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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: CleverName]
    #905200 -

I second that...

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: dee_N_ae]
    #905222 -

lets look at this logically for one minute, if mushrooms spores did come from outer space, wouldn't they burn up entering our atmosphere and therefore never reach the earth?

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: chodamunky]
    #905253 -

I actually thought the exact same thing today at work.
Logically, maybe they could be lodged in a cavern inside a meteorite large enough not to burn up and impact the Earth's surface?  This is a tough one... :smirk:
 

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: CleverName]
    #905271 -

I personally really do think they are not of this world as if you look at their structure they are lacking elements for one they have no chlorophyll and must get all of their nutrients entirely from their enviroment. Maybe in their original world they were provided with chlorophyll from a different source and they grew in massive fields like grass to think we are alone in this universe I think is a big mistake perhaps there aren't other highly intellegent oraganizms out there but there is no doubt that in other planets there is life I mean we have found like in desolate places and this is only a tiny piece of the universe so there is no way there can't be more life elsewhere......

Perhaps they (meaning mushrooms) did appear here so long ago and the reason we have so many different variations was not because alot of spores were introduced here but the fact that they all had to adapt and evolve so to speak to their enviroments which is why all the different varieties grow in such strange places and require odd conditions it was where they ended up and what they adapted to.

Another thing is if you observe the rooting structure of mushrooms it is alot different then that of many others it's beginnings and such the mycelium to me is far different from any other rooting structure to date. sorry my head is fuzzing out on me and this is an alien post haha not a beginning of mushies haha

I can't remember the link I did read about the appearance of spores through earth collisions though I will post it later tonight if nobody else posts one.

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: BleedingSickness]
    #905282 -

Quote:

sorry my head is fuzzing out on me and this is an alien post haha not a beginning of mushies haha


..yes, funny how the discussion shifted topics so smoothely....from aliens to mushrooms.............:ooo: :ooo: :shocked:      :tongue: :grin: 

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: dee_N_ae]
    #905569 -

I actually thought the exact same thing today at work.
Logically, maybe they could be lodged in a cavern inside a meteorite large enough not to burn up and impact the Earth's surface? This is a tough one... 

at first read your suggestion is very possible, but now that I think about it a little more, a few questions arise:

1. How could little spores be physically lodged far enough inside a superhard meteorite so that they would be protected from the environment of space? Possible reply---> "they got inside some deep cracks large enough not to burn up." read on ....

2. How would they do this? If you can answer that...do read on :laugh: if the little guys got lodged inside a meteorite, through the cracks, even at a considerable depth, how would they protect themselves from burning up or at least getting damaged from the heat when the meteorite enters the atmosphere? Meteorites are made up of hard metals, which are relatively good heat conductors (of course ice, if any, would melt almost instantly on impacting the atmosphere). So the point here is, the whole meteorite would be a hot glowing red ball by the time in penetrated through most of the atmosphere, and the poor little dudes would be burnt to crisp...
Possible reply....."maybe they were super spores resistant to heat, I mean they already survived insanely cold sub-zero temperatures of space too." If you still think there is a chance....

3. Now the impact of the meteorite. Since most or a good portion of the meteorite has already broken up in the atmosphere, I ask you how in the heck they would survive the actual impact? The energy released in meteorite impacts is phenomenal, depending on size of course. I just don't see how "the little spores that could" can possibly survive the energy release equal to millions of nuclear bombs exploding at the same time.

I personally think there is no way mushroom spores could of came from outside planet earth riding in a meteorite. If you have another theory, I'd love to hear it. unless of course aliens brought them here physically but that's another post...   

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: chodamunky]
    #905685 -

Not alot is known about the climate of the old earth it is often thought that it was much warmer then it is now and if you use the old theories of how the earth came to be with many collisions of meteors and astroids there is evidence that an event like the spores reaching earth is possible. The Earth didn't have water at first it got here when large astroids crashed into us and the ice upon them melted this left the water here with us.

What I suggest is that the meteors that fell here and gave birth to mushies were carbonaceous chondrites which are rare meteorites that contain alot of carbons and organic material these objects that make it here containing organic materials could have easily contained the spores needed to start the fungi because just one mature mushroom can drop nearly 16 million spores have you ever stopped to wonder why so many perhaps it is because survival was so hard and thus created this adaptation or maybe there are other reasonings behind this. And yes these meteorites do fall even today so they weren't just something that happened long ago, another thing I just am adding this in if you look at the reproduction system of fungi aka mushrooms you see a difference from many others one most species have evolved into mail and femail reproductions this is thought to have happened long ago when with all the thing crashing into earth the stress put upon bacteria created two sexes much in the same way that too much stress put upon a marijuana plant can turn your female into a male. So with the system fungi have them appearing on one of these lil meteors isn't so far fetched because their species was never totally forced into having different sexes...

And if your like meteorites containing organic material ya right here's an article about an existing cabonaceous chondrite it happened to land in a very cold region and the guy who retrieved it was equally as smart it containes organic material it didn't burn up inside our atmosphere. Ohh yeah the article is down lower in this post hahaha.....

Also it is possible for there to ice imbedded near the core of an astroid if large enough astroids can even contain their own caverns these can alternatively be large holes inside filled with ice an object this size wouldn't necessarily all burn up on entry most meteors are composed of metals and very good conductors,

That doesn't however mean all of them are. Here's the article about the one that made it...and was picked up and stored properly Organics In Meteorite now if this one was found containing these elements it is highly likely that many others like it existed long ago the only reason this one was found in it's condition was because of location it happened to end up in a very convenient location that preserved it well you know just like they don't find many well preserved cave men and things like that.

