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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: Telepylus]
    #6160724 - 10/12/06 10:13 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Telepylus said:
there are alot of absolute shitheads
and extreme dumbasses




case in point

Quote:

i think it's funny you are calling them out
when you are a classic example, evident in 95% of your posts




examples please?

Quote:

what the fuck is this demon baby head stickman jacking off about?
that avatar is absolutely repugnant and extremely annoying.




ok... it is batboy, masturbating. It has nothing to do with this thread, except your mission to argue only in ad hominems and flames. Your point?


Quote:

can you write a complete sentence that applies to Spirituality or Philosophy?
if so, please do it, or shut the fuck up




lets compare the amount of 50+ replies in all the P&S threads I have made compared to all the P&S thread you have made....

Also, im pretty sure the phrase "shut the fuck up", when directed towards another member is a flame, which is a bannable offense. i don't really care that you flamed me, but I would ask for the sake of agreed upon rules within this forum that you stick to the given guidelines for proper communication.


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: Fospher]
    #6160742 - 10/12/06 10:23 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Fospher said:


1. I can argue whatever I please. I dont always believe in what I argue, often I have alterior reasons. I might do it to better understand the opposite side of the fence. I might do it to generate a response, to probe information by challenging the other's belief. I might do it to challenge the argument, to question the moral precepts of the one arguing. Or, perhaps my argument goes farther than you currently see it, and indeed those two points do not contradict.




I agree with this. I do it often, but these two points are contradicting. According to you, you are either nothing, or everything, and the belief in absolutes cannot sustain duality.
When I do argue for the sake of argument and alternative viewpoints, I make sure not to contradict myself, and especially dont feel the need to make a pre-emptive strike towards shutting down a rebuttal which obviously points out that flaw.

Quote:

Do you believe that a red is not a red? That you can define your own car's color just by wishing it? Please notify me once you have the power to paint by thought, I might have a business proposal.




once again, present isness is not the same thing as absolute. Besides, thinking that there is only monochrome is quite narrow minded. The whole "is a zebra white with black stripes or black with white stripes" is somewhat of a Koan, because it is neither, striped is also a state or aesthetic, percievable quality. This argument you present is rooted in subjectivity... a subjectivity you refuse to look outside of (unless this is another controlled folly on your part). If the car were absolute red, that would mean that every single particle, which would have to cover every single part of the car, would have to be a uniform density of the vague description "Red", which I doubt any car (except in THEORY: remember that?) could claim.

Quote:

Now, as I have said before, there are no contradictions. The point of irrationality is what all rationality is built upon. It is like this in Math, in Logic, in Reality. In geometry, everything is built upon logic. Links connecting the substeps of rational analysis. If a is b and b is c, then a = c. For example, a triangle is three lines, forming together so the angles make up 180 degrees. A line is the shortest path from one point to another. But what is a point? Euclidian Geometry accepts it as an axiom, a 'thing' that has only position, but no further definition. It is not proved and is an initial necessary consensus for the theory building or acceptation.

So just like in Euclidian Geometry, a point is the core, so is the Mystical experience in Reality. It is the divine core of all existence, it is where everything comes from, the connection of all and none. It is the seed from which the tree is planted. The tree, the tree of life, follows logic at every corner, but the seed, the axiom on which it is built on, cannot be explained.




what bearing does this have on the conversation at hand? also, if you would like to get into math, how about a more "on topic" concept such as... absolute values? show me objective negative distance if you want to continue with this silly defense of absolute duality.


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Offlineshroom_me
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: Telepylus]
    #6162964 - 10/13/06 02:04 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Telepylus said:
of course there are absolutes and extremes, and that is what builds existence and reality.
it just depends on what dimensional levels your working with.

the singularity, duality, and trinity are absolute forces which build mathematics, geometry, and consciousness.

in the singularity there are no extremes because there is only ONEness.
as soon as you enter duality(the world) everything is split into male/female positive/negative light/dark, good/bad. and these are extremes-
sure, they are illusionary when viewed from the singularity.
but while we are in the world, they most certainly are very real and tangible to us- and absolutes in the equations of transmuting variables.

every once and awhile a person can eat LSD, and start writing some stream of consciousness crap like "i am everything"
and it's actually very beautiful and enlightening- this is rare, but it happens.

personally i'd rather enjoy reading some acidheads garbled vision of unity over some malconent skeptic who refuses to see past his own nose, and rather than trying to produce something insightful himself instead attempts to point out the inevitable flaws in all psuedo-sciences.

and i guess the point is, instead of talking about what is stupid or wrong, try to focus on what is smart and right, and build upon that.




Exactly..


