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Offlineekomstop
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Kerry Won - Here are the Facts.
    #3323736 - 11/05/04 10:54 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=392&row=0

Kerry Won.
Here are the Facts.
excerpted from TomPaine.com
Thursday, November 4, 2004
E-Mail Article
Printer Friendly Version

by Greg Palast

Bush won Ohio by 136,483 votes. Typically in the United States, about 3 percent of votes cast are voided?known as ?spoilage? in election jargon?because the ballots cast are inconclusive. Drawing on what happened in Florida and studies of elections past, Palast argues that if Ohio?s discarded ballots were counted, Kerry would have won the state. Today, the Cleveland Plain Dealer reports there are a total of 247,672 votes not counted in Ohio, if you add the 92,672 discarded votes plus the 155,000 provisional ballots. So far there's no indication that Palast's hypothesis will be tested because only the provisional ballots are being counted.


Kerry won. Here's the facts.

I know you don't want to hear it. You can't face one more hung chad. But I don't have a choice. As a journalist examining that messy sausage called American democracy, it's my job to tell you who got the most votes in the deciding states. Tuesday, in Ohio and New Mexico, it was John Kerry.

Most voters in Ohio thought they were voting for Kerry. CNN's exit poll showed Kerry beating Bush among Ohio women by 53 percent to 47 percent. Kerry also defeated Bush among Ohio's male voters 51 percent to 49 percent. Unless a third gender voted in Ohio, Kerry took the state.

So what's going on here? Answer: the exit polls are accurate. Pollsters ask, "Who did you vote for?" Unfortunately, they don't ask the crucial, question, "Was your vote counted?" The voters don't know.

Here's why. Although the exit polls show that most voters in Ohio punched cards for Kerry-Edwards, thousands of these votes were simply not recorded. This was predictable and it was predicted. [See TomPaine.com, "An Election Spoiled Rotten," November 1.]

Once again, at the heart of the Ohio uncounted vote game are, I'm sorry to report, hanging chads and pregnant chads, plus some other ballot tricks old and new.

The election in Ohio was not decided by the voters but by something called "spoilage." Typically in the United States, about 3 percent of the vote is voided, just thrown away, not recorded. When the bobble-head boobs on the tube tell you Ohio or any state was won by 51 percent to 49 percent, don't you believe it ... it has never happened in the United States, because the total never reaches a neat 100 percent. The television totals simply subtract out the spoiled vote.


Whose Votes Are Discarded?

And not all votes spoil equally. Most of those votes, say every official report, come from African-American and minority precincts. (To learn more, click here.)

We saw this in Florida in 2000. Exit polls showed Gore with a plurality of at least 50,000, but it didn't match the official count. That's because the official, Secretary of State Katherine Harris, excluded 179,855 spoiled votes. In Florida, as in Ohio, most of these votes lost were cast on punch cards where the hole wasn't punched through completely?leaving a 'hanging chad,'?or was punched extra times. Whose cards were discarded? Expert statisticians investigating spoilage for the government calculated that 54 percent of the ballots thrown in the dumpster were cast by black folks. (To read the report from the U.S. Civil Rights Commission, click here.)

And here's the key: Florida is terribly typical. The majority of ballots thrown out (there will be nearly 2 million tossed out from Tuesday's election) will have been cast by African American and other minority citizens.

So here we go again. Or, here we don't go again. Because unlike last time, Democrats aren't even asking Ohio to count these cards with the not-quite-punched holes (called "undervotes" in the voting biz). Nor are they demanding we look at the "overvotes" where voter intent may be discerned.

Ohio is one of the last states in America to still use the vote-spoiling punch-card machines. And the Secretary of State of Ohio, J. Kenneth Blackwell, wrote before the election, ?the possibility of a close election with punch cards as the state?s primary voting device invites a Florida-like calamity.?

But this week, Blackwell, a rabidly partisan Republican, has warmed up to the result of sticking with machines that have a habit of eating Democratic votes. When asked if he feared being this year's Katherine Harris, Blackwell noted that Ms. Fix-it's efforts landed her a seat in Congress.

Exactly how many votes were lost to spoilage this time? Blackwell's office, notably, won't say, though the law requires it be reported. Hmm. But we know that last time, the total of Ohio votes discarded reached a democracy-damaging 1.96 percent. The machines produced their typical loss?that's 110,000 votes?overwhelmingly Democratic.