There are really only two places on this earth that preserve geological information extremely well and they are Africa and Australia, much has been found in these regions alot of the other places on earth erase much information stored in rocks and sources of info. hahaha.......there you go another theory...... now come on hahaa 16 million spores in just ONE MUSHROOM at least a few of them gotta be able to continue and thinking about it mushrooms can grow and reseed from an original spore at least once this will give life to many others in the same region and blam mushie invasion.......




Edited by BleedingSickness (09/24/02 11:18 PM)

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: chodamunky]
    #905690 -

LOL
super spores...ok, ok I should have thought it out a little more before I posted, I made it up on the spot to reply to your post before it.  :crazy:

I couldn't find any information on mushroom spores and specifically and I'm too tired to dig further, but I think you're right, it's just too implausible. 

********
edit:  ...and then I read BleedingSickness's post....
Will we ever really know EXACTLY how they came to be on earth?  I doubt it... not unless the mushrooms decide to tell us themselves.  :grin:

Edited by dee_N_ae (09/24/02 09:39 PM)

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: chodamunky]
    #905783 -

this link isn't proof but it relates.
also i dont know if it was 5000 years 50000 or whatever i cant remember. im probably way off of what i read.
http://www.anomalist.com/gonzoscience/pansperm.html



--------------------
ash dingy donker mo gollyhopper patty popiton rockstop bueno mayo riggedy jig bobber johnathan pattywhacker gogboob t-shirt monkey.

There is such emotion in the distortion.

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: chodamunky]
    #905878 -

Yes, let's look at the major premise of this thread logically as well.

my proof is that they haven't been proven to exist.

Argumentum ad ignorantiam: If proposition A is not known to be true, it is false.

This is a logical fallacy akin to proving a negative. Quite simply, it cannot be done. Obviously the fact that something is not known to exist can only lead to a speculation that it does not exist. That speculation can never replace empirical evidence but it can lead one towards an assumption that can seem rational. Unicorns do not exist but the fact they we have never seen one cannot be admitted in the court of logic as proof they do not exist. It is merely evidence to be weighed and given its due consideration. In the case of aliens if they exist in another dimension we may never have empirical evidence like we do for other things. I would not rush this. I am skeptical of their existence and I am skeptical of their non-existence as well. I have exerienced events through my senses in an unaltered state that I cannot adequately explain via normal or common terms. Therefore the question is unresolved in my mind.

Cheers,

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: ]
    #906521 -

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

The problem with people believing that "aliens don't exist" is that they have a vested interest in preserving that belief. They will not accept the mounting evidence of the existence of aliens.

As for those that do believe in aliens, you can never present to them evidence that aliens DON'T exist. So which is the more logical belief?

Logical thinkers would say that they DON'T KNOW if aliens exist or not. But anyone who claims that "aliens don't exist" has to have a lot of faith.

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: infidelGOD]
    #906547 -

The problem with people believing that "aliens don't exist" is that they have a vested interest in preserving that belief. They will not accept the mounting evidence of the existence of aliens.

From the perspective of one man: this is totally fallacious. I have looked high and low for 30 years (not just an armchair researcher) wanting to find something and coming up with nothing convincing. I do not believe "they" have visited for the SIMPLE non-psychobabbular explanation of no hard evidence. The soft evidence is all anecdotal and many other prosaic explanations will suffice.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

Edited by Swami (09/25/02 08:09 AM)

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: Swami]
    #906551 -

It's easy to deny the existance of the sun when you live underground


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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: Shroomism]
    #906560 -

Your cutesy rejoinded is fairly meaningless here. Do you agree that Infidel knows EXACTLY why I don't believe?

This is more evidence against telepathic ability.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: infidelGOD]
    #906826 -

Indubitably IG, indubitably.

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: Swami]
    #906844 -

I do not know why you bring up investigating armchairs. That is a complete non sequitur and you know it. I think you are trying to throw us off the scent.

I suppose it has to do with what can be considered 'hard evidence'. If you are speaking of empirical evidence I must admit the paucity thereof.

Tell me plainly Swami, if you never felt the pull of the Matrix they why would you have searched?

In due time I will produce what I consider to be, while not compelling, evidence (surely not anecdotal), certainly thought provoking related ideas that can lead to certain formerly known conclusions ipso facti verbatim post hoc ergo propter hoc and other sundry Latin phrases to impress the dull-witted minds though none posting appear to be so.

Cheers,

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: ]
    #907098 -

Another good reply that does not respond directly to my point. IG said all skeptics doubt because they do NOT want to believe. My last post was not about the existence or non-existence of aliens, but about the fact that this statement is frequently tossed out by believers as factual, when it is quite erroneous.

If I said all believers are idiots, people would be all over me (and rightly so!). Why is this tower of dust allowed to stand?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

Edited by Swami (09/25/02 11:53 AM)

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: Swami]
    #907111 -

It all has to do with two words: What if?

It is my conviction that the line between is and if is often blurred (yes blurred, not blury).


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: Swami]
    #907140 -

IG said all skeptics doubt because they do NOT want to believe

As I said "Logical thinkers would say that they DON'T KNOW if aliens exist or not". If you belong in this catagory, you are a DOUBTING SKEPTIC and that's fine by me. But as soon as you say "aliens don't exist", you are advocating an undefendable position - kind of .... irrational don't you think?

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Re: aliens don't exist, I have proof [Re: infidelGOD]
    #907146 -

I was responding to this incongrous statement:

aliens don't exist, I have proof

with a bit of LOGIC:

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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