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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #22948490 -

Not everyone feels the bad outweighs the good or haven't you noticed. If everyone felt that way the race would soon go extinct or very likely. Nature tries to avoid that.

Most imo bury their suffering into the unconscious and so tell themselves stories about how they can find some path that will completely end their suffering and that keeps them going like the proverbial carrot before the horse. Then one day maybe slow death catches up to them and then they finally awaken to the facts of life.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Icelander]
    #22948740 -

Icelander said:
Suffering comes and goes.

No not true for all. For some it comes and stays.  In youth when there is an injury there is usually little to no fear or depression for  the expectation is of a full recovery. In advanced old age with decrepitude or disease and constant pain there is no such carrot. It's a game changer imo.


Well, change the game back in your favor :smile2:.
Some people are born blind... Some people born w/o hearing.
Some people are born only seeing monochrome. Some can't see certain colors.
Some people born w/o being able to walk.

To be born with a greater degree of capability and then watch it wane ... Think of others who never had that capability to begin with.

Thus, suffering does come and go .. It comes and since it is such a divergence from a norm we might already know, we notice it and title it suffering. However, to what degree it lingers and stays is up to us. Now, that is not to say the strength to will oneself beyond it is not sometimes great .. But its there and to find it and maintain it, oh but a gift that might not have come w/o the suffering.

It's all a matter on how you decide to deal w/ it.
If you could dream on an infinite number of lives, one might be being totally blind.



You have a lot of capability beyond the physical, you just have to get in there and play w/ it.

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: iiilil]
    #22948849 -

Seems like discounting the pain one goes through. You're still pulling the "it can be worse" line, which is pretty condescending. Some people acknowledge that they are in pure pain with no way out. Those who claim there is strength to pull through haven't known such suffering. Being born blind is a major handicap, those who have it know it well. But they try to play it off like they don't want to see, because it's like some badge of honor to do so. The reality is that there is no honor in depending on society to carry you.


--------------------
As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: iiilil]
    #22948903 -

To be born with a greater degree of capability and then watch it wane ... Think of others who never had that capability to begin with.


So? :confused:

suffering does not come and go for all and my example stands without any refutation so far.  Some are tortured to death.  The only go is death. :satansmoking:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #22948924 -

" Naming the creator of 'good' (happy) and 'bad' (self-critical) thoughts - the 'puppy-dog' and 'dick-face' respectively for me (thanks to RJ Tubs 202 for this one!) "

Sounds like a mind fuckery prison.

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Icelander]
    #22948926 -

Icelander said:
To be born with a greater degree of capability and then watch it wane ... Think of others who never had that capability to begin with.


So? :confused:

suffering does not come and go for all and my example stands without any refutation so far.  Some are tortured to death.  The only go is death. :satansmoking:


Or embrace and find meaning in the torture breh :smile2:.
Go with the flow... Its only when you fight it that you suffer.
These are reflections from someone who has suffered a great deal. I don't make these statements having lived an ideal life.

You're right it doesn't come and go for all .. Because some choose to suffer to a greater degree beyond the onset of suffering. You choose how much you want to bask in it.

Look at you over here.. :
Icelander said:
It's pointless to you. You really still don't get this.  Meaning is subjective and we are subjects.  If one wants meaning for this life they make it.  Just because you don't in no way means that others care about that. They make some meaning to live by.  Why does this continually mystify you?


I see you Icelander :nicesmile: ..
Stop trying to be sneaky..you know what's up. You just like to play like you don't sometimes

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: iiilil]
    #22948971 -

Or embrace and find meaning in the torture breh :smile2:.

I can not seriously believe you just said that.:facepalm: What about a little child being tortured. 

Seems you just need to hold your ground no matter what even if it's nonsense.

And no you don't see me at all it seems.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (02/26/16 03:17 PM)

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Thanatos10]
    #22948982 -

Thanatos10 said:
Seems like discounting the pain one goes through. You're still pulling the "it can be worse" line, which is pretty condescending.


It would be condescending if you understood what pain and suffering i've gone through in my life and it were easy to define it as trivial. You don't. So, you understand to no higher degree what the basis of my words are beyond being words.

You ever stop to think, given how complex nature and biology are, why it is that we don't all turn out fucked up to a larger degree from birth? Why do we even exist in the first place?

What of the person who is born w/ an affliction and thus focuses more on this and thus lives a fulfilling life contributing to medicine and discovery? Most of the greatest scientist and mathematicians have suffered greatly btw...

That seemingly doesn't cross your mind ... So, what can you say about 'suffering'?

Thanatos10 said:
Some people acknowledge that they are in pure pain with no way out. Those who claim there is strength to pull through haven't known such suffering.



Actually, I find it to be to general contrary. Those who speak as though suffering is insurmountable typically have never gone through much of it. That or they have chosen to center on suffering. That isn't to say that I dismiss completely crazy edge cases.

However, your bold claim is without much foundation as there are plenty exceptions to what you're stating.

