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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma] * 1
    #25026101 -

Since when did you become privy to the knowledge of what it's like for 'everyone else in their death bed'?

**You accused people of lying. That is not debate. Do it again and you're out. You can complain all you like about it, you've 0 chances left with any of the staff here akira.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma]
    #25026108 -

akira_akuma said:
PPS: this is piecemeal to the very topic at hand, you must realize this Jokeshop, or else why are you even....look, if you don't know that death anxiety, as a part of it's premise, conceptually, entails that people lie to themselves, right, well, then now you know.

if you didn't know, now you know. it's literally PART AND PARCEL to the concept. so i'm NOT telling you're lying to yourself, or calling you a liar MALICIOUSLY. it's just due to the nature of the subject matter, that i used the phrase "lie to yourself".


I have read tomes of work on DA. I have worked with the concept in myself for over a decade.

Don't assume that everybody works by the same rules as everybody else.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #25026116 -

Jokeshopbeard said:
Since when did you become privy to the knowledge of what it's like for 'everyone else in their death bed'?

**You accused people of lying. That is not debate. Do it again and you're out. You can complain all you like about it, you've 0 chances left with any of the staff here akira.


stop threatening me without a reason. i said that PEOPLE LIE TO THEMSELVES and i quote
Quote:
see, this is what i'm talking about...people lying to themselves. :lol: they have to!


PEOPLE. a GENERAL DESCRIPTOR. don't assume i work like you...i don't. i can easily point out how you are mistaken and completely out of line. don't worry, people have already been informed of your attitude and your lack of aptitude for moderating this forum. i said people lie to themselves, and i already explained why, because it's part and parcel to the very premise of DA, that people LIE TO THEMSELVES. so if i can't bring up that premise, then this forum is DEFUNCT. which is why you should not be moderating it.

Quote:
Since when did you become privy to the knowledge of what it's like for 'everyone else in their death bed'?


it's the same thing for everyone. they die in pain. it's never pleasant, and when it comes down to it, no one wants it, embraces it, or can embrace it. they simply hope that people will give let them die with some dignity- which, unironically, might include LYING TO THEM, or letting them lie to themselves...but not in the PSP forum where a lie is a form of debate that should be pointed at as such, a lie as a form of debate.

PS: just to clarify

Quote:
**You accused people of lying. That is not debate. Do it again and you're out. You can complain all you like about it, you've 0 chances left with any of the staff here akira.


you're 100% wrong. i didn't accuse anyone of lying. no accusations were made.

prove that i made an accusation, or accuse someone of lying. you can't. because nothing as such occurred. what i said was "people lie to themselves, because they have to!"

if i keep discussing this, does this count towards me "breaking the rules", even though none have been broken?

please. let me know.

Edited by akira_akuma (02/27/18 11:39 AM)

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma]
    #25026127 -

akira_akuma said:
it's the same thing for everyone. they die in pain. it's never pleasant, and when it comes down to it, no one wants it, embraces it, or can embrace it.


Prove it.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma]
    #25026128 -

just to note: death anxiety usually leads people to lie to themselves about many things, to avoid said anxiety.

this is a fact that anyone who's studied DA would know. let's debate.

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #25026133 -

Jokeshopbeard said:
akira_akuma said:
it's the same thing for everyone. they die in pain. it's never pleasant, and when it comes down to it, no one wants it, embraces it, or can embrace it.


Prove it.


:shrug: great, now you're not trying to breath down my neck for a simple part and parcel argument to your lack of reasoning. good. now, i can't prove it, because that'd require me to have you on your death bed, now wouldn't it?

so call it an "justified opinion" of mine.

but i do think that someone lying in their own feces, hardly able to breath, slowing dying...i don't think they'll be embracing anything but a bed pan.

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma]
    #25026139 -

look, this thread is over, close it. i'm not going to allow myself to be threatened because i am discussing the VERY PREMISE of Death Anxiety, which is how people lie to themselves in order to avoid that anxiety.

because of this, however, this forum is DEFUNCT as a place of debate. there is too much emotional baggage in this forum's moderation staff for this place to even live up to it's function.

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma]
    #25026145 -

akira_akuma said:
so call it an "justified opinion" of mine.


Sounds like the entire premise of your thread. You use the same to promote the idea that everyone goes to the end with DA, and that if one does not, one is lying to themselves, thereby providing yourself with a watertight argument that no one can disprove, but you cannot prove.

Well done.


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #25026149 -

it's proven everyday when people die in agony. you can act stoic as much as you like. you're not providing any debate. you're too emotionally invested.

