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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Forrester]
    #27665264 -

I know that yogis maintain it. I'm sure it must be supported in the Gita or other sources. I will see if I can locate.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #27665285 -

Buster_Brown said:
syncro said:
His views go well with a lot said in the Ego Wins thread. No matter how seemingly enlightened an experience, it is still "I". In the blissful states, and those where self seems to disappear, there is the larger ground of self, I, knowing it. Even Nirvana is not nihilistic. So what is there? Arguably, ego. ?


from Yogananda's poem, Samadhi

...
But ever-present, all-flowing I, I, everywhere.


Arguably an endeavor to disassociate events from agency.


Why not? Though it would depend on premise. A core message of the Maharamayana, an advaitic type scripture, for example, is that the world appearance arises with movement of thought, and together they cease.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Forrester]
    #27665583 -

Makes me think of one of the more interesting metaphors that UG spoke about his life.
Said something to the effect that everyone is riding a tiger, and that you can't jump off or risk being eaten, but for some reason he had been thrown off through no volition of his own.


--------------------
:leaf:LET'S REVIVE THE GROWERY!:leaf:

Texas Honey Badger said:
Flea is the only one that can say nigger

.-- .... .- - / .... .- - .... / --. --- -.. / .-- .-. --- ..- --. .... -

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: syncro]
    #27666430 -

syncro said:
But I think it could be a case where he was ripened by all these things but gives no credit to them.


I think you are right, he just doesn't give credit to his practices.
If enlightenment really were acausal, it would happen to a certain
percentage of people, never mind if they practiced or not.

I think it is a little like the Buddha's left side practice, where
he hurt himself, actually doing things like not eating for weeks,
trying to torture himself into enlightenment. He destroyed his body
during that practice, so he couldn't become older than eighty years.

Finally, he decided upon the middle path, which basically means that
you live like an ascetic, and have fun doing it. But would the Buddha
have become as powerful as he was without his hardcore practice? I
don' think so. He just didn't give credit to what he had done.

Well, there probably is a difference between a Buddha's path and a
monk's path. For a monk, enlightenment is enough. For a Buddha,
there are higher consciousness powers.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: AnattaAtman]
    #27666441 -

Or they realize that mystical powers don't achieve the goal of liberation.

I had an acquaintance a long time ago who said to me at a time when i was feeling very wizardly: "There is a difference between #1 and #2, even if #2 is very powerful"

I think about that sometimes. Not quite as concretely as he thought about it. I'm fairly certain he was referring to God as #1. But in a universal sense. If a Buddha incarnated and didn't want to, they were at best beholden to a power greater than their own


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Kickle]
    #27666531 -

Kickle said:
Or they realize that mystical powers don't achieve the goal of liberation.


By "higher consciousness powers", I did not mean mystical powers,
but things like love or equanimity - qualities that you do not
necessarily get with enlightenment. You have to find a separate
way of gaining them.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: AnattaAtman]
    #27666548 -

maybe


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Kickle]
    #27666578 -

This thread is nothing but the barking of dogs!


--------------------
:leaf:LET'S REVIVE THE GROWERY!:leaf:

Texas Honey Badger said:
Flea is the only one that can say nigger

.-- .... .- - / .... .- - .... / --. --- -.. / .-- .-. --- ..- --. .... -

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Fleabag Friend]
    #27666596 -

Yeah! Thanks for joining in
:wellhello:


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Forrester]
    #27666980 -

Forrester said:
syncro said:
It is said even among paths of form and practice that we cannot take the final step which is done for us, or happens without our able influence.


Which other sources say that?  Just curious, I'm not familiar with a lot of the details of many of the other paths.  Surprised there were others that said that exact thing that it says in the Course.


Well, I'm not having luck. I'm considering the possibility I'm just using the words from ACIM. It may have been sourced in some obscurity and good luck finding something in all the volumes around Hinduism without a lead. But in the search I've found myself wallowing in treasures addressing previous questions like the one we had in the ACIM thread involving the nature of our real creativity, that in the Shiva Sutra.


I have been contemplating the (non)planet Ketu (the southern lunar node.) It is also related to dogs, to placate him being kind especially to stray dogs. Now I'm associating Ketu, UG Krishnamurti, and barking dogs.