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OfflineFospher
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6163001 - 10/13/06 02:19 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

psilocyberin said:
I agree with this. I do it often, but these two points are contradicting. According to you, you are either nothing, or everything, and the belief in absolutes cannot sustain duality.
When I do argue for the sake of argument and alternative viewpoints, I make sure not to contradict myself, and especially dont feel the need to make a pre-emptive strike towards shutting down a rebuttal which obviously points out that flaw.




When playing devil's advocate, the true intent will eventually come out in future retorts. It is not what you truly believe in, so at one point or another, you will have to contradict yourself. This is not the case in this thread.

Quote:


...once again, present isness is not the same thing as absolute. Besides, thinking that there is only monochrome is quite narrow minded. The whole "is a zebra white with black stripes or black with white stripes" is somewhat of a Koan...




Does it matter which way you put it then since both constitute the same meaning? The zebra is striped, is it not? If it was an issue of it being polka dotted, or checkered, your case would have merit. But black on white or white on black both constitute the same state.

Quote:

If the car were absolute red, that would mean that every single particle, which would have to cover every single part of the car, would have to be a uniform density of the vague description "Red", which I doubt any car (except in THEORY: remember that?) could claim.




Then why use any descriptive term to begin with? The only way to achieve this state is in a perfect virtual computer reality. By defining reality, we set form to existence. If someone would ask you to describe the color of the Corvette, what would you say?



We accept this state as an absolute because the deviation of the color of particles is unpragmatic to differentiate.


Quote:


what bearing does this have on the conversation at hand? also, if you would like to get into math, how about a more "on topic" concept such as... absolute values?




I would explain the link, but I think it would do us both better if you actually read it.

Quote:


show me objective negative distance if you want to continue with this silly defense of absolute duality.




Is this your rebuttal to my allusion? Because that really doesnt have to do with any aspect of this discussion. Distance only covers non-negative reals.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: Fospher]
    #6163048 - 10/13/06 02:39 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Fospher said:

When playing devil's advocate, the true intent will eventually come out in future retorts. It is not what you truly believe in, so at one point or another, you will have to contradict yourself. This is not the case in this thread.




you dont have to contradict yourself to play devils advocate.... and by constantly repeating that there is no contradiction doesn't make it so, I have made my point regarding this yet all you can say is "Nu uh".


Quote:


Then why use any descriptive term to begin with?



i dont have an issue with descriptive terms, I have issue with claiming that description is absolute. I just dont see your logic here.

Quote:

The only way to achieve this state is in a perfect virtual computer reality.




that is my point. Absolutes only exist in virtual realities like your head, a computer, and theories.

Quote:

By defining reality, we set form to existence. If someone would ask you to describe the color of the Corvette, what would you say?




I would call it red, just not absolute red.

Quote:

We accept this state as an absolute because the deviation of the color of particles is unpragmatic to differentiate.




I think you need to go read the definition of pragmatic.... because once again, you have contradicted yourself.... and this time it was within one sentence. The corvette gives the illusion of being absolutely red, when in reality it is not.


Quote:



I would explain the link, but I think it would do us both better if you actually read it.




silly me... of course! it all makes sense now... triangles = absolutes.... it makes so much sense now /sarcasm.


Quote:


Is this your rebuttal to my allusion? Because that really doesnt have to do with any aspect of this discussion. Distance only covers non-negative reals.




I would explain the link, but I think it would do us both better if you actually read it.


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Offlineslaphappy
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6164638 - 10/13/06 10:22 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Isn't this flaming the whole forum?

If you don't like absolutes and extremes, I dunno, perhaps "spirituality and philosophy" isn't up your alley.

Perhaps I'm just too used to Nietzsche, but I think being overly vague is a trait reserved for the critics, and not for the philosophers. Of course we say "maybe" and "perhaps" and throw in absolutely nothing and everything and love and energy and the lot, but thats pretty much what we like to discuss. If you are looking for more practical advice or middle-sized ideas like McKenna so nicely put it, perhaps you should try inputting your own, and then recheck the feedback you're getting...because this is the most absolute and extreme thread about absolutely nothing I have ever seen.

It can't get more vague than the statement that other people are vague.

Imho.


--------------------
The argent messenger of truth beyond truth, the antithesis of life, cruel and bleak as interstellar space, pulseless and frozen as absolute zero, dazzling with the frost of irrefragable logic and unforgettable fact.


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: slaphappy]
    #6166140 - 10/13/06 11:55 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

How would this thread be flaming? it is making an opinionated statement about the forum, and was also presented in a philosophical way.

I dont see how you think this thread is about nothing... unless you have only read the last few posts, but there has been discussion about it.

