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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: egghead1]
    #3979952 -

The word of Buddha, in ABSENCE OF THE FIVE HINDRANCES states ?He has cast away Ill-will; he dwells with a heart free from ill-will; cherishing love and compassion toward all living beings, he cleanses his heart from ill-will.?


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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: egghead1]
    #3979956 -

egghead1 said:
But would that justification be of any benefit? Mixing philosophies is exactly what cult leaders do, am i wrong?


That is another question, what is on trial on this thread is
wheather you can accept both christianity and buddhism at the same time..


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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: egghead1]
    #3979958 -

common themes
that we get lost
that we seek
that we find refuge
that we question
that we achieve ecstatic union with the unlimited
(that we raise the sparks)


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:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Cyber]
    #3979960 -

Cyber said:
The word of Buddha, in ABSENCE OF THE FIVE HINDRANCES states ?He has cast away Ill-will; he dwells with a heart free from ill-will; cherishing love and compassion toward all living beings, he cleanses his heart from ill-will.?


ill will, the root of word evil?


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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #3979997 -

Ahh, i must have missed that, thank you?  :heart: :sun: :tongue: :wink: :crazy:

But i do not think that you can practice two very different religions together. Although you can claim to be of neither and practice the essence of both, which is Loving compassion... :heart:


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All you need is Love! Really thats it! Infinite Unconditional Love! Just develop that and all else will fall into place perfectly!

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: egghead1]
    #3980016 -

egghead1 said:
Ahh, i must have missed that, thank you?  :heart: :sun: :tongue: :wink: :crazy:

But i do not think that you can practice two very different religions together. Although you can claim to be of neither and practice the essence of both, which is Loving compassion... :heart:


yea,if you mix religions it stops being a religion, it's then just a personal form of spirituality.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #3980019 -

OldWoodSpecter said:
egghead1 said:
But would that justification be of any benefit? Mixing philosophies is exactly what cult leaders do, am i wrong?


That is another question, what is on trial on this thread is
whether you can accept both Christianity and Buddhism at the same time..


The point is not the mixing of philosophies. It is accepting that God, Neter, Alla, Yahweh, etc. speaks/appears/is perceived to different people in different ways. The messages are there to be learned. You follow the path and messages that are true to you, but in doing so you accept that the paths are not the same for all people. We are all bothers and one persons perception of God should not hinder anothers perception of God.

As to the statement as to whether or not that is what cult leaders do. That would depend on your definition of a cult. You must remember that some Christians see Mormons as a cult. I know many Catholics that see Baptists as a cult. The base concept of a cult (IMHO) is to divided. To divide the parishioners from there family, to divided there religion from others, and to control based on interpretation of religious beliefs. I simply follow God as I see him/her. I do not ask anyone to believe as I do, nor do I condemn them for believing differently.


--------------------
Shop SMART, Shop S-MART!
--------
How to build a Martha
Self Healing Injection point lids
WBS myco-bag Tek
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How to build a bulk steam pasteurizing unit
Answers to the 10 most common questions I have see about drying mushrooms.
Cybers Liquid Culture Tek

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #3980027 -

Not really, it becomes like spiritual supermarket shopping then. Where you choose a little from each and call that your 'spirituality'. But if you just practice loving kindess which is the root of all religion, it does not matter whether you call yourself a 'Buddhist or a 'Christian' becuase your practice is just Loving Kindness to all beings and thats it!

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: egghead1]
    #3980067 -

But everybody has this supermarket approach more or less.
Even if you are a serious scientist, you will lean to certain theories and doubt others because they feel right or feel wrong.
Church was build on top of a giant supermarket like that. Theology is shoping in supermarket. The words are there in the books, but
they have been mixed, selected, combined, jumped in conclusions etc etc by theologists who teach the people, then the people only hear and take of the shelf what make sense to them.
If that was not so, there would be perfect peace and love in the christian world because that is what new testament teaches. It is not peace because a lot of christians use supermarket approach to bible, and hear only what confirms their intuition, habits, logic, urges etc etc.

