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Onlinechris77
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: primelines]
    #27993059 - 10/11/22 01:18 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

primelines said:
Wow that actually makes so much sense. Thank you.
I think Ive figured it out.....

If I find the Static Pressure of the filter(s) I can use the chart for the fan (pictured below) and I'll know the required CFM from the fan. So then I look at the the tables (second picture below) and it will tell me what speed setting this fan needs to be on to achieve laminar flow.





Sorry for hijacking the thread abit. In return I present to you an SAB build I thought of to do grain to grain transfer from jars to bags.



It requires 2 people. One person is responsible for pouring the master jar which they put in the upper box. The other person is responsible for opening and closing the bag in the lower box.

Not sure how practical this is but just something I thought about.



this defies the principles of a SAB as there will be a current of air through the openings.
its a no go.


--------------------
the observer is the observed
            j. krishnamurti

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Invisibleruawakeyet
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs *DELETED* [Re: chris77] * 1
    #28006012 - 10/19/22 08:19 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by ruawakeyet

Reason for deletion: Because I want to.

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: ruawakeyet] * 1
    #28006171 - 10/19/22 10:04 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

That's part of the intention with this thread, to clarify what and why.

The SAB portion of the OP clearly states that SAB is not only an acronym for still air box but includes the details describing why still air is necessary.

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OfflineTamahata
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: Stipe-n Cap] * 1
    #28007379 - 10/20/22 04:08 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

great info, TNX a lot!!

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Offlinewhatisanerd
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: Tamahata] * 1
    #28015973 - 10/25/22 01:36 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Thanks for the write up and for guiding my smooth brain.


--------------------
(♥_♥) LAGM 2023

 

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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: whatisanerd]
    #28018740 - 10/27/22 06:14 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

I use a ghetto boxfan "flow hood" and I have great results using it for agar and grain transfers. So, while it is not ideal, there is a way to use that one successfully


--------------------
Some art I've made Glass Art Gallery

I was raised a christian and was a stone-faced acid head
- Ken Kesey

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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: LiquidGlass] * 4
    #28018745 - 10/27/22 06:17 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

you could post up some pics or examples of your 'great results'.

not trying to be a dick but anyone can just use their own definition of great but without context its meaningless.

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: LiquidGlass] * 4
    #28018916 - 10/27/22 08:39 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

LiquidGlass said:
I use a ghetto boxfan "flow hood" and I have great results using it for agar and grain transfers. So, while it is not ideal, there is a way to use that one successfully





I hate to break it to you but the a science is not up for debate, it simply isn't.

In this case a great result would mean that you actually achieved laminar flow with your build, did you? No, you didn't.

What you mean here by "great result" is that despite the shortcomings of the design features of your contraption and the gaps in your understanding you managed to produce some mushrooms.

Producing plates, grain jars, or mushrooms of any quality whatsoever is not a sufficient condition for claiming that any given procedure, technique, or piece of equipment is a great success; it is a necessary condition, but not a sufficient condition.

On a small enough scale much can be achieved even with a fan blowing mold spores at you, much can be achieved with incomplete sterilization, septic technique, septic initial conditions, etc.

The fact that one can produce mushrooms without the proper equipment; starting conditions, materials, or techniques isn't a testament to the efficacy of those practices or materials so much as it is the reality of statistical probability and the hardiness of the organism.

Can you produce cultures and mushrooms without fancy lab equipment: yes

Can you produce the same using duct tape, cardboard and a complete misunderstanding of microbiology and physics: yes

To say that any septic technique or procedure is legitimized by the production of mushrooms is a type 1 error.

Mush Cult is one of the few hobby communities where folks line up to receive trophies for a job barely done.

Edited by Stipe-n Cap (10/27/22 04:02 PM)

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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: mushboy] * 2
    #28020552 - 10/27/22 11:37 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mushboy said:
you could post up some pics or examples of your 'great results'.

not trying to be a dick but anyone can just use their own definition of great but without context its meaningless.










--------------------
Some art I've made Glass Art Gallery

I was raised a christian and was a stone-faced acid head
- Ken Kesey

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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #28020557 - 10/27/22 11:43 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

It is quite an aasumption to say I have shortcomings in my "contraption" when you have no idea how it is designed and constructed, or that there's gaps in my knowledge, as you know nothing of of my knowledge or experience.
  And if it is really not up for debate, as you say, then there would be some legitimate peer reviewed studies on the effectiveness of Box fan flow hoods. If not then it is definitely still up for debate


--------------------
Some art I've made Glass Art Gallery

I was raised a christian and was a stone-faced acid head
- Ken Kesey

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Invisibleruawakeyet
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs *DELETED* [Re: LiquidGlass]
    #28020662 - 10/28/22 02:50 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by ruawakeyet

Reason for deletion: Because I want to.

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Offlineprimelines
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #28020708 - 10/28/22 04:39 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

p9hu7 said:
Mush Cult is one of the few hobby communities where folks line up to receive trophies for a job barely done.




Love that^

Take some pride in your work. Be about it.

If you have some ghetto rigged duct tape ass unit your a hack and that's that.