Ketu is excellent for liberation, but is considered malefic in that it can take everything else away. It does sound a bit like UG's path.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: syncro]
    #27667009 -



--------------------
:leaf:LET'S REVIVE THE GROWERY!:leaf:

Texas Honey Badger said:
Flea is the only one that can say nigger

.-- .... .- - / .... .- - .... / --. --- -.. / .-- .-. --- ..- --. .... -

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: syncro]
    #27667339 -

syncro said:
Forrester said:
syncro said:
It is said even among paths of form and practice that we cannot take the final step which is done for us, or happens without our able influence.


Which other sources say that?  Just curious, I'm not familiar with a lot of the details of many of the other paths.  Surprised there were others that said that exact thing that it says in the Course.


Well, I'm not having luck. I'm considering the possibility I'm just using the words from ACIM. It may have been sourced in some obscurity and good luck finding something in all the volumes around Hinduism without a lead. But in the search I've found myself wallowing in treasures addressing previous questions like the one we had in the ACIM thread involving the nature of our real creativity, that in the Shiva Sutra.



Yeah finding it would be quite difficult, but I'm almost sure you were right and I may have heard the idea mentioned somewhere else too. It may have been in the Ramana Maharshi book I'm reading so I may run across it again... There's a LOT of ides in that book that are the same ones in the course worded differently.


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Fleabag Friend]
    #27667361 -

The video link doesn't seem to work.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: AnattaAtman] * 2
    #27667364 -

Worked for me. You didn't miss anything.


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: syncro]
    #27667456 -

syncro said:
Buster_Brown said:
syncro said:
His views go well with a lot said in the Ego Wins thread. No matter how seemingly enlightened an experience, it is still "I". In the blissful states, and those where self seems to disappear, there is the larger ground of self, I, knowing it. Even Nirvana is not nihilistic. So what is there? Arguably, ego. ?


from Yogananda's poem, Samadhi

...
But ever-present, all-flowing I, I, everywhere.


Arguably an endeavor to disassociate events from agency.


Why not? Though it would depend on premise. A core message of the Maharamayana, an advaitic type scripture, for example, is that the world appearance arises with movement of thought, and together they cease.







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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #27667539 -

So, no need to disassociate, you mean? I'm not claiming expertise, but it's an odd subtlety, disassociation from attachment notions to realize union. Attachment is longing for union, but implies separation. The causelessness aspect reminds me of an answer to the question of why material creation, which was no cause. Mind as a crow alights on the branch, and the coconut falls, materiality, but there is no causal relation, the way I interpreted, Vasistha paraphrased.

If we are uniting with creation, then why the endless sky of only I? Because, as it goes, all is the one infinite consciousness, creation a flickering appearance within it.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: syncro]
    #27667661 -

If we are uniting with creation then why the endless sky of only I - - -

Limited horizons make for more reliable workers.

You could be someone's Jane instead of a fruitfly in a paradigm where women were the grounding force in relationships. - The page of limited horizons makes voluntary movement predictable, simply dangle the shiny "You're helping someone." And you're good to go for the next of your 8,400,000 lives.

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #27667806 -

Trying to marry me off. I was starting to get uniform consciousness I'll have you know, so I can create my own stuff. Now all this.


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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: syncro]
    #27668906 -

Well look what the king of cups brought in with the eight. From your posts I gather that you are in pain and don't see much prospect of a future, which budding psychologists night interpret as an end of life stage. Have you made arrangements for egress, set a date for self-disconnection?

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Re: U. G. Krishnamurti [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #27669555 -

What is the eight after king of cups?

Who is not in pain and pleasure here? How does one exit one thing? There are three waves on the single ocean, all the one, those the states of waking, dreaming, and deep sleep, the ocean being the fourth state, turiya, the ego's sleight of hand making something obvious, hidden. Beginning to see turiya, which I think is obvious, this is freaking fun, I mean a lot.

I've been considering the obviousness of turiya, which is intuitive for anyone who has received simple direction. But of course, it's impossible, too high, too subtle to reach, where actually, and teachers emphasize the simplicity to the would-be blind, as I have been anyway; it is like saying there is no soil to be found on the earth.

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