Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V - Spirituality & Mysticism - Shroomery Message Board

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Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: HeartAndMind]
#19579983 - 02/17/14 01:57 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Science also mostly points that we are the body, the brain and death is the end. Isn't it hard to live believing in it?

More accurately, science says that there is no reliable evidence pointing to life-after-death or that consciousness extends beyond the body.

Hard or easy - reality is what it is, not what we want it to be.

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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: HeartAndMind]
#19579995 - 02/17/14 01:59 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

HeartAndMind said:

OrgoneConclusion said:

Truth as in reality and not imagination.

I agree, I'm wondering what is reality for you though? Just people may have different meanings of concepts.

For those having trouble distinguishing, they could always take the 'Swami Rock to the Back of the Head Challenge'. It is simple yet effective!

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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: HeartAndMind]
#19580000 - 02/17/14 01:59 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Use your other brain, the one you're not using.

:lol:

:lol:

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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: teknix]
#19580008 - 02/17/14 02:01 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Try to describe an experience Orgone.

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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: teknix]
#19580015 - 02/17/14 02:02 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Those that believe they are only using 10% of their brain are correct!

:holyshitbubbles:

:holyshitbubbles:

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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#19580022 - 02/17/14 02:03 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

I'm talking about the reasoning based on the description of personal experience rather than logic.

It's obvious our brains can do both, right?

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ivander
Paragon of Animal

Registered: 11/01/08
Posts: 1,519
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#19580073 - 02/17/14 02:14 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

OrgoneConclusion said:

Quote:

I was skeptic when I was younger, and I knew also some people who were. But with process we changed to be "believers". That does not mean I believe in flying spaghetti monster, or every BS im presented with.

If you do not believe everything presented to you, then you are still a skeptic.

But here is the deal: ask a Mormon or a Muslim (or almost an True Believer or Fundamentalist) what it would take for them to give up or alter their belief(s) and the answer will almost always be "Nothing!" An inability to incorporate new facts is the hallmark of close-mindedness.

And you are believer of your own skepticism :smile:

:smile:

And in subject, it does not write Ultimate Believers.

Yes, an inability to incorporate new facts is hallmark of close-mindedness. So I consider my mind not to be closed enough and to absorb all these facts and demonstrations, and challenges, and take them as granted... because I cant really prove that what you or majority of people consider to be official and controlled experiment/demonstration(whatever) is really true and is ultimate truth.

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Truth as in reality and not imagination.

Placebo effect is imagination at work, right? Yet it still affects 'reality'. You are trying so hard to divide the two, and it can go only so far.
Science proved that we affect result of experiment just by observing it.. quantum stuff. That is both real and imagined for me. This reality ultimalty and what we created as civilization is just bunch of things we imagined first and then manifested them in what you consider to be reality.

--------------------
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music. - Nietzsche
I've never faked a sarcasm in my life. True story.

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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: ivander]
#19580085 - 02/17/14 02:17 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Science proved that we affect result of experiment just by observing it.. quantum stuff.

New Age misunderstanding and total physics fail. :congrats:

:congrats:

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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: ivander]
#19580092 - 02/17/14 02:18 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Placebo effect is imagination at work, right? Yet it still affects 'reality'

Yes, your body can effect your body. Nothing mystical in that. Imagination without works cannot effect anything outside the body.

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ivander
Paragon of Animal

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Posts: 1,519
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Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#19580095 - 02/17/14 02:19 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

OK, enlighten me. Im open minded.
And respond to whole thread please.

--------------------
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music. - Nietzsche
I've never faked a sarcasm in my life. True story.

Extras:

teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#19580098 - 02/17/14 02:19 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

OrgoneConclusion said:

Quote:

Science proved that we affect result of experiment just by observing it.. quantum stuff.

New Age misunderstanding and total physics fail.

Enough red herring orgone, engage the topic or biased.

Extras:

OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: ivander]
#19580105 - 02/17/14 02:21 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Enlighten you as to what? Teach a college level physics class in one paragraph?

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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#19580133 - 02/17/14 02:25 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Can you describe any experience objectively?

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ivander
Paragon of Animal

Registered: 11/01/08
Posts: 1,519
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#19580142 - 02/17/14 02:27 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

I dont really care if you feel better when you stomp someone down. Gotta feed the ego right?

Double slit experiment was simple enough for me to understand, on this subject. Can you say in one paragraph why you consider this part of science to be false?

--------------------
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music. - Nietzsche
I've never faked a sarcasm in my life. True story.

Extras:

teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: ivander]
#19580152 - 02/17/14 02:29 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

What it portends leads to a huge debate, can we just forget about it and try another angle of approach please.

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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: teknix]
#19580196 - 02/17/14 02:34 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

And you are believer of your own skepticism
And in subject, it does not write Ultimate Believers.

Like this. :thumbup:

:thumbup:

Will you elaborate?

Extras:

OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: ivander]
#19580240 - 02/17/14 02:41 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

ivander said:

I dont really care if you feel better when you stomp someone down. Gotta feed the ego right?

No one was 'stomped down' but only an ego can take offense.

The double-slit experiment is not a license to believe in mysticism. Looking at an object does not change it. Measuring it (or interfering) does. Observing in physics doe not mean what most people think it means.

It is like this. Measure the temperature of a body of water with a standard thermometer without changing the temperature of the body of water. It cannot be done.

--------------------

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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#19580267 - 02/17/14 02:46 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Looking at randomness logically is cheating.

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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group

Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: teknix]
#19580286 - 02/17/14 02:50 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Can you try to make sense?

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teknix
𓂀⟁𓅢𓍝𓅃𓊰𓉡 𓁼𓆗⨻

Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 12,116

Re: Skeptics vs. Believers - Part V

[Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#19580290 - 02/17/14 02:51 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Imposing logical rules on something not logical, is subscribing to a belief that all is logical.

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