I find it funny that so many people are somewhat offended by this thread, and feel the need to attack me and the thread citing things such as lack of philosophical content... yet stop there, and add only derailing and vindictive comments... when in fact there is something philosophical that has developed from the original post.

Like I have said before, if I am guilty of this, then every single one of you are just as guilty of it due to your replies.

what is vague about this thread anyway? I cant think of anything more vague than calling something vague without citing reason for that opinion.... atleast I did that.

Also, maybe if you stay around a little longer you will see that I am a very active member in this particular forum.... I have started over 100 threads, and 3x more posts in this forum than you have in total. Please dont talk about input and content like that when my stats prove you dead wrong.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6166294 - 10/14/06 12:46 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I do not think it is necessarily agansit the intentions of the forum to discuss topics within the forum in such a manner, especially if some great philosophical and spiritual discussion results from doing so. Reviewing the original post itself, I think the fact that it is too vauge prevents any real discussion of the point that was intended to be discussed. You refer to a general "esoteric, extreme duality", but that doesn't exactly clarify what you are talking about. The fact that it does not address any specific person themselves is essential.

Overall, this thread almost seems to be a classic lesson from the Swami textbook. :smirk: All of the right ingredients are in place, and it is something that not only reflects on the original post, but some of the contributions that resulted.

I'm not so sure that this particular approach to proposing a topic for discussion is the most effective. :lol:

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6166304 - 10/14/06 12:49 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

probably not, but I have no doubt that the point of my thread has been understood.... maybe not agreed with though.

Also, how is it vague when the phrase in question was quoted?
I have seen more than one person say that phrase in here, as well as many other absolute dualities.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6166326 - 10/14/06 12:58 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

psilocyberin said:
probably not, but I have no doubt that the point of my thread has been understood.... maybe not agreed with though.




Perhaps they understand the position you have taken on some matter, but I'm not so sure that it is clear that your position is reflective of the reality of what you are referring to. It is hard to discern as it exists more as a strawman than as a representation of certain posts and what they contain. I understand your conclusion, but am not sure if it is valid because I have no clue what the conclusion stems from. In that way, it is rather vauge. :wink:

Quote:


Also, how is it vague when the phrase in question was quoted?
I have seen more than one person say that phrase in here, as well as many other absolute dualities.




Well, certainly, some discussion has resulted pertaining to the phrase, but I'm simply stating that it is rather unclear what the phrase was utilized in response to. You were proposing an analysis of posts in this forum in a general manner, and I find it vauge, as I am not sure what posts are being referred to, or, if it was intended to be a general analysis not associated with any particular thread, what relevance or grounding it has.

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6166340 - 10/14/06 01:03 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

maybe it could have been better stated as "i think the overly-esoteric threads which seem to prey on hopes of being mysteriously profound have no substance and are teh poo".

I think my possible vagueness was stemming from an attempt to curb my cynicism and assholeness.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6166361 - 10/14/06 01:12 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

psilocyberin said:
maybe it could have been better stated as "i think the overly-esoteric threads which seem to prey on hopes of being mysteriously profound have no substance and are teh poo".

I think my possible vagueness was stemming from an attempt to curb my cynicism and assholeness.




I think it might be one of those things that should be left for each individual to contemplate on their own (their judgement on whether or not others' threads have content), instead of something that is discussed within the forum. It always seems to lead to trouble... :grin:

I mean, hell, if something doesn't clearly violate the rules and offers some philosophical and spiritual content to discuss, then by all means, as long as the discussion is productive and doesn't continue to veer towards that first condition. It just feels as though we should be discussing something, instead of one's general judgement on something that exists within the thread itself as more of a strawman than anything of substance.

These are just the thoughts that I'm contemplating at the moment, certainly not completely representative of any official stance or anything. :lol: Just stoned as hell and interacting with some ideas. :bongload:

:levitate:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6166427 - 10/14/06 01:24 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

ok... well here is the culmination of the entire thread:

do you think this thread had more content than a "I am everything, I am nothing " thread?

was this thread helpful? damaging? or basically nullified itself?

Maybe this entire thread was a real time explanation of the uselessness of vague threads.......

:strokebeard:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6166459 - 10/14/06 01:30 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Maybe this entire thread was a real time explanation of the uselessness of vague threads.......

Took the words right out o my mouth. :tongue:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6166461 - 10/14/06 01:30 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

If that was the culmination, that means I can lock it, right? :smirk:

:earth: :sun: :headbang: :levitate:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6166473 - 10/14/06 01:33 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

fine by me.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: absolutes and extremes [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #6166490 - 10/14/06 01:35 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

This thread has been closed.

Reason:
Was only joking, but I think we feel that this thread has attained its purpose. :wink:


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