the_chosen_one said:

Sorry. I got so tied up staring at Nichrome's boobs I kind of forgot to get back to you on an observation from yours. Boobs can do that lol. In your case it looks like there's a contending gray mold which is likely causing some issues. Otherwise it looks like a fairly normal pin set for today's HVC. They might just need more time or there are some toxins being produced by the mold. HVC is rarely defeated by molds. Tends to just grow right around it. Often encasing it in vitro or deeper in substrates. Molds exposed to air are a little different but still won't always stop it.
The question with yours for me would be.. is it entwined into the culture or was it picked up at spawning. Before tossing and restarting everything I would test the culture on a smaller scale. I take most of my agar to LC so for me it's easier to test in a PF jar.

---

No problem man, I get caught up staring at boobs myself from time to time

I was not considering there to be mold intertwined as I chucked it up to semperviva mycel just being a bit weird. Just to be clear it's the grayer spots in between the white pinset you're referring to?

(Repost of photo from my previous thread)


I have several cultures from two germ plates going, but I streaked those plates when I didnt have one successful grow yet. So its very possible that I introduced some mold in the plates. I had some trouble with bacteria (i think) so it's also been sent through a cabin as well.

And its nice to know that semps will not care about mold in-vitro, to me the plates and jars looked fine, but it can show up when exposed to air.

Here is the plate for the culture above and it's in one of the jars, but I cant remember what




Here is the same culture from an earlier trial in January


Would you say its the same situation with some gray mold intertwined? To me it sure do look like it. And I should expect the mycelium to be more uniformly like the whiter bits right?

Here is a different culture from a different germ plate but same print:


I still see the same kind of gray/white spotted pattern as the other culture.

My next step will be to do a bunch of AIO jars inoculated with agar as I havent done any LC yet. I got a bunch of half pint jars coming in the near future.

I have also got some new plates from the print going and I will get a diverse sample from there and grow it out.

Thanks for the pointers and sorry for the wall of text and 1000 questions these guys have given me so much trouble, but its been a blast so far.

the_chosen_one said:

On the bright side, it's pretty easy to defeat in a grow. In most cases a good

with water will do the trick. Sometimes it may require more than one treatment and as long as FAE and evaporation are good it won't hurt your mushrooms..

---

How much of a spray are we talking about? enough to see beading like proper surface condition or all the way down to almost pooling?

And I confess, your post made me go down a rabbithole in my semp journal and DMs and I may have found a couple of contam vectors. Firstly I was still using a flexible SAB at the time I streaked the plates. And secondly I ran my PC wrongly for an agar batch where I at most steam sterilized it instead of at 15PSI .

I hurridly transferred from these plates to new ones when I found out but it didnt look good


I think I will focus my attention on the new plates i've streaked and hopefully it works this time
Thanks for the help TCO, I really appreciate it



edit: I also have a scope that goes up to 400X so i'm gonna try and take some transfers onto slides and see what I can find.

edit 2:
I checked it with my cheap scope and its a bit hard to see with all the diffraction going on, but I think it looks to be two different sizes of hyphae in there

DiscoDave said:

How much of a spray are we talking about? enough to see beading like proper surface condition or all the way down to almost pooling?

And I confess, your post made me go down a rabbithole in my semp journal and DMs and I may have found a couple of contam vectors. Firstly I was still using a flexible SAB at the time I streaked the plates. And secondly I ran my PC wrongly for an agar batch where I at most steam sterilized it instead of at 15PSI .

I hurridly transferred from these plates to new ones when I found out but it didnt look good


I think I will focus my attention on the new plates i've streaked and hopefully it works this time
Thanks for the help TCO, I really appreciate it



edit: I also have a scope that goes up to 400X so i'm gonna try and take some transfers onto slides and see what I can find.

---

Go ahead and get the sprayer right down on the mold spots and pool it up. You'll want to focus there for the most part. It should literally dissolve with a few squirts. Be precise and somewhat gentle on the trigger, but everything in section zapotecorum can take heavy misting as long as evaporation is good and it's not pooled too long. Mostly focus on the mold though.
Your current evaporation looks pretty good so don't over react and hit them with a lot of air. Depending on your set up it only takes a lid open for a few seconds a couple times a day to reduce RH build up.

