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viaggio said:
I hate you    ...sorry, the truth hurts.

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Ouch.  I care.  No, really, I do. 

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BleaK said:
"lazy" people just realize they have what they need and neednt work more.

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  I cleaned houses, 1-3 houses per day, for 13 years. It was fuckin' hard work. I did that while I went to school to be a lawyer.

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and 3 to 5 kids on top!

13 years to become a lawyer - that's a long stint at 'school'! What's that? 4 yrs at uni & 3 at law school to actually become a lawyer, and 6 years at school/college getting your grades to go to to uni before that?

How old were you at the start of all this? 12?

Or did you as an adult pull yourself off the sofa and start all over one fine day?

Did you always want to be a lawyer?

And now the backslapping commences - Aren't you the greatest!

And you'll be able to say to those 3-5 kids: 'look what I achieved with hard work!' what a role model.

In all seriousnes though - well done

I guess it depends how much one really wants something, the opportunities one has (or manages to take), the perameters of one's life and how restrictive they are, the spirit and dedication one holds for a cause, the realitive accessibility of the goal (ie - is one actually capable of achieving it? How many people dream of being something only to find out that they do not have the necessary attribute to actually achieve that).

Just calling people 'lazy fucks' who are somehow internally or externally blocked from achieving their goals seems a little narrow, uncompassionate and self-righteous. Some of those people will be trying very very hard and getting nowhere. Some will be struggling just to stay sane, let alone become the person of their dreams. Perhaps some of them have 13 years to go and a spark of inspiration that needs lighting.

Do you know a lot of people on minimum wage with practically achievable and definite goals who sit on the sofa saying it's 'too fucking hard'? 

During your 13 years in work of an equivalent level did you ever sit back on the sofa at the end of one of those days and think 'it's too fucking hard'?

I expect you must have sometimes, but then you found yourself not giving up despite the pain of struggle. Perhaps the people you speak of feel trapped in that emotional space on the sofa and search for drive within themselves.

Never say die!

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What is the difference between people who are so motivated to attain their goals, and people who will sit on the couch after working their minimum wage job saying, "It's just too fucking hard"?

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I know the kind of people you are talking about. One of them help me get my Mercedes.

The story goes like this.

The CEO of a company has 3 Mercedes, One he is looking to donate or sell. One of the VP's asks him what he wants for it and the CEO replies "Make me an offer!" The VP responds "Let me get back to you on this, I need to see how much money I have in the bank and how much I can spend."
7 days later the CEO asks the VP if he is ever going to make an offer. The VP responds "Yes, I just need a few more days." The CEO turns to look at me and asks if I would like to buy a Mercedes 450slc sports car. I respond "Sure, I would love to." He then says "Make me an offer!" I respond $150. The CEO Smiles and says "Hand me the cash and you can drive it home tonight."

It all boils down to risks. Some people take them, others avoid them.

My risk was that I knew nothing about the car before I made an offer. I just adjusted the offer to offset the risk and guarantee an ROI (Return On Investment)

Your risk was going to and paying for school to be a lawyer. You took the risk and it paid off.

The truth is that most people in this country know only what they have in front of them and never look to the future. They avoid risks and are happy to stay sure footed on solid ground.

Heck, Most people in this country are not even aware that they are in the US Militia as per USC TITLE 10, Subtitle A, Part I, Chapter 13 ? 311

All in all there is no gain with out risk.

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CJay said:

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  I cleaned houses, 1-3 houses per day, for 13 years. It was fuckin' hard work. I did that while I went to school to be a lawyer.

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and 3 to 5 kids on top!

13 years to become a lawyer - that's a long stint at 'school'! What's that? 4 yrs at uni & 3 at law school to actually become a lawyer, and 6 years at school/college getting your grades to go to to uni before that?

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Well, let's see.  Before I went to law school, and after the 4.5 years it took to get my B.A., I did almost 2 years in a paralegal program.  Law school took 5 years because I had 2 of those kids during law school.

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How old were you at the start of all this? 12?

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Nope.  I was 26.

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Or did you as an adult pull yourself off the sofa and start all over one fine day?

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Actually, I had just gotten fired from a job because I had gotten drunk while I was working a shift.    I decided I was sick of being a waitress.  Before I dropped out of high school, I had once thought I would like to be a lawyer.  So when I was fired from that job, I decided to fuck it and go to school.

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And now the backslapping commences - Aren't you the greatest!

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*curtsies*  thankyouverymuch 

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And you'll be able to say to those 3-5 kids: 'look what I achieved with hard work!' what a role model.

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Actually, none of my kids want to follow in my footsteps because they saw how hard it was and they are too lazy to do that. 

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I guess it depends how much one really wants something, the opportunities one has (or manages to take), the perameters of one's life and how restrictive they are, the spirit and dedication one holds for a cause, the realitive accessibility of the goal (ie - is one actually capable of achieving it? How many people dream of being something only to find out that they do not have the necessary attribute to actually achieve that).

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I don't believe in looking for limitations.  I believe in looking for possibilities and opportunities.  I was once a high school drop-out blacking out from drinking almost nightly and a single mother on welfare.  I think if one tries just a little bit, one can get out of a bad or bleak situation and do something.