Have you notice how a lot of christians in some instances quote the old testament (for example when they are angry and want to justify it) and quote new testament in others (when they need help or are in trouble)
that is supermarket approach


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Cyber]
    #3980097 -

Your sermon is indeed a message from God. Love is the Key.


The notion that truth can be found in all religion also rings true, but you lack a metaphysics.

You say that God cannot be understood, and this is true in the Kantian sense of categorization and comprehension of phenomena, but unless the word "God" be rendered meaningless, we must be able to affirm something about who God is. If one were to say for example "God created the universe", then he would be affirming that "God" means creator of the universe. Likewise if one were to say "God is love", then he would be affirming that God and Love are of the same substance.

While God cannot be comprehended, he can be known. In the same way which I can say "I know my friend John", I can also say "I know God." It is folly to speak of God without defining the term "God" in some way. And, once we say anything about what "God" means, we are engaging in a metaphysics of God, which of course leads to Doctrine.

It seems if you were to say that there is truth in all religion, then you must either only accept as true those parts which are common to all religions, or you could merely pick and choose what you liked from each one.

If you choose to believe only those doctrines held in common by all religions, then you will be left with little to believe in. A similar path was followed by the Unitarians, and now they don't even mention the word "God" in their services. The end of this path is Atheism.

If you rather pick and choose what you believe to be true and false about each religion, then upon what are you basing your choices? If you chose based on personal feeling, then you are like the man who built his house on sand. One false premise and the conclusion of the whole argument is false, no matter how well structured it will not produce the truth. The pick and chose folks are building castles in the sky, with no foundation in the truth.

Perhaps I am wrong about Southern Kemetic Orthodoxy. Perhaps there is a coherent metaphysics. IF there is, I would love for you to tell us about it.

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: shroomydan]
    #3980428 -

Quote:
The notion that truth can be found in all religion also rings true, but you lack a metaphysics.

You say that God cannot be understood, and this is true in the Kantian sense of categorization and comprehension of phenomena, but unless the word "God" be rendered meaningless, we must be able to affirm something about who God is. If one were to say for example "God created the universe", then he would be affirming that "God" means creator of the universe. Likewise if one were to say "God is love", then he would be affirming that God and Love are of the same substance.


What I am saying is that God as a whole can not be understood. You can understand aspects of God Love, Creation, Order, Good, Evil, etc. Have you ever tried to read the true name of God? In Judaism the Talbot is the True name of God written out. Man can not understand it, so the name is broken into words and sentences that we can comprehend the name of God through the actions of God.

Quote:
While God cannot be comprehended, he can be known. In the same way which I can say "I know my friend John", I can also say "I know God."


Aspects of God can be known just as you know one aspect of John but you can not know God as a whole. To use a VERY extreme example, Jeffery Dahmer's neighbors knew him and described him as a "Polite young man.", "A nice boy.", "A polite and quite person." None of them knew him as a whole and many still can not comprehend him as a whole.

Quote:
It is folly to speak of God without defining the term "God" in some way.


The term GOD is a term made by man to give a name to something that can not be comprehended as a whole. If I remember correctly you went to Catholic seminary, So answer this simple question. Which Catholic God is the true God? (Father, Son, or the holey ghost) The Catholics treat them as one God (The trinity) but define them as different entities.

Quote:
It seems if you were to say that there is truth in all religion, then you must either only accept as true those parts which are common to all religions, or you could merely pick and choose what you liked from each one.


The other side of that coin is to say that there is only one TRUE religion and all others are false. This leads to the question of, which religion of the 190,000+ is the right one? This leads to struggle and to quote Yoda (Yes I am about to quote a movie character) "Struggle leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and hate leads to the dark side" The point is that to chose one religion and to say that religion is the correct religion. Is only to say that the religion is correct for you. It is the aspect of God that speaks loudest to you and the one in which you believe. It is not to create a religion based on aspects of other religions or to accept only the common aspects of all religions. It is to accept all religions as being correct and true to a God that we can not comprehend.

