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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: vicepope]
    #29715833 -

So what, if someone like el sayed wins you think he'll pull a fetterman or stevenson and sell out with a 180?

Mamdani hasn't done that, quite the opposite actually.

Who do you think will sell out if they senator?


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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2]
    #29715844 -

Psilynut2 said:
Quote:
Unfortunately that is systemically more difficult than changing the democratic party from the inside out



    It's almost like your saying Bernie couldn't have done much without the democratic party's  money , infrastructure and support .



Running as an independent doesn't have the same voter pull of familiarity as the current 2 party system does.

The democratic party is a better platform for campaigning progressive policies than running as an independent because of the way the system runs as a 2 party system.

Bernie did grass roots funding.

The democratic party will probably do more to crush an independent campaign too.

He could campaign from within the democratic party and reshape it by spreading progressive policy ideas, or try and start a new with an independent campaign, and at the time Bernie was running, the later was a less viable option. Imo.


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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: sudly]
    #29715880 -

  I just don't understand why people thought the DNC wasn't going to resist fundamentally being changed , by Bernie  .
Both Bernie and Hillary signed an agreement to give a portion of the money their campaigns raised to the DNC .
  Hillary raised a metric fuckton of money and gave the DNC 430 million . Bernie didnt raise any money through that agreement , he did grass roots and gave them nothing .
  Do you not see the problem ?
     
    He tried to hijak the platform to get elected as an independent . He didn't want to be a Democrat , he created this huge movement that he lost control of , when he lost he said hey guys vote for Hillary , and his people said fuck you , Trump.  This fucked the dnc over.

Edited by Psilynut2 (11/01/26 09:45 PM)

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2] * 1
    #29715921 -


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2]
    #29715924 -

Why are you relitigating 2016?

Democrat is the party label, not the policy platform.

Tomorrow's the day we might see change start to take its first steps.


--------------------
I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2] * 1
    #29715931 -

Actually, the left demonstrably votes for the moderate than the moderates do for the left.

The most famous example is Hillary voters going for McCain at twice the rate that Sanders voters went for Trump.

Look at Lieberman. Manchin. Fetterman. Stevens. Elon.

These demons want to make sure the democrats are the same as the republicans, and the moment that project is threatened, or even spoken about, they cry foul and say “I’d love to be a democrat but these loony lefties and minorities are forcing me towards fascism.”


There’s something to be said about Sanders hijacking the Democratic Party. At the same time, the Dems sue to keep third parties off the ballot. It’s “fall in line, vote blue no matter who” until the DSA gets popular, and then everyone tells them to fuck off and create a third party.

So yeah, if this two party system is premised on the idea that it’s the only way to flesh out democracy in the U.S., then you have to respect the will of the voters. Of course, the democrats don’t want to do that because they don’t receive hundreds of millions of dollars every cycle to represent the people, they get it to preserve and expand the wealth of the ruling class.


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #29715933 -

They get the money or they cease to exist or be competitive , they were on the verge of bankruptcy in 2015 . The platform Bernie was trying to hijack literally existed because of Hillary .
  If only they could run on hopes and dreams ...


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Edited by Psilynut2 (11/01/26 10:21 PM)

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2] * 2
    #29715941 -

Just a Canadian meddling in foreign elections.. 

GET OUT AND VOTE

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Awebig Throy]
    #29715944 -

I don't want to get excited but it looks like Texas  might turn blue . There's a chance , I kinda feel like making a  tray of pot brownies a life sentence wasn't a good idea for them .


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2]
    #29715948 -

Would be great for drug policy to, at the very least, have to reflect some kind of proven harm.  Rather than just, welp... people enjoy it.

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2]
    #29715957 -

Psilynut2 said:
I don't want to get excited but it looks like Texas  might turn blue . There's a chance , I kinda feel like making a  tray of pot brownies a life sentence wasn't a good idea for them .



Even if 1 senator goes blue your still going to jail for your pot brownies. I got 20 bucks on robinhood prediction market texas still goes red in 2 days. Can't help myself to the 1k profit I get against the odds.


--------------------
The better guide to grow mushrooms.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/8553541

Beware the power of one.  The power of two. The power of many.

