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Re: Alien Communication [Re: Swami]
    #2797718 -

Tried? You know I'm not dodging anything, swami. Or if I have, you have "inconspicuously dodged" my point about physics serving as a base :wink:

Yes, differences is sex and culture/society will be a major stumbling point between communication with an alien species...but it still does not make communication impossible!

What do you think about physics as a base for communication, swami?


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: Alien Communication [Re: trendal]
    #2797750 -

Yes, differences is sex and culture/society will be a major stumbling point between communication with an alien species...
That is just one of innumerable blocks. Add different environment, physiology, history, and basic outlook on life.

What do you think about physics as a base for communication, swami?
Technology is not a requirement for an intelligent species nor do I see it as any sort of aid. Did the white man use physics as a common denominator when first contacting tribes in Borneo?

If they do have technology, the material basis will also be alien. To think they might have metal spaceships or computers or use electricity is once again applying human-think.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Alien Communication [Re: Swami]
    #2797763 -

biological technology


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Re: Alien Communication [Re: Swami]
    #2797771 -

Im going to ask this straight forward. Why do you care whether we can communicate with aliens or not?

Do you think it is a waste for peoples resources to try and think about life "where else"... Given the fact that you have presented these rather "obvious" circumstances given the gaps between "humans" and "aliens" from outer space?

If that was your aim, than i could see why you would wish to investigate the issue.

I mean i think it is in the very range of possibility, but given the likelihood of such an occurance... i can tell you that i wouldnt be putting all my energy into researching such a topic.

But say you had a life changing experience... i mean something truely heart felt for you... i dont see why it wouldnt be worth it. With 6 billion people and counting, i dont know how much one would have to lose by "looking into it".


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What?

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Re: Alien Communication [Re: Shroomism]
    #2797773 -

physiological methodology


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and you know it like a poet, like....babydoll

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Re: Alien Communication [Re: Swami]
    #2797847 -

Quote:
When you take an alien out to a bar for a beer and say "Check out that hottie!" and he snips her arm off with his mandibles and starts munching. You gasp in horror and he looks at you vacantly with his third-eye. A series of wing rubbings and pincer clicks causes a message to appear on your inter-species translator, "Didn't you say that you like eating women?"



So we would be having meaningful communication... it would just be a little fucked up!


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Always Smi2le

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Re: Alien Communication [Re: Swami]
    #2797967 -

About the whole comparison of communication between humans and 'less-evolved' animals, I would be more then happy to personally relate several instances where pets undergoing moderately painful and extremely scary and unpleasent producures at the vet stayed stock still, and behaved remarkably better than some children I've seen, mostly just whimpering pathetically. Because I and other family members are comforting it, the animal is able to draw on that for moral support in co-operating in doing something that, to the best of it's knowledge is decidely against its survival interests (i.e. something that hurts it, causing it pain, discomfort...) If we left the dog alone with the vet, it might freak out and bite him. Because of reasurring emotional communication occuring between you and the animal, the animal doesn't even flinch when getting a shot without anaesthetic. One numerous occaisons, I could attest to this occuring, I'm afraid you are plainly dead-wrong. Keep pretending otherwise, though-- you're posturing is always good for a chuckle.

As for that "...Ants have evolved (albeit quite slowly) for several hundred million years. Guess we must be close to a communication break-through any time soon." (Swami) comment, uh... well. First off, ants evolved rather quickly to their current basic form, along with termites (and hence anteaters and aardvarks have been around for most of the time there've been mammals). Stuff like the leaf-cutting fungus-farming social insect thing might be a more recent development, though. The reason we haven't gotten an ant's perspective on the world yet is because we don't really interact with them in any meaningful way at all. Except maybe a little bit to eat or step on.

And we would have even less common ground with an alien, presumably? After all, it would be an ALIEN, meaning something radically different. Instead of just not being a vertebrate (as with ants), the alien probably wouldn't even share the same basic chemistry. I don't see why an alien would necessarily have DNA, in fact, if humanity came across another carbon-based organism that used adenine, tyrosine, guanine and ringo to code for roughly the same or similar enzymes and proteins and hey, maybe even similar macroscopic structures like on Star Trek I'd say that'd be Grand Bull Moose Award Winning Freaky Coincidence! No, seems more likely we'd have nothing in common with them at all and not be able to communicate. But even so, there's still always the possibility of Checkov stepping out of some transdimensional portal in SanFran tomorrow and wandering around asking people about the location of their nuclear ouwessles. Just cause something's not likely (or even the least bit likely) doesn't mean it's not possible, though, Swamster.


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Don't worry, I'm wrong.

Edited by Panoramix (06/16/04 04:26 AM)

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Re: Alien Communication [Re: Swami]
    #2800108 -

'If they do have technology, the material basis will also be alien. To think they might have metal spaceships or computers or use electricity is once again applying human-think.'

digest some of your environment...inspect your DNA

Do what you think you can - don't apply human-think.
Forget reason, biology, chemistry, physics, politics, material, immaterial

One space you are forgetting is

the mind

Enter that space, find the'alien' - Enter the 'space' that cannot be found in space

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Re: Alien Communication [Re: Swami]
    #2800369 -

Your putting the cart before the horse. While there could be alien civilizations scattered through the galaxy they would be so far from each other that the distances cannot be traversed. Civilizations old enough to have developed interstellar travel would be so far into the center that it is unlikely they would worry with the outer rim. Stars in the center are close, sometimes less than 1 light year, and easier to travel between.

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