The Impact Of Challenges

First and foremost, Kerry was had by chads. But the Democrat wasn't punched out by punch cards alone. There were also the 'challenges.' That's a polite word for the Republican Party of Ohio's use of an old Ku Klux Klan technique: the attempt to block thousands of voters of color at the polls. In Ohio, Wisconsin and Florida, the GOP laid plans for poll workers to ambush citizens under arcane laws?almost never used?allowing party-designated poll watchers to finger individual voters and demand they be denied a ballot. The Ohio courts were horrified and federal law prohibits targeting of voters where race is a factor in the challenge. But our Supreme Court was prepared to let Republicans stand in the voting booth door.

In the end, the challenges were not overwhelming, but they were there. Many apparently resulted in voters getting these funky "provisional" ballots?a kind of voting placebo?which may or may not be counted. Blackwell estimates there were 175,000; Democrats say 250,000. Pick your number. But as challenges were aimed at minorities, no one doubts these are, again, overwhelmingly Democratic. Count them up, add in the spoiled punch cards (easy to tally with the human eye in a recount), and the totals begin to match the exit polls; and, golly, you've got yourself a new president. Remember, Bush won by 136,483 votes in Ohio.


Enchanted State's Enchanted Vote

Now, on to New Mexico, where a Kerry plurality?if all votes are counted?is more obvious still. Before the election, in TomPaine.com, I wrote, "John Kerry is down by several thousand votes in New Mexico, though not one ballot has yet been counted."

How did that happen? It's the spoilage, stupid; and the provisional ballots.

CNN said George Bush took New Mexico by 11,620 votes. Again, the network total added up to that miraculous, and non-existent, '100 percent' of ballots cast.

New Mexico reported in the last race a spoilage rate of 2.68 percent, votes lost almost entirely in Hispanic, Native American and poor precincts?Democratic turf. From Tuesday's vote, assuming the same ballot-loss rate, we can expect to see 18,000 ballots in the spoilage bin.

Spoilage has a very Democratic look in New Mexico. Hispanic voters in the Enchanted State, who voted more than two to one for Kerry, are five times as likely to have their vote spoil as a white voter. Counting these uncounted votes would easily overtake the Bush 'plurality.'

Already, the election-bending effects of spoilage are popping up in the election stats, exactly where we'd expect them: in heavily Hispanic areas controlled by Republican elections officials. Chaves County, in the "Little Texas" area of New Mexico, has a 44 percent Hispanic population, plus African Americans and Native Americans, yet George Bush "won" there 68 percent to 31 percent.

I spoke with Chaves' Republican county clerk before the election, and he told me that this huge spoilage rate among Hispanics simply indicated that such people simply can't make up their minds on the choice of candidate for president. Oddly, these brown people drive across the desert to register their indecision in a voting booth.

Now, let's add in the effect on the New Mexico tally of provisional ballots.

"They were handing them out like candy," Albuquerque journalist Renee Blake reported of provisional ballots. About 20,000 were given out. Who got them?

Santiago Juarez who ran the "Faithful Citizenship" program for the Catholic Archdiocese in New Mexico, told me that "his" voters, poor Hispanics, whom he identified as solid Kerry supporters, were handed the iffy provisional ballots. Hispanics were given provisional ballots, rather than the countable kind "almost religiously," he said, at polling stations when there was the least question about a voter's identification. Some voters, Santiago said, were simply turned away.


Your Kerry Victory Party

So we can call Ohio and New Mexico for John Kerry?if we count all the votes.

But that won't happen. Despite the Democratic Party's pledge, the leadership this time gave in to racial disenfranchisement once again. Why? No doubt, the Democrats know darn well that counting all the spoiled and provisional ballots will require the cooperation of Ohio's Secretary of State, Blackwell. He will ultimately decide which spoiled and provisional ballots get tallied. Blackwell, hankering to step into Kate Harris' political pumps, is unlikely to permit anything close to a full count. Also, Democratic leadership knows darn well the media would punish the party for demanding a full count.

What now? Kerry won, so hold your victory party. But make sure the shades are down: it may be become illegal to demand a full vote count under PATRIOT Act III.

I used to write a column for the Guardian papers in London. Several friends have asked me if I will again leave the country. In light of the failure?a second time?to count all the votes, that won't be necessary. My country has left me.


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
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Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 16,296
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Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: ekomstop]
    #3323748 - 11/05/04 10:58 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

oh lord, let the clowns banter.

Kerry lost, fair and square.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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InvisibleVvellum
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Registered: 05/24/04
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Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3323968 - 11/05/04 12:16 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

care to actually address palast's argument?