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2] * 1
    #29715970 -

Psilynut2 said:
Quote:
The only reason Trump has ever won is because Democrats refused to allow demoracy to play out in the primaries.



Or if Bernie had ran as the socialist independent he always was and just stayed the fuck  out of the democratic primary ...



Why would he do that? He wouldn't even be able to get on the ballot in most states, and he votes with Democrats like 95% of the time.

Had the Clinton campaign and the DNC not played dirty, Bernie would have won, and gone on to defeat Trump. He was exactly the person we needed in that moment, and the establishment refused to allow it.

Establishment Dems prefer Trump to a progressive. They would rather tow the racist right wing line, and engage in dispiccable tactics like promoting Islamaphobia, than let a progressive beat someone like Haley Stevens.

Clinton didn't lose because of Bernie. She lost because she was a bad candidate. If ANYONE in Washington runs a clean campaign (without negative propaganda), it's Bernie. "Enough about the damn Emails", he said! That is the biggest favor he could have ever done for her.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #29715978 -

Quote:
Had the Clinton campaign and the DNC not played dirty,



 
  Had Hillary not raised 430 million for the dnc , it would have went bankrupt before the election .
  What did you expect? Bernie didn't raise any money for them , just used them .

Edited by Psilynut2 (11/01/26 11:48 PM)

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: vicepope]
    #29715982 -

Quote:
I got 20 bucks on robinhood prediction market texas still goes red in 2 days.



   
    You only have 20 dollars worth of confidence in their victory ?


--------------------


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #29715993 -

The Ecstatic said:
Actually, the left demonstrably votes for the moderate than the moderates do for the left.

The most famous example is Hillary voters going for McCain at twice the rate that Sanders voters went for Trump.

Look at Lieberman. Manchin. Fetterman. Stevens. Elon.

These demons want to make sure the democrats are the same as the republicans, and the moment that project is threatened, or even spoken about, they cry foul and say “I’d love to be a democrat but these loony lefties and minorities are forcing me towards fascism.”



Excellent point. I did not know that factoid, about Clinton voters. Doesn't surprise me one bit :lol:

Quote:
There’s something to be said about Sanders hijacking the Democratic Party. At the same time, the Dems sue to keep third parties off the ballot. It’s “fall in line, vote blue no matter who” until the DSA gets popular, and then everyone tells them to fuck off and create a third party.



The only thing to be said about Bernie "hijacking" the Democratic party, is that it was clearly symptomatic of the fact that the Democratic voters are deeply dissatisfied. Not "Shame on Bernie!!!" :lol:

Think about it, Bernie is utterly lacking of charisma, he has never in his life been a good looking man, he is older than my life expectancy by a decade, he identifies as a 'Socialist', which carries a certain taboo with a very significant number of voters, and he had relatively zero name recognition.

Now let's consider Clinton, one of the most well-known names in American politics, husband was a very successful president, she had way more big fat checks from wealthy donors, her former campaign manager was head of the DNC, and was actively helping her rig the ection in her favor, etc etc etc...

2016 was a rebuke of the status quo, and the response from establishment Democrats broke all of our hearts, and destroyed whatever faith many of us had in the mere possibility of changing the system from within.

I do thank then for it, though. It really was eye-opening for me, and many others, and we needed that wake up call.

Quote:
So yeah, if this two party system is premised on the idea that it’s the only way to flesh out democracy in the U.S., then you have to respect the will of the voters. Of course, the democrats don’t want to do that because they don’t receive hundreds of millions of dollars every cycle to represent the people, they get it to preserve and expand the wealth of the ruling class.



As you have said, we have a 2 party system. At the level of the presidency, it is virtually impossible, and realistically, it's just not practical to run 3rd party, except as a spoiler.

Saying Bernie shouldnt have run as a Democrat is just fucking stupid, unless:

A) You'd rather he act as a spoiler.
B) You don't believe in democracy.

Maybe psilynut thinks the aristocracy ought to choose for us. Either way, it's a ridiculous, stupid ass thing to say.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2]
    #29715997 -

Psilynut2 said:
Quote:
I got 20 bucks on robinhood prediction market texas still goes red in 2 days.



   
    You only have 20 dollars worth of confidence in their victory ?