Are you casing them? Typically, I only get some light surface stuff on my casing when dealing with cobweb but that looks like it's deeper entrenched to me. Could be wrong though. Everything I case with including coir is pasteurized now a days and I have little trouble with surface stuff. People might say pasteurizing coir is a waste of time.. but those people don't live in my house and are typically dealing with much faster and aggressive cubensis. Exotics tend to be a little slower so it changes up the game a little.
Another thing I've found helpful with slower species and bothersome casings is misting with Azospirillum treated water occasionally. It creates a more vigorous mycelium which tends to overlay. With cubensis overlay is not really desirable but many exotics perform well with it and it forms a protective barrier which tends to stay mold free for a very long time. 
 

Churpee Choozle said:

You have spoken about your suspicion before. My subtrops do this too. Also after a cabin, and not every batch and on every flush. Only ever seen verticillium on one pan and maybe a handful of subaers.

I've also had 'regular' vert on a shoebox of subtrops and they flaked, split and aborted.

---

Yeah bro, it's been bugging me for a while now. Just with the Coyopolan. Otherwise I've never really seen anything like it short of what people write off as random mutations. Now it could be something locked deep in the genetic dice roll, but random mutation is more the genetics adapting and looking for ways to improve. Kind of a pre-evolutionary step. Detrimental deformities or mutations are typically caused by something else. Usually nothing good. Not saying it can't be otherwise, but my thinking leans that way most of the time.
Vert does tend to have sort of universal symptoms but like you observed it normally ends in ugly lol. This Coyopolan culture just keeps truckin'.
Eventually I'll get around to germinating the print Pheno sent me and that will likely be the end of that. For now I'm just using up the rest of the LC.

the_chosen_one said:

Go ahead and get the sprayer right down on the mold spots and pool it up. You'll want to focus there for the most part. It should literally dissolve with a few squirts. Be precise and somewhat gentle on the trigger, but everything in section zapotecorum can take heavy misting as long as evaporation is good and it's not pooled too long. Mostly focus on the mold though.
Your current evaporation looks pretty good so don't over react and hit them with a lot of air. Depending on your set up it only takes a lid open for a few seconds a couple times a day to reduce RH build up.

Are you casing them? Typically, I only get some light surface stuff on my casing when dealing with cobweb but that looks like it's deeper entrenched to me. Could be wrong though. Everything I case with including coir is pasteurized now a days and I have little trouble with surface stuff. People might say pasteurizing coir is a waste of time.. but those people don't live in my house and are typically dealing with much faster and aggressive cubensis. Exotics tend to be a little slower so it changes up the game a little.
Another thing I've found helpful with slower species and bothersome casings is misting with Azospirillum treated water occasionally. It creates a more vigorous mycelium which tends to overlay. With cubensis overlay is not really desirable but many exotics perform well with it and it forms a protective barrier which tends to stay mold free for a very long time. 
 

---

I think you nailed it, when I sprayed the surface heavily, some areas melted away cleanly, but others went fainter but still remained. I have cased my tubs, but I was planning on leaving the one we have talked about open for a few more days just to see what would happen. The coir sub of that same tub was also pasteurized as it triched out on me so many times that I thought it wouldnt hurt.

Do you think the tub is salvageable with a couple of rounds of spraying with water, then move onto the H202 spray if it still remains? My guess is that the mold is deep down in the sub and even the grains.

My guess is that the mold is intertwined on my agar plates since I had almost the same looking sub back in january before they went through a round of cabin sequestering. And I have been close to ordering Azospirillum a few times, probably because of one of your posts, but i'll take the leap and do it now

the_chosen_one said:

Yup. There's your culprit.


Lower right where the wadding is. It's kind of scattered throughout, but mostly condensed there.