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma]
    #25026151 -

wtf guys lmao...

ill get in my post before yall prematurely close this lol.

i have to disagree, i would say that person is embracing death indefinitely.

they are close to death, idk how that would look for you but i imagine that said person must feel alienated while at the same time alienating him or herself from others... as a cat does before its final hours.


--------------------
Trip 7
THUG - ISLAM - BIBLE
streets disciple
CHRIST IS KING.

Sunshine said: "Gangsters are super heroes"

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: Green7Alchemist]
    #25026158 -

guys? not me. it's him who is getting all uppity from some fairly basic type responses for a DA thread. yes, people lie to themselves about how they handle DA.

imagine my shock. :shrug: that's part and parcel to the whole premise. but Jokeshopbeard thinks that's against the rules, so this thread should probably be closed. just close it, "mods". because i don't want to get banned for nothing AGAIN.

Quote:
as a cat does before its final hours.


now things just...damn...i really loved my cat, and when she did this...i lashed out, and was like "goddamn it, she's sick all over and hiding, bad kitty!"

and now i'm SADSMAN.

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma] * 1
    #25026183 -

people exhibit the same behavior when faced with a terminal illness.

i feel as if for us to avoid any form of anxiety from death we must A) leave behind a legacy we are proud of and B) know for certain what we will be facing upon death, will we see that mysterious "white light" or will we just fade into black orrr face our maker and answer for our actions on earth... all this brings DA, it may be something that is inescapable.

when people have near death experiences they tend to come out of them with a sense of longing for the spiritual, i dont think that these people or latching onto lies but rather they are trying to work out their salvation or make sense out of this reality.


--------------------
Trip 7
THUG - ISLAM - BIBLE
streets disciple
CHRIST IS KING.

Sunshine said: "Gangsters are super heroes"

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: Green7Alchemist]
    #25026201 -

i agree, but i think it's lying. i don't give as much of a negative connotation to the word "lie" though. :shrug: i think it's pretty natural, and i think we lie to ourselves in terms of spirituality, but also in terms of reasoning, too.

it's be unreasonable, methinks, to disallow one to lie to themselves, because ultimately no one knows the answers of "what's beyond death" and anything we DO know is simply an assumption- because it's "death". if you aren't "dead", you aren't "in death", so there is no way to know what is beyond the wall of sleep, so to speak, (to be bad-ass and quote a Black Sabbath song title). of course, i'm making the argument that those who have "come back" from death, have experienced hallucinations and whether or not these experiences are valid spiritual experiences is past the point- the point is, to know, you have to know, not be "almost sure", which is the limit, the upward apex of what we can know about death, because in death, you're dead. there is no knowing; at least, not in any way that we know how to know, or "realize". for all anyone "knows", those who've come back may have had dream-like hallucinations, either upon return, or upon the moment of their absolute death.

i don't begrudge people this process. i also don't begrudge people who are simply unsure of how to approach the truth (ie, whom are promulgating non-intentional lies, ie, spiritual "truths" taken as fact, ect) -- because the "truth" encompasses such a wide spectrum of knowledge, it's impossible deny yourself questioning things, even if you have incomplete information, due to survival instincts that are in-born.

the truth begins in lies (but that's a different thread)

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma] * 1
    #25026244 -

to know what is on the other side is virtually impossible we can take experiences like the ones you mentioned and also draw from science and psychology in order to make educated guesses but it would only be that at best.

for example, this life is an illusion, due to its atomic properties and how they are assembled and perceived behind the walls of our brain, that in turns renders death itself an illusion within an illusion.

so in that way we know for certain these few things, everything we see before us in the micro-verse does not appear in the same format code as it does in the macro-verse and we know this to be due to the nature of atoms and how they bond but to continue down this illusion we can only perceive the object once light has reached our eye and then relates the message to the brain, the brain generates electricity and energy cannot be created nor destroyed only transferred from one space to another, now this seems like an elaborate lie i tell myself to make me feel as if i will continue to exist in a different form, but this is what we know energy cannot be created not destroyed.

so it would seem to me that there both life and death are illusions.


--------------------
Trip 7
THUG - ISLAM - BIBLE
streets disciple
CHRIST IS KING.

Sunshine said: "Gangsters are super heroes"

Edited by Green7Alchemist (02/27/18 12:36 PM)

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma] * 1
    #25026295 -

Really
not everyone dies in agony,
many die in their sleep,
some fade away.
many do die with pain but is it more than 25%?
some die with shock
or instantly after severe trauma (gunshot) which can be quick and relatively painless compared to a bee sting, or falling from a ladder.

the most unpleasant part of many deaths is the lack of dignity, which is a pain in the ego. They should do something about those hospital patient gowns.