Quote:
If you rather pick and choose what you believe to be true and false about each religion, then upon what are you basing your choices? If you chose based on personal feeling, then you are like the man who built his house on sand. One false premise and the conclusion of the whole argument is false, no matter how well structured it will not produce the truth. The pick and chose folks are building castles in the sky, with no foundation in the truth.


The truth is that there is no right or wrong religion. They are only paths that lead to knowing God. Like cars on the road we each have a vehicle that works for us. There is no right or wrong car.

Quote:
Perhaps I am wrong about Southern Kemetic Orthodoxy. Perhaps there is a coherent metaphysics. IF there is, I would love for you to tell us about it.


Nature points to the notion of order in that things seem to have an innate sense of purpose (design?). We know that nothing that has purpose does so without the aid of a 'guiding hand' thus everything in nature is directed to its goal by God. There are hundreds of thousands of religious beliefs in God or Gods, We do not understand this because God is beyond our understanding. It is not our place to judge the religions, or to decided what Gods true intent is. As a Catholic priest takes confession, no matter how heinous the confession is, he never reveals it. Because he knows that God has a plan that he can not comprehend.


--------------------
Shop SMART, Shop S-MART!
--------
How to build a Martha
Self Healing Injection point lids
WBS myco-bag Tek
Growing mushrooms in a CD-Spendle
How to build a bulk steam pasteurizing unit
Answers to the 10 most common questions I have see about drying mushrooms.
Cybers Liquid Culture Tek

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Cyber]
    #3980851 -

Well join the club. I too am a minister. The Universal Life Church will ordain anyone...legally...for free. My dog, Leonard, an uncommonly intelligent mutt, is also ordained. He is the High Priest in my personal church.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3980899 -

cyber, got some questions...

first off let me say about drugs, I don't believe there is anything spiritual about any drug at all, i believe WE as people are spiritual, people just fool themselves into thinking drugs are what caused them to be spiritual, but really it was them themselves who decided to be spiritual while on drugs, and I also have no respect for any drug, not in the least, what i have is respect for MY mind and body, to me drugs are just toys and at best personnal tools for theraputic reasons, I think people who see drugs as anything Spiritual are fooled by them, the use of drugs, albeit to teach people about God and/or love, is imo, very very close to brainwashing people, how do you defend your statements about drugs being "spiritual" and how they should be treated with "respect" and not to be used for recreation?

also, about your avater, is that appropiate for a minister? should'nt you have respect for all people who might get offneded by it? or even people might get eroused by it, even though there here for s&p and not for titties, should'nt you be considerate of everyone that might be trying to avoid erousle? (there was a thread not to long ago about a guy here trying to stop these urges in fact.)


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hello, your name is life on earth
------------------------------------

"I traveled a long way seeking God, but when I finally gave up and turned back, there He was, within me! O Lalli! Now why do you wander like a beggar? Make some effort, and He will grant you a vision of Himself in the form of bliss in your heart." -the saint of the Kashmir Shaivism tradition: Lalli.

Edited by JCoke (03/28/05 04:17 PM)

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Cyber]
    #3981058 -

Being ordained means that others have convinced you that they have/had more power than you; that they could transmit their connection with Spirit or at least, their superior wisdom and insight.

What I am saying (and none of this is a slam - merely an observation), is that being "certified" by others is merely a socio-political role-playing game and has nothing to do with spirituality.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Swami]
    #3981079 -

You don't have to convince anyone of anything. Hell, you don't even have to believe in God.

