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Invisible1stimer
Religion=Rape
Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1,280
Loc: Amerika
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #1131647 - 12/11/02 11:02 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

we have the technology to make most of the grunt work jobs mechanized and automated for the most part. if we were all rocket scientists we wouldnt be ignorant and as easy to control. the government needs ignorant people to stay in power.


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ash dingy donker mo gollyhopper patty popiton rockstop bueno mayo riggedy jig bobber johnathan pattywhacker gogboob t-shirt monkey.

There is such emotion in the distortion.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Anonymous]
    #1133768 - 12/11/02 09:16 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Well, I was planning on pushing for change, but it's becoming clear to me that it's just too late for me, so I plan on moving to Canada as soon as I can become a citizen. I think you should understand that there's a difference between hating America and hating the status quo. You have to really love America to really push for improvement. However, my love for my country has pretty much faded away by now, and I'm seriously considering moving up north.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: 1stimer]
    #1138304 - 12/13/02 09:42 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

>>we have the technology to make most of the grunt work jobs mechanized and automated for the most part.

True, but then what would the unskilled do for money?


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Invisibleshroomophile
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Posts: 762
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Anonymous]
    #1148282 - 12/17/02 07:30 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Check out the free state project.


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Once the mighty oak,was a nut who held his ground.


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #1148428 - 12/17/02 08:26 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

If the shareholders think that the board of directors is paying it's higher-ups too much, then they have the right to vote new people in.
Hard for the shareholders to vote on issues when they are lied to about the facts; i.e. cooking the books as has been on the increase. Look at the scandals that have been made public this year alone. This does not count the ones that have yet to be caught or only bent the rules in their favor.

Not everyone has the business acumen to be able to run a large company. Therefore, people who can do this deserve to be paid well for their efforts.
Uh huh. And what about top executives awarding themselves extra bonuses for bankrupting a company while the pension fund for the average worker runs dry?

You don't see a problem with that?

What about top financial analysts pulling in 7 figures a year where almost every report and recommendation was wrong? The only business "acumen" needed there was balls and connections. Who among us couldn't do better than getting 90% of the stock recommendations wrong?

Now Snow gets a pension for 44 years though he only worked at the company for 25 years. And the pension is not based on his salary ala the average Joe, but on the worth of his stock options. Is he really worth 2.5 million a year for life? Did he really add that much worth to the company? I think not.



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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Swami]
    #1148589 - 12/17/02 09:42 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

It's been happening for a long time that directors are given massive pay-outs even when they run the company to shit. A chimpanzee could do a better job than most of them, and you'd only have to pay enough for bananas and carpet-cleaner.


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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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Anonymous

Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Xlea321]
    #1148816 - 12/17/02 11:00 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Beam me up scotty, the BORG have taken the shroomery political disscusion forum. I think there are only a few individuals left, the rest have been absorbed into the collective.



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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,244
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: ]
    #1148833 - 12/17/02 11:03 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

There's more people here who belive in freedom and the US (even though it's not perfect) than you think.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineRonoS
DSYSB since '01
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1148840 - 12/17/02 11:06 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

there is at least 2 or 3 people at the Shroomery alone!  :smirk:


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"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,244
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Rono]
    #1148846 - 12/17/02 11:09 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Somedays I'm not so sure. :confused:


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisiblesir tripsalot
Administrator

Registered: 07/09/99
Posts: 6,486
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Xlea321]
    #1148851 - 12/17/02 11:11 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I'm in an introductory accounting class and a my teacher was a phorensic accountant. She says CEO's get away with murder and nobody deems to do anything about. One simple tactic is the year year before they retire if I remember correctly is buying tons of inventory and overstating assets(I'm wrong here on some part,but something along these lines) and during that fianl year the company experiences record numbers. Then the new guy comes in and it looks like he is driving the company to shit,all at the expense of the employees and shareholders.


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"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: ]
    #1148952 - 12/17/02 11:47 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Um... Scottie never met the Borg. You're thinking of someone else.  :tongue:


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Invisiblesir tripsalot
Administrator

Registered: 07/09/99
Posts: 6,486
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1149046 - 12/17/02 12:17 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Geordie Laforge would have been the equivalent engine room guy. *shoots self in head for treck knowledge*


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"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: sir tripsalot]
    #1149208 - 12/17/02 01:04 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

What about Miles O'Brien?

...can I see that gun for a second?


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: sir tripsalot]
    #1149913 - 12/17/02 05:31 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

She says CEO's get away with murder and nobody deems to do anything about

You're not wrong trips, the last 20 years they've been like hogs in slop. As the guardian says:

Enough is enough. It is time for the government to consider action against the beggar-thy-neighbour pay rises among business leaders that they are incapable of tackling themselves. Last year, according to the new Guardian-Inbucon survey, top executive pay rose by 17%, six times higher than the national average over the same period. This follows increases of 28% in 2000 and 16.5% the year before. Directors are living in a world of their own.

Their seemingly unstoppable increases bear no relation to extra productivity or exceptional performance. The corporate scandals in America - which the US authorities are at last tackling - have had no effect over here. The gravy train has gathered so much speed no one wants to jump off. Worse, they delude themselves that what they are doing has no relevance to the real world, where average earnings are rising by under 4%. How do they expect people to criticise firemen or London underground drivers for asking for - comparatively - tiny increases when the leaders of industry set such a shameful example?

In the early 1980s, when there was a genuine feeling that senior executives were underpaid - though it never seemed to make any difference to economic growth, the Conservative government reduced the top rate of tax from 80% to almost 40%. This was probably the biggest increase in take-home pay ever recorded, enabling already well paid executives to keep an extra ?40,000 out of every extra ?100,000 they earned. And what did they do? Instead of saying "thank you" they took it as the sound of a starting pistol to ask for ever greater sums of money.

The explosion of top pay has had serious social effects. It has reduced rather than increased incentives at the top because - as the regular tales of corporate pay-offs underline - you now get handsomely compensated for failing as well as succeeding. It has also greatly widened the rift between the top and bottom strata of society. However successful Gordon Brown is in raising the incomes of the very poor, the differential between top and bottom widens because of the huge increases in top pay.



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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: sir tripsalot]
    #1149934 - 12/17/02 05:41 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

This guy takes the cake:

Sir Christopher Gent, the high-profile chief executive of Vodafone, whose pay deals regularly court controversy, earned ?9m, the survey found.

He was rewarded the largest year-on-year pay rise - some 400% - of all the executives covered by the research, despite running one of the companies which produced some of the poorest returns for shareholders.



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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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Anonymous

Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1149952 - 12/17/02 05:47 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

All the years .... they melt into a dream.

:crazy: 


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Xlea321]
    #1149967 - 12/17/02 05:54 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

80% is way too fucking much for anyone to pay in taxes. I bet some of them rationalize it as getting back some of they money they lost due to earlier ridiculous taxation.


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OfflinePhred
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Registered: 10/18/00
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1150463 - 12/18/02 12:22 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

80% is way too fucking much for anyone to pay in taxes.

Indeed it is, but there's more. Believe it or not, in the Socialist Sixties England's highest tax bracket exceeded 90%. This is why The Beatles left England. I remember reading (but I never verified it so it may be exaggeration) that they were getting hit with 98% at one point.

That's why when they wrote the song "Taxman", one of the lines reads:

"There's one for you, nineteen for me."

pinky


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Offlinezeronio
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Registered: 10/16/01
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Re: To All Americans Who Hate America [Re: Phred]
    #1150478 - 12/18/02 12:46 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I can hardly believe that. I was born in a communist country where income taxes were around 50%. Don't tell me that capitalist UK had more...


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