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Just calling people 'lazy fucks' who are somehow internally or externally blocked from achieving their goals seems a little narrow, uncompassionate and self-righteous.

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There was this guy in our office recently who was a lazy fuck.  He wanted a lot of money, but he didn't want to work for it.  He was smart.  He could have gone to school himself to be a lawyer, but he told me it would take too long.  In the meantime, he's fucking with people.

What do you think is his internal or external limitation?  And how am I being narrow, uncompassionate and self-righteous?

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Some of those people will be trying very very hard and getting nowhere. Some will be struggling just to stay sane, let alone become the person of their dreams. Perhaps some of them have 13 years to go and a spark of inspiration that needs lighting.

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I realize that there are people who are stuck in the reality of their minds, and they can get lost, and that it's not because they aren't trying.  Some people just don't know how to try.  But you take that person and say, Hey, go get some counseling, get yourself figured out and then you can probably figure out what you want to do with your life.  They say, no, it's too hard, I don't want to get counseling, etc., etc.

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Do you know a lot of people on minimum wage with practically achievable and definite goals who sit on the sofa saying it's 'too fucking hard'? 

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Actually, yes.

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During your 13 years in work of an equivalent level did you ever sit back on the sofa at the end of one of those days and think 'it's too fucking hard'?

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Yes, but I was already in debt with student loans and if I quit school, I would have had to start paying my student loans back and I wouldn't have had the income of a lawyer. 

I would recommend taking out a student loan to keep one motivated.

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I expect you must have sometimes, but then you found yourself not giving up despite the pain of struggle. Perhaps the people you speak of feel trapped in that emotional space on the sofa and search for drive within themselves.

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I agree with you.  If I hadn't gotten some counseling, I would probably be stuck on a sofa, saying life is rough and unfair and all that.  I guess I look at what I've been through and don't have too much empathy or sympathy for intelligent people who don't get counseling and move on with their lives. 

Wait, let me check my back pocket.  Nope, no empathy there, either.

See, on the one hand, I have empathy for people who are stuck, because I was once stuck, but I guess I have no empathy because they could get unstuck, but they refuse. 

Oh, and before you truly condemn me, keep in mind I charge very low fees to poor people.  These are the people who deserve empathy.  The people who are poor but struggle and work very hard and don't see how they could go to school and get ahead. They are so stuck in working two jobs in order to survive and maybe put their kids in college some day so that those kids will have better lives.  I would never condemn them.

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Cyber said:

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What is the difference between people who are so motivated to attain their goals, and people who will sit on the couch after working their minimum wage job saying, "It's just too fucking hard"?

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I know the kind of people you are talking about. One of them help me get my Mercedes.

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Okay, after several reads, I get it now.    The guy who was slow in coming up with an offer helped you get the Mercedes. 

Great story. 

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It all boils down to risks. Some people take them, others avoid them.

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That's a good point.  It isn't just laziness, it can also be fear of taking a risk.  I think also some people have fear of failure. 

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The truth is that most people in this country know only what they have in front of them and never look to the future. They avoid risks and are happy to stay sure footed on solid ground.

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Yes, true.  I know a lawyer who took the Bar at the same time I did.  He would love to be in his own practice, but he wants the security of a paycheck.  I've slept on my office floor rather than have to work for someone. 

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Heck, Most people in this country are not even aware that they are in the US Militia as per USC TITLE 10, Subtitle A, Part I, Chapter 13 ? 311

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Um, I'm feeling a little lazy today, myself.    What's that???

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Okay, after several reads, I get it now.  The guy who was slow in coming up with an offer helped you get the Mercedes.

Great story.

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Um, I'm feeling a little lazy today, myself.  What's that???

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? 311. Militia: composition and classes

(a) The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32, under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, citizens of the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are members of the National Guard.
(b) The classes of the militia are?
(1) the organized militia, which consists of the National Guard and the Naval Militia; and
(2) the unorganized militia, which consists of the members of the militia who are not members of the National Guard or the Naval Militia.

What area of law do you practice?

I have no law background, but I have a photographic memory and have read the USC, The Local Penal Code, Blackmans Law Dictionary, and have access to Westlaw, And I did stay at a holiday inn! 

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Fucknuckle said:
Well the point of all this is simple. People all are very much able to become so much more than they are. As kids we can see anything as being real. Then as we grow into punks we start to believe that we suck. TV tells us this. It nothing more than a lie we believe. We to fat, were to lazy, were to ugly and only rich people count etc. etc. blah blah........

The difference between people who strive and peole who do not, is a big fat LIE that they believe. Anyone can over come this. ANYONE. I could give you 20 examples.

Every person in the world really does have motivation if you,they can find it. But, it does not help to call them Fat Lazy Fucks

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Cyber said:
Just remember "Carpe Diem"

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What area of law do you practice?

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I have no law background, but I have a photographic memory and have read the USC, The Local Penal Code, Blackmans Law Dictionary, and have access to Westlaw, And I did stay at a holiday inn! 

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A little light bed-time reading? 

What does the holiday inn have to do with law???

Having a photographic memory is very helpful.