Gambling is dumb.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: sudly] * 1
    #29716003 -

sudly said:
She endorsed Mike rodgers which is as close as declaring herself a republican as you can get without making the final step in paperwork.

Fetterman did a Freudian slip and called himself a republican somewhat recently..



These social media posts aged like milk:





She was on Anderson Cooper this evening and gave the most mealy-mouthed response imaginable, trying to play both sides and pretend she’s still a member of the democratic party.

is=pJ_2QYQRooJuyi-l

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: GerryD]
    #29716026 -

Quote:
Maybe psilynut thinks the aristocracy ought to choose for us. Either way, it's a ridiculous, stupid ass thing to say.




 
  Na bro I think the DNC should have said thanks for the 430  mil that made this possible  hilldog but we're going with the independent who gave us nothing cause democracy .
    How would they have funded the next primary ? With the 0 dollars Bernie contributed ?
  Is there some kind of magic ferry democracy dust that allows a political  party to operate ?


--------------------


Edited by Psilynut2 (11/02/26 01:25 AM)

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2]
    #29716030 -

Quote:
You kind of ignored  everything else I said too . So here's a repost , just for you .



Fair enough.

My apologies, it is late where I am, and I am kinda twacked...

Psilynut2 said:
Quote:
I just don't understand why people thought the DNC wasn't going to resist fundamentally being changed , by Bernie  .
Both Bernie and Hillary signed an agreement to give a portion of the money their campaigns raised to the DNC .
  Hillary raised a metric fuckton of money and gave the DNC 430 million . Bernie didnt raise any money through that agreement , he did grass roots and gave them nothing .
  Do you not see the problem ?





Interesting. I suppose that is an angle that I wasn't aware of. So, did Bernie make commitments that he didn't keep, or his donations didn't fund the DNC, because they were small dollar, grass roots donations?

Or are you saying he had obligations to do fund raising event type shit for the DNC, and he didn't deliver?

Either way, this actually is a good point against Bernie.
   
 
Quote:
He tried to hijak the platform to get elected as an independent . He didn't want to be a Democrat , he created this huge movement that he lost control of , when he lost he said hey guys vote for Hillary ,



He was never in control, or trying to control the movement. His whole shtick was:

Quote:
"This campaign was never just about electing a president of the United States—as enormously important as that was. This campaign was about transforming America. It was about the understanding that real change never takes place from the top on down. It always takes place from the bottom on up."



I suppose he succeeded in shifting the overton window.

Quote:
his people and heroine  addict criminals that fucked up their lives said fuck you , Trump.  This fucked the dnc over.



I realize you're trying to take a dig at me, but I wasn't a heroin addict til years later ;-).

Quote:
Did you really expect the dnc to say thanks for the money hilldog but we're going with Bernie cause democracy .
  That's seems incredibly childish and naive to me .
.





I don't see this as a mortal sin, but I see your point, and I am not entirely discounting it. I should learn more about this, before commenting on it, I suppose.

One thing I will say... Bernie is no saint, and while at one point, I would have twist myself in knots defending him, I no longer feel an impulse to do so.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


Edited by Bigbadwooof (11/02/26 01:41 AM)

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Re: TRUMP 2024 [Re: Psilynut2] * 1
    #29716031 -

Psilynut2 said:
Quote:
Maybe psilynut thinks the aristocracy ought to choose for us. Either way, it's a ridiculous, stupid ass thing to say.




 
  Na bro I think the DNC should have said thanks for the 430  mil that made this possible  hilldog but we're going with the independent who gave us nothing cause democracy .
    How would they have funded the next primary ? With the 0 dollars Bernie contributed ?
  Is there some kind of magic ferry democracy dust that allows a political  party to operate ?



So Hillary being given the free rein to be the top of the ticket in 2016 is right because she raised the most money.  Not the will of the voters. Or Biden being taken the to top of the ticket with back room deals for everyone else dropping out to get a cabinet appointment. Or Harris being pick cause she could use Biden campaign money,instead of an open convention. Where a true Democrat leader well venses in politics could take stage. Leading to a victory in 2024.


--------------------
The better guide to grow mushrooms.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/8553541

Beware the power of one.  The power of two. The power of many.

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