"Within and without the corporate structure is the new denomination in operation within the church corporation named Existentialism. What that means simply is that you are free to make up your own mind ? that?s all. So you are an Existentialist right now and did not even know it."

http://www.ulc.org/


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Cyber]
    #3981141 -

Well said, the root of all religion is love for one and all, and unfortunately this is also the first thing religions lose as they progress. Personally I believe that spirituality is a very individual thing.....there is one truth, one bigger picture....but every single person has a different perception of it, and a different path to follow. We are all one, and we shall all return to the state of All.


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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Cyber]
    #3982047 -

I will answer your question to the best of my abilities.

Quote:
So answer this simple question. Which Catholic God is the true God? (Father, Son, or the holey ghost) The Catholics treat them as one God (The trinity) but define them as different entities.


There is only one God. He is the source and ground of all that is. Within the one Godhead there are three persons engaged in an interpersonal loving relationship with one another. 

From the eternal now before creation, God the Father (first person of the Blessed Trinity) speaks a Word (logos). This word of God is the only begotten son of the Father, and is God himself (Second person of the Blessed Trinity). Because the the utterance of the Logos is an eternal (timeless) event, it would not be true to say that there was a time when God the Father was alone.

Hence we say the Son is:
      eternally begotten of the Father,
      God from God, Light from Light,
      true God from true God,
      begotten, not made,
      of one Being with the Father;
      through him all things were made (Nicean Creed).
http://www.christianitysite.com/NiceneCreed.htm

Yours is princely power from the day of your birth. In holy splendor before the daystar, like the dew I begot you. (Psalm 110).
http://www.nccbuscc.org/nab/bible/psalms/psalm110.htm

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
He was in the beginning with God. All things came to be through him, and without him nothing came to be. What came to be
through him was life, and this life was the light of the human race; the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it (Gospel of John).
http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/john/john1.htm

The bound of love between the Father and the Son is so profoundly and necessarily real that its being is of the same substance as the Father and the Son. The Holy Spirit (The Spirit of Wisdom, The Spirit of Love) is the third person of the Blessed Trinity who "Proceeds from the Father and the Son" (Nicean Creed).
http://www.christianitysite.com/NiceneCreed.htm

The One True God is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Then Jesus approached and said to them, "All power in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" (Gospel of Matthew).
http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/matthew/matthew28.htm


If you wish to contemplate the mystery of the Blessed Trinity then you must understand that at the highest level of reality 3=1. Of course this is beyond the categories of the understanding. This ultimate truth is a sublime mystery.  :smile:

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: shroomydan]
    #3982529 -

Shroomdan has some good quotes, but i was wondering if you people even know what you are talking about when you say that Buddhism is similar to Christianity in terms of worshiping God. Like read about Buddha, he never tried to create a religion, he never really wanted people to follow him. Buddhism to me is more of a philosophy. I just don't see how people can take it as a religion.


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Love Mercy, Act Justly and Walk Humbly - Micah 6:8

"Although they plan, Allah also plans. And Allah is the Best of Planners." [Holy Qur'an 8:30]

"Allah says: O son of Adam devote yourself to worshipping Me, and I will fill your bosom with richness and remove your poverty. And if you do not do this, then I will fill your bosom with occupation and distraction and I will not remove your poverty."

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: CyruxMafia]
    #3982546 -

Shroomdan, For me I understand the 3=1 point but why can't i just worship the "father" and disregard the other 2, i get the same answer: 1=1 so doesn't that make more sense?


--------------------
Love Mercy, Act Justly and Walk Humbly - Micah 6:8

"Although they plan, Allah also plans. And Allah is the Best of Planners." [Holy Qur'an 8:30]

"Allah says: O son of Adam devote yourself to worshipping Me, and I will fill your bosom with richness and remove your poverty. And if you do not do this, then I will fill your bosom with occupation and distraction and I will not remove your poverty."

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Re: Yes, I am a Minister! [Re: Cyber]
    #3982579 -

:japsmile: :gassho:


--------------------
"I'm afraid of losing my obscurity. Genuineness only thrives in the dark. Like celery."
- Aldous Huxley

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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