Thanatos10 said:
Being born blind is a major handicap, those who have it know it well. But they try to play it off like they don't want to see, because it's like some badge of honor to do so. The reality is that there is no honor in depending on society to carry you.


Sure it is .. So what does a person look like crying that its the end of the world from now until their death because they suffer from something that pales in comparison. Are you 'suffering' or could you suffer a hellavuh lot more?

You're alive ... That is in and of itself an immense privilege. What of the man who has everything but is thus blinded by it thus can't appreciate anything? What of their suffering?
So, quite clearly, you induce a great degree of your suffering. That fact that man can 'have everything' and yet still suffer goes to highlight that point.

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: iiilil]
    #22948984 -

It would be condescending if you understood what pain and suffering i've gone through in my life and it were easy to define it as trivial. You don't

Enlighten us.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Icelander]
    #22949010 -

Icelander said:
Or embrace and find meaning in the torture breh :smile2:.

I can not seriously believe you just said that.:facepalm: What about a little child being tortured. 

Seems you just need to hold your ground no matter what even if it's nonsense.

And no you don't see me at all it seems.


What's the alternative to all these complaints? You could be dead.
You could have never lived.

> Childhood suffering
> Born with multiple afflictions
> Have had later in life events happen outside my control that have limited me for the rest of my life...

Yeah man, have suffered a lot .. Have went through depression.. Have went through lots of shit.... I could sit around all day wallowing in sorrow .. I did for a time...But I chose, after being beaten the fuck down by life and seeing nothing come from wallowing to overcome it. It gives me the spirit I have. I gives me the unique perspective I have. I am grateful, I could be fucked 100x more.

You stated per your own words that life is subjective in other thread yet you're trying to get me to yield to objective suffering? Suffering is subjective man.

Life deals you cards ... You gotta take it for what it is and make the best of it.
We could all sit here showing our cards and showing how much we all suffer ... Every step of the way, someone is going to have shittier cards than you. So, what's the point? If anything, it should get you to see that for whatever you feel you suffer, someone suffers 1000 times more and there's someone who suffers 1000 times more who is more happy. If they can be happy by taking control of their subjective experience, how can you not be given that its 1000 times less?

We all have our shitty cards.. the game continues.
When the gig is up, you're going to wish you had a second chance.
Why live w/ such regret?

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: iiilil]
    #22949020 -

Please address how a little child being tortured to death is making their own suffering? I want to hear you make a mockery of this  whole subject.

When the gig is up, you're going to wish you had a second chance.
No I won't and I don't. You like to pretend you know how things are for everyone but you don't.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (02/26/16 03:32 PM)

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Icelander]
    #22949061 -

Icelander said:
Please address how a little child being tortured to death is making their own suffering?



Don't try to twist my words Icelander. You know better than that.
The event is suffering... What comes after for a time is indeed suffering as one tries to make sense of it and resolve it... After some time has past, what is the nature of suffering beyond being under one's control?

You speak as though childhood torture is some unique experience that only one unique person has gone through.... 

Icelander said:
I want to hear you make a mockery of this  whole subject.



I want to hear you !... after saying the exact same things I am saying right now over in another thread : https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22887284/fpart/12#22887284

try to twist this into somethings its not. I will begin quoting you further to bring out the meaning if your commentary calls for it.

Quote:
When the gig is up, you're going to wish you had a second chance.
No I won't and I don't. You like to pretend you know how things are for everyone but you don't.


I like to lay out the options that lie in front of everyone, the gift that life alone is, and highlight that they choose to a larger degree than not. What I continually get in response is that people want the plug pulled on this 'charade' so that there is truly 'objectivity'.

Yet, when probed deeper, there is limited understanding as to what that is.
I'm waiting for someone to be able to detail what that truly is and still ask for it...

So, you speak boldly but you know not what you say.
To that can be no further action beyond your subjective experience.

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: iiilil]
    #22949145 -

iiilil said:
Icelander said:
Please address how a little child being tortured to death is making their own suffering?



Don't try to twist my words Icelander. You know better than that.
The event is suffering... What comes after for a time is indeed suffering as one tries to make sense of it and resolve it... After some time has past, what is the nature of suffering beyond being under one's control?

You speak as though childhood torture is some unique experience that only one unique person has gone through.... 

Icelander said:
I want to hear you make a mockery of this  whole subject.



I want to hear you !... after saying the exact same things I am saying right now over in another thread : https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22887284/fpart/12#22887284

try to twist this into somethings its not. I will begin quoting you further to bring out the meaning if your commentary calls for it.

Quote:
When the gig is up, you're going to wish you had a second chance.
No I won't and I don't. You like to pretend you know how things are for everyone but you don't.


I like to lay out the options that lie in front of everyone, the gift that life alone is, and highlight that they choose to a larger degree than not. What I continually get in response is that people want the plug pulled on this 'charade' so that there is truly 'objectivity'.

Yet, when probed deeper, there is limited understanding as to what that is.
I'm waiting for someone to be able to detail what that truly is and still ask for it...

