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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > The Psychedelic Experience
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    #26127957 -

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Edited by turkydust (07/26/20 03:22 AM)

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: turkydust]
    #26127965 -

You can say whatever you want, this kind of person won't change their mind. It's really not worth explaining to someone who will never do them. Just makes you look like a "druggie."


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A cautious young fellow named Lodge / Had seat belts installed in his Dodge. / When his date was strapped in / He committed a sin / Without even leaving the garage. That's clever, isn't it?-A boy and his dog

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: bloodsheen]
    #26127993 -

I like to ask people, when they say these sorts of things, if they drink. Coffee? Alcohol? Water?

IMO, a drug is a chemical that causes a change within a body.

Water rehydrates me, causing change. To me, water is a drug, though a mild one, it has an LD50 like most things.


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The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF

This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited,  but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders

https://www.icandecide.org/

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: HamHead]
    #26128000 -

I'd go down the whole sacred medicine line of thought which I actually do believe. Show common ground with them in your agreement that synthetic drugs like cocaine heroin whatever are dangerous but make the distinction that these plants are different entirely in that they have existed in nature forever and been consumed by humans long before laws even existed and probably shaped our evolution. Point to current research and benefits of psyilocybin n dmt.

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: thisbliss]
    #26128006 -

Oh and the endocannabinoid system - I don't know why this isn't case closed when it comes to cannabis use. We evolved to partake of this plant - it is good for us.

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: HamHead] * 1
    #26128008 -

Lol I hear ya. But still I wouldn't expect much in the way of changing minds if you start comparing lsd to water and coffee to crack. Honestly I don't present my true self to these types of people. I put on the ear to ear smile and say yes mama/sir and start the small talk.  If it's a close family member or freind that just doesn't understand talk them into tripping with you, cause words will never bridge this world with that one. Only experience can do that. If they want nothing to do with tripping. Put on that smile and save the deep conversation for another person.

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: Bph]
    #26128049 -

:slowreaction:

LSD, water. . .

That's a mind changing combo right there.

And fuck, it only takes a couple hundred micrograms.

Sit someone down and have them drink a few cups of some good quality light roast coffee. Sure, it's hardly comparable to crack, but it's hard to deny it's not a "drug". You could even do this as an example during these explanations, get someone high as fuck on caffeine and ask how they feel under that influence.

Or, if arguing for safety, hand soneone a dry pound of psilocybin mushrooms and a bottle of Tylenol and say, you can eat all of one and live, all of the other and die.


--------------------
The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF

This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited,  but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders

https://www.icandecide.org/

Edited by HamHead (08/09/19 06:15 AM)

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: HamHead]
    #26128075 -

I like where your head is at. Maybe Im getting old and jaded but i don't see people  changing their minds from rational debate. I believe the more you argue your point with a non drug user the less they listen. The over the counter pill argument won't work cause people think you can go on a permenant bad trip. Everyone knows you can't OD and die. They think you will walk off a roof or just go crazy. 50 years of propaganda and brain washing will do that. The best way I see to change a mind is to dose them. (willingly of course) but talking them into it will be a feat unless they are already on the fence about it.

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: Bph]
    #26128343 -

When it comes to drugs we are all a bit evangelical. Whether you are for drugs, certain drugs or no drugs.

  Don't touch my weed. Liberals...

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: turkydust]
    #26128622 -

It's hard to say what will change their minds. Some people are swayed by information and logical arguments. Some are impossible to sway. But a much more interesting category that this might fall into is that some people have just never been offered any.

So you might consider first trying to persuade them with evidence, history, and calm rational argument, and then perhaps offer them a joint.

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: nooneman]
    #26128638 -

The effect of psyxchedelics:


Everything becomes enhanced because you become enhanced. Sensory input, mood, your inner life, it all enhances. If you take more everything gets enhanced to such an extent it bears little resemblance to the external and internal realitoies you know. At a higher dose still, even the structure of your identity comes apart. The journey towards it is the most frightening thing in the world, but returning from it, the entire world and your role in it will make more sense. Inbetween is the Universe, without a You to observe it or interact with it.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

:nyan: LGBT - Love God Before Tradition :nyan:

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: Asante]
    #26128676 -

You aren't helping Asante. We are trying to sound less extreme not more


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A cautious young fellow named Lodge / Had seat belts installed in his Dodge. / When his date was strapped in / He committed a sin / Without even leaving the garage. That's clever, isn't it?-A boy and his dog

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: bloodsheen] * 1
    #26128756 -

At the risk of falling into in-group out-group thinking, I will say that I never try explaining psychedelics to a “layperson” because they simply won’t understand unless they’ve had the experience. The experience itself is unique to the individual with a few common themes and phenomena possibly universal to “the classic” psychedelic experience.