---

Thanks for confirming it, gives me a good idea what to look for. I will take a transfer from my older plates to check if its enmeshed like the sample above (from the moldy areas of the shoebox).

Thank you so much for the help, these buggers have been throwing me for a loop for a few months and it's so nice to identify a problem

angamshroom said:

They are striking in their resistance to infection. The trich overcame the rotting fruit, but cannot jump on the neighbors. I specifically waited for the infection to develop in order to verify the pasteurized substrate and the resistance of this fungus. Amazing!


It's been 30 days since the start of the second wave of pining, I'll hold out for another week and I hope they will hold out.

---

Attaboy.

DiscoDave said:

I think you nailed it, when I sprayed the surface heavily, some areas melted away cleanly, but others went fainter but still remained. I have cased my tubs, but I was planning on leaving the one we have talked about open for a few more days just to see what would happen. The coir sub of that same tub was also pasteurized as it triched out on me so many times that I thought it wouldnt hurt.

Do you think the tub is salvageable with a couple of rounds of spraying with water, then move onto the H202 spray if it still remains? My guess is that the mold is deep down in the sub and even the grains.

My guess is that the mold is intertwined on my agar plates since I had almost the same looking sub back in january before they went through a round of cabin sequestering. And I have been close to ordering Azospirillum a few times, probably because of one of your posts, but i'll take the leap and do it now

---

I think it can be salvaged to an extent with some patience. Cobweb isn't really that tough. The question is how toxified the sub has become with all the chemical conversations going on in there.. and it is parasitic. But if you have the time and resources it's worth the learning experience. I'd step up the the H2O2 blend if it remains. It may have gone a little too far but you have little to loose at this point and experience is simply shorthand for mistakes made.

Yeah Treefrog is also experimenting with it. You'll notice overlay on her grows as well. Here's what we've been using..

The best price has been direct through them. I paid $10 US when I got mine though it might be a little more now with WW3 in progress.

*edit*
If that's not available where you are you want azospirillum brasilense specifically. Regardless of brand.

the_chosen_one said:

I think it can be salvaged to an extent with some patience. Cobweb isn't really that tough. The question is how toxified the sub has become with all the chemical conversations going on in there.. and it is parasitic. But if you have the time and resources it's worth the learning experience. I'd step up the the H2O2 blend if it remains. It may have gone a little too far but you have little to loose at this point and experience is simply shorthand for mistakes made.

Yeah Treefrog is also experimenting with it. You'll notice overlay on her grows as well. Here's what we've been using..

The best price has been direct through them. I paid $10 US when I got mine though it might be a little more now with WW3 in progress.

*edit*
If that's not available where you are you want azospirillum brasilense specifically. Regardless of brand.

---

A quick look at the plates confirmed it, I got mold entwined at that step. Heres to hoping im a better grower now than in November and my new plates comes out fine. Now the fun begins where I can go full fuck around and find out on my tubs with good conscience .

I have only found one local source of azospirillum brasilense and it goes for $50 USD for 170g which is why I have hesitated. How long does a bag of your size last roughly?

Thanks yet again, figuring this out is very cathartic after months of failure

angamshroom said:

They are striking in their resistance to infection. The trich overcame the rotting fruit, but cannot jump on the neighbors. I specifically waited for the infection to develop in order to verify the pasteurized substrate and the resistance of this fungus. Amazing!


It's been 30 days since the start of the second wave of pining, I'll hold out for another week and I hope they will hold out.

---

Oh lord those look so good... Man I'd harvest these now or within a few days, they're at the stage where mine have been scary potent but if they can go for another week without losing more mushies to trich or rot there's no reason to not wait I myself usually harvest when they're almost black and a couple of shrooms have died but at this point I start becoming paranoid over getting toxins in the mushrooms.

About the resilience: I'm equally impressed with these. I thought Ochras were hardy but my first semp tray from November is still alive even though it got trich at the end of the first flush. I cut it out to test it and it's still producing, I'm keeping it around to see how long she'll live.

Seriously though I couldn't own that tub without smashing my face into it. It looks fucking delicious.