So, you speak boldly but you know not what you say.
To that can be no further action beyond your subjective experience.



Tiny children tortured to death have no time to resolve their suffering so I have no idea what you are talking about.  They suffer and then die, that's it. You can't talk around that.

I can't find what I said but anything I said 11 years ago or some such is irrelevant now.

I don't know what it is about  how you say shit but I really have a hard time understanding you.

But I do know you only speak for yourself even if you preach at me.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (02/26/16 04:09 PM)

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: iiilil]
    #22949181 -

Here's where I stand at this time in my life. Some suffering carries no meaning other than suffering. As in a child starving to death at 11 months old or being tortured by mad men.

Some suffering can have benefits in personal growth. I've never once disputed that.

Each person gets to decide if suffering is worth it for themselves.  People who presume to speak for others are fos imo.  Due to the fact that all things die it may make little difference in the long run what one chooses to do. Some people don't like this life for imo valid reasons and some do also for valid reasons. Those reasons are  personal and subjective and I have no desire to dispute  with either one on the validity of their preference. It's their life and I cannot know how it feels for them.  And imo anyone who presumes to know what others should do is very likely a ego driven blowhard. :shrug:  My 2 cents.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (02/26/16 04:24 PM)

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? *DELETED* [Re: Icelander] * 4
    #22949336 -

Post deleted by Lakefingers

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Lakefingers]
    #22949398 -

Being alive isn't a privilege, it's a curse.

For the exceptions you mention, those are few compared to the great number of people in the world. How many for each one died a pointless death. How many died in camps and torture for each 1 that made it.

That's the part they leave out. They leave out the thousands if not millions who died, they just focus on the small handful that made it.


--------------------
As lightless oblivion devours you, drown in the ever-blooming darkness.

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Lakefingers]
    #22949412 -

Lakefingers said:
There's a god here at the forum who demands eternal praise and its name is Suffering.


That, sir, is truly beautiful!


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Icelander]
    #22949427 -

Icelander said:
iiilil said:
Icelander said:
Please address how a little child being tortured to death is making their own suffering?



Don't try to twist my words Icelander. You know better than that.
The event is suffering... What comes after for a time is indeed suffering as one tries to make sense of it and resolve it... After some time has past, what is the nature of suffering beyond being under one's control?

You speak as though childhood torture is some unique experience that only one unique person has gone through.... 

Icelander said:
I want to hear you make a mockery of this  whole subject.



I want to hear you !... after saying the exact same things I am saying right now over in another thread : https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22887284/fpart/12#22887284

try to twist this into somethings its not. I will begin quoting you further to bring out the meaning if your commentary calls for it.

Quote:
When the gig is up, you're going to wish you had a second chance.
No I won't and I don't. You like to pretend you know how things are for everyone but you don't.


I like to lay out the options that lie in front of everyone, the gift that life alone is, and highlight that they choose to a larger degree than not. What I continually get in response is that people want the plug pulled on this 'charade' so that there is truly 'objectivity'.

Yet, when probed deeper, there is limited understanding as to what that is.
I'm waiting for someone to be able to detail what that truly is and still ask for it...

So, you speak boldly but you know not what you say.
To that can be no further action beyond your subjective experience.



Tiny children tortured to death have no time to resolve their suffering so I have no idea what you are talking about.  They suffer and then die, that's it. You can't talk around that.

I can't find what I said but anything I said 11 years ago or some such is irrelevant now.

I don't know what it is about  how you say shit but I really have a hard time understanding you.

But I do know you only speak for yourself even if you preach at me.


What do you know about death? or the end? What does anyone know about it who is alive..?
I hope this much is clear about my words.

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Jokeshopbeard]
    #22949444 -

Jokeshopbeard said:
Lakefingers said:
There's a god here at the forum who demands eternal praise and its name is Suffering.


That, sir, is truly beautiful!


It truly is !

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Re: How do you deal with YOUR suffering? [Re: Icelander] * 2
    #22949487 -

Icelander said:
Here's where I stand at this time in my life. Some suffering carries no meaning other than suffering.



How could you make that statement unless you were all knowing?


Icelander said:
As in a child starving to death at 11 months old or being tortured by mad men.
Some suffering can have benefits in personal growth. I've never once disputed that.

Each person gets to decide if suffering is worth it for themselves.  People who presume to speak for others are fos imo.  Due to the fact that all things die it may make little difference in the long run what one chooses to do. Some people don't like this life for imo valid reasons and some do also for valid reasons. Those reasons are  personal and subjective and I have no desire to dispute  with either one on the validity of their preference. It's their life and I cannot know how it feels for them.  And imo anyone who presumes to know what others should do is very likely a ego driven blowhard. :shrug:  My 2 cents.


You mistake my words and fail to see what you're saying in your own words...
Icelander said:
Some people do/don't like this life.
Those reasons are personal and subjective. It's their life



Do you. It's your life to live and death,in this realm, is a certainty.

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