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InvisibleOJK
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Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3323985 - 11/05/04 12:21 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Innvertigo said:
oh lord, let the clowns banter.

Kerry lost, fair and square.





Well, I for one am convinced.

:flipthebird: :rolleyes: :flipthebird:


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Offlinericelicker
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Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Vvellum]
    #3323997 - 11/05/04 12:25 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

bi0 said:
care to actually address palast's argument?




No, he'd rather just say he's wrong and walk away..... much easier.


--------------------
"my brain waves travel at half the speed afta we..." -del tha funkee

"Two men looked out through prison bars...one saw the mud, one saw the stars." -anonymous


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Anonymous

Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: ekomstop]
    #3324111 - 11/05/04 12:54 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

i think we all knew that there were going to be plenty of "kerry won" claims coming out of this election no matter what. we can of course count on greg palast to bring us some of them.

i'd take what he has to say much more seriously if he provided some sources for the many claims he makes in this article. he makes a lot of claims in this article without any proof or even evidence to back them up. then, he speculates, based on his unsupported claims, that kerry actually won.

if there is evidence to support greg's claims, he sure doesn't provide any.


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Vvellum]
    #3324122 - 11/05/04 12:57 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

bi0 said:
care to actually address palast's argument?



Same as in Florida in 2000, Democratic voters are too dim to properly punch a ballot. But those 'dumb hicks' by contrast seem to be able to muster the intellect and hand-eye coordination to properly cast their ballots for Republicans. Go figure...


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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InvisibleVvellum
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Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: ]
    #3324127 - 11/05/04 12:59 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

evidence comes from investigation. investigation takes time. the election as 3 days ago. evidence will be uncovered.


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InvisibleVvellum
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Posts: 10,920
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Evolving]
    #3324135 - 11/05/04 01:00 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

who said anything about voter error?


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: ]
    #3324136 - 11/05/04 01:00 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah, predictable to say the least.

Remember, Kennedy pribably stole his election.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleVvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Rose]
    #3324140 - 11/05/04 01:02 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Considering the evidence, I think Nixon won.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Vvellum]
    #3324148 - 11/05/04 01:04 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Me too...

My point is the average shroomerite is a conspiracy buff by nature.

EVERYTHING that happens CAN'T be a conspiracy.

Sometimes, the nation just picks the other guy... and sometimes YOUR guy's the cheater.

Is that scary?

Well, it is true.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Vvellum]
    #3324155 - 11/05/04 01:07 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Spoiled ballots... it doesn't take a rocket scientist to properly punch a ballot, mmmkay.

Here's your official Democratic party seal...


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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InvisibleGijith
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Loc: New York
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: ]
    #3324178 - 11/05/04 01:13 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

mushmaster said:
if there is evidence to support greg's claims, he sure doesn't provide any.




Especially annoying when the title is 'Here are the Facts'

The whole electronic voting thing bothers me. But as far as this election goes, I'm not buying theories put forth... yet.


--------------------
what's with neocons and the word 'ilk'?


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: ekomstop]
    #3324210 - 11/05/04 01:23 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)



--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Vvellum]
    #3324223 - 11/05/04 01:27 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

care to actually address palast's argument?




What point would that be?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: ricelicker]
    #3324240 - 11/05/04 01:32 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

No, he'd rather just say he's wrong and walk away..... much easier




need a tissue? I knew this would happen. Libbies tend to find excuses why they lost instead of looking at themselves. Liberals: There is no way Bush could of beat Kerry because we're right and everyone hates Bush......the lottery was fixed, that's it. Oh, and I was disenfranchised...yadda yadda yadda"...sad

It's hard to argue with BS so there's no need to so I'll just continue yelling shenanigans every time a new libbie throws out more "evidence" as to why Kerry lost. Kerry lost because he was disliked by the majority of the voters, it's quite simple.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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InvisibleVvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Evolving]
    #3324242 - 11/05/04 01:33 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

did I say otherwise?


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: ]
    #3324250 - 11/05/04 01:34 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

if there is evidence to support greg's claims, he sure doesn't provide any. 




Evidence? EVIDENCE?  We they don't need no stinkin' evidence!! :mad:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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InvisibleVvellum
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 10,920
Re: Kerry Won - Here are the Facts. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3324257 - 11/05/04 01:36 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

well, when the Democrats begin fixing elections again, I'll listen and consider the evidence with you. I wouldnt call you a crybaby or a sore loser, I'd want to get to the truth.


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