I have low acceptance that death anxiety is more than general insecurity and taking things personally.


--------------------
:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: redgreenvines]
    #25026363 -

for me, the idea of living forever is more frightening than the idea of dying.  with an abundance of faith death comfortably passes through.

imagine living forever, now imagine living forever without love.  i can accept the Faith necessary to die, not so much eternal life.

have you ever died in a lucid dream, been shot to death or crashed your car or strangled? it's good practice for dying.

this is all of course assuming that I am not already dead.

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: Green7Alchemist]
    #25026398 -

Green7Alchemist said:
to know what is on the other side is virtually impossible we can take experiences like the ones you mentioned and also draw from science and psychology in order to make educated guesses but it would only be that at best.

for example, this life is an illusion, due to its atomic properties and how they are assembled and perceived behind the walls of our brain, that in turns renders death itself an illusion within an illusion.

so in that way we know for certain these few things, everything we see before us in the micro-verse does not appear in the same format code as it does in the macro-verse and we know this to be due to the nature of atoms and how they bond but to continue down this illusion we can only perceive the object once light has reached our eye and then relates the message to the brain, the brain generates electricity and energy cannot be created nor destroyed only transferred from one space to another, now this seems like an elaborate lie i tell myself to make me feel as if i will continue to exist in a different form, but this is what we know energy cannot be created not destroyed.

so it would seem to me that there both life and death are illusions.


dude.

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma]
    #25026418 -

those are my honest thoughts man, its all an illusion :lol:

i swear ill wake up from this reality as an alien that dozed off while hitting some DMT.


--------------------
Trip 7
THUG - ISLAM - BIBLE
streets disciple
CHRIST IS KING.

Sunshine said: "Gangsters are super heroes"

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: redgreenvines]
    #25026431 -

redgreenvines said:
Really
not everyone dies in agony,
many die in their sleep,


i was just thinking about this. i think it'd be worse to die in your sleep. just saying. without the full experience of death, you can't say to have lived it fully. plus, isn't it more scary to die 'not knowing', rather than 'knowing' as you die?

but yes, not in "agony", true, good point. but my above statement stands as an argument for such a case being more anxiety-driving and scary to die in ones sleep, than to not. then again, it might be more preferable and less anxiety-filled to go in a nicer way than opposed to something more "grisly" like torture, or something.

so what of that, man? i mean, i think i have a point here. :super: but nice response.


Quote:
some fade away.
many do die with pain but is it more than 25%?
some die with shock
or instantly after severe trauma (gunshot) which can be quick and relatively painless compared to a bee sting, or falling from a ladder.

the most unpleasant part of many deaths is the lack of dignity, which is a pain in the ego. They should do something about those hospital patient gowns.


well, indefinite silence and nothingness seems to be a scary premise, perhaps with hope in something more, you can combat anxiety. but i think people would be lying to themselves to say that this action, of DA, (which is connected to it all, ie, religions, spiritual beliefs, ect -- yes, this is another argument) doesn't play a part in their motivations or otherwise, inertia.

Quote:
I have low acceptance that death anxiety is more than general insecurity and taking things personally.


i think that's just more DA talking. but let's just stipulate something to make this premise more clear, instead of short and opaque...i think that this wording "low acceptance" is rather well-said, but it's more of a language game you're employing sort of like apotropaic mental mine-laying, more than an exact consecution of the psychological fact of DA as false. :wink: the fact of your making stoic/buddhistic grammar choices in order to cultivate a feeling (and not an exactitude of logic or rationale to make clear ie ratiocination or awareness) that you can then use to "trick" yourself, essentially.

the term "insecurity" in your judgements betrays you. :yesnod: you seem to take the very notion espoused about DA as personally as i am....

Green7Alchemist said:
those are my honest thoughts man, its all an illusion :lol:

i swear ill wake up from this reality as an alien that dozed off while hitting some DMT.


no, i think remember you saying some crazy sense before too, no man, it's all good. i think you understand well, in my stupid idiotic opinion.

can i insult myself? i wonder....

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Re: People really do nothing but postulate things to avoid the anxiety of death. [Re: akira_akuma] * 1
    #25026459 -

you probably shouldnt tell yourself lies to sooth the prognosis of your intelligence :wink:


--------------------
Trip 7
THUG - ISLAM - BIBLE
streets disciple
CHRIST IS KING.

Sunshine said: "Gangsters are super heroes"

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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