describes how he won the nomination to run for the presidency in 1860. Politics was wickedly cutthroat even then. There is nothing like home feild advantage. :smirk: 

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Re: To Americans here who don't vote: [Re: falcon]
    #1360318 -

I got this infromation from a couple of websites...

On July 6, 1854, in Jackson, Mich., the Republican Party formally organized itself by holding its first convention, adopting a platform and nominating a full slate of candidates for state offices. Other states soon followed, and the first Republican candidate for president, John C. Fr?mont, ran in 1856 with the slogan "Free soil, free labor, free speech, free men, Fr?mont." With the election of Abraham Lincoln in 1860, the Republicans established themselves as a major party.

The option of working through a new political party was viable before, there is no reason it cannot be viable again. What it will take are the right social/political conditions, they may be on us sooner than we expect.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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