--------------------

Edited by primelines (10/28/22 04:40 AM)

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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: ruawakeyet]
    #28021143 - 10/28/22 11:10 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

ruawakeyet said:
Have you tried without the box fan filter thing? Just open air, on a table or whatever, and I bet you would have the same results as using a box fan filter thing. So you could still have stacked flushes, just with less equipment.




I've used a SAB with a lot less stellar results 🤷


--------------------
Some art I've made Glass Art Gallery

I was raised a christian and was a stone-faced acid head
- Ken Kesey

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: LiquidGlass] * 1
    #28021326 - 10/28/22 12:35 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Listen, man, this thread topic is related to the fundamental mechanics  of laminar flow, still air, and why they are preferable to all other half assed methods.

If you have a "cheap" set up that produces laminar flow then good for you; nobody, including myself is going to entertain cardboard boxes assembled with duct tape no matter what you have to say.

If that's not what you have, then say so, don't go bating with ambiguous commentary.

This thread will not turn into misguided arguments in favor of the very things this thread was designed to discourage, and they're to be discouraged for good reason.

It was o ly a matter of time before someone got butt hurt and posted about the grand efficiency of box fan flowhoods or automated mono-tubs, UVC, etc, etc.

If you want peer reviewed material then go find it, it's not like I engineered the clean bench and have foisted laminar flow on the community, there is good reason why you will never see this is in virology or microbiology laboratory:



If only the commercial farms new about this, the money they would save on purchasing or building expensive cabinets, bench', etc.

Why not just make a wall of laminar flow out of empty refrigerator boxes and call it a day.


Carry on.

Edited by Stipe-n Cap (10/28/22 12:51 PM)

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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #28021353 - 10/28/22 12:50 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

I'm not but hurt at all.  I am just commenting for the people that are wondering are on the fence if they can do it for less money or not. And for clarity,I would guess it's more in between a positive pressure box/boxfan flowhood. And I didn't use cardboard.
And for the people wondering, ignore the haters and elitists and just know that you actually can construct a decent flowhood with a boxfan. I have gone through around 250lbs of grain transfers using this with less than 1%contam rates. Don't let people discourage you from cheap diy stuff if it works efficiently


--------------------
Some art I've made Glass Art Gallery

I was raised a christian and was a stone-faced acid head
- Ken Kesey

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: LiquidGlass] * 1
    #28021361 - 10/28/22 12:55 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

LiquidGlass said:
I'm not but hurt at all.  I am just commenting for the people that are wondering are on the fence if they can do it for less money or not. And for clarity,I would guess it's more in between a positive pressure box/boxfan flowhood. And I didn't use cardboard.
And for the people wondering, ignore the haters and elitists and just know that you actually can construct a decent flowhood with a boxfan. I have gone through around 250lbs of grain transfers using this with less than 1%contam rates. Don't let people discourage you from cheap diy stuff if it works efficiently




Are you serious, 250 pounds! Wow, that sure is a lot of grain.:lol:

Like I said before and I will say it again:

ANYTHING is possible at small scale!

Laminar flow and still air are not elitist. Let me guess, did you use an instant pot to process all 250lbs or....

Let's keep this thread on topic, you're making it extremely difficult to gate keep
:rofl:

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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: Stipe-n Cap] * 1
    #28021382 - 10/28/22 01:08 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Tell me about it, and I have a 9-5 as well,I'm tired lol.  And for what it's worth that 250 pounds was used in a very short time just since I made the flow hood. I've gone through thousands of pounds with a still air Box
Also, I don't own an instant. I use a PC and, I use the worst, according to the shroomery😄, grain possible.....Popcorn Opening myself up to more hate there haha

And to be clear I'm not saying using an expensive laminar flowhood is elitist. I'm saying that people shooting other people down and calling them hacks or to be banned for using DIY methods is elitist


--------------------
Some art I've made Glass Art Gallery

I was raised a christian and was a stone-faced acid head
- Ken Kesey

Edited by LiquidGlass (10/28/22 02:22 PM)

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Invisibleruawakeyet
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs *DELETED* [Re: LiquidGlass]
    #28021389 - 10/28/22 01:09 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by ruawakeyet

Reason for deletion: Because I want to.

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InvisibleLiquidGlass
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: ruawakeyet]
    #28021395 - 10/28/22 01:11 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

I have 2 filters, one merv 13,  and 1 merv 14
And it works very well tbh


--------------------
Some art I've made Glass Art Gallery

I was raised a christian and was a stone-faced acid head
- Ken Kesey

Edited by LiquidGlass (10/28/22 01:45 PM)

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Box fan flowhoods, Glove boxes, Positive pressure boxes and Automated Mono-Tubs [Re: ruawakeyet] * 2
    #28021419 - 10/28/22 01:22 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Ok let's rein things in here.

Congratulations on your cultivation success using less than ideal methods, nobody ever once said that you cannot produce mushrooms this way, or any other less than ideal way; if you are happy with your results and process then that is excellent, well done.

I am not going to allow this thread to be highjacked by turbulent flow/positive pressure box hybrid enthusiasts.

There is absolutely no argument against still air or true laminar flow; fluid mechanics is a thing, physics is a thing, this has been clearly articulated in the OP:

Turbulence = contamination. Full stop.

Thanks.

Edited by Stipe-n Cap (10/28/22 03:14 PM)

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