If someone is ignorant, lazy and lumpen enough to put psychedelics in the same category as heroin or crack, they’re likely temperamentally inclined to avoid or misunderstand the psychedelic experience, anyway. Things bewildering to the wise and humble are lost on the foolish and threatening to the prouder among us: Those with the most to lose.

We believe what we believe. This colors our reality, opinions, and views of others and their motivations. We’re all three-pound belief-engines on two legs. There is no changing anyone’s mind unless they are ready to change their own. The Gods of hyperspace could never pay me enough to be an evangelist, nor do I think they’d want me to be.


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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: CountHTML]
    #26128782 -

I remember someone's tagline signature thingy on here years ago when I first visited.

It said something like - we take these things to lose our sense of self, cos when we lose our self we get an unobscured view of the universe as it really is

Always stuck with me that and kinda reminds me of the Alan Watts quote that 'when you go out of your mind you come to your senses' which I always thought sounded like the psychedelic experience ie. You're inducing a form of psychosis and by the end of it you rediscover the divine within matter.

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: thisbliss]
    #26128790 -

Ew. Alan Watts. I think he was a bullshitter con-man of the grandest proportions. His 'philosophy' is little more then obvious or meaningless things said in a smart sounding manner and judgemental thoughts about shit he knew nothing about


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A cautious young fellow named Lodge / Had seat belts installed in his Dodge. / When his date was strapped in / He committed a sin / Without even leaving the garage. That's clever, isn't it?-A boy and his dog

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: bloodsheen] * 1
    #26128798 -

Lol I knew he had a side to him that he kinda didn't practice what he preached being an alcoholic burnout but in a way he did, cos his whole attitude was fuck it! And any 'teacher' in this stuff is a bull shitter anyway cos this stuff is to be experienced not rationalised.

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: thisbliss]
    #26128803 -

thisbliss said:
Lol I knew he had a side to him that he kinda didn't practice what he preached being an alcoholic burnout but in a way he did, cos his whole attitude was fuck it! And any 'teacher' in this stuff is a bull shitter anyway cos this stuff is to be experienced not rationalised.


I would say there are no masters but there are teachers. Many of us here are teachers. Even if the experiences are unique to the individual, there are objectively good and bad ways to go about it. And some people start to believe every single thing their trips say is gospel, or they do it so often they lose sight of reality. You sometimes need a few experienced psychonauts to stay grounded.

I will admit that most of the people who make a single penny off of it skeeze me the fuck out. The one exception is Terrance McKenna. Even he was kinda batshit sometimes. And he did die of a brain tumor, could be a coincidence but maybe there's a small lesson to be learned there


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A cautious young fellow named Lodge / Had seat belts installed in his Dodge. / When his date was strapped in / He committed a sin / Without even leaving the garage. That's clever, isn't it?-A boy and his dog

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: bloodsheen]
    #26128806 -

Ok actually that's my advise on the OP. Make them listen to like 4 hours of McKenna. They will either be convinced it's worth giving a chance or be convinced everyone who does it is insane.


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A cautious young fellow named Lodge / Had seat belts installed in his Dodge. / When his date was strapped in / He committed a sin / Without even leaving the garage. That's clever, isn't it?-A boy and his dog

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: thisbliss]
    #26128809 -

Even bullshitters can have deep truths embedded in their work; it makes them effective and compelling bullshiters. Any conjecture about the psychedelic experience is merely conjecture, intellectual macrame in a sense. Hobbies are important.

We have this tendency as humans to conflate the ideal with the person. It’s very strange, but, well, human.

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Re: Explaining psychedelics to the layperson [Re: CountHTML]
    #26128833 -

I dont think its wrong to conflate the idea with the person in the least. In fact it's foolish to separate the two, ever. Ghandi is respected around the world because he had intense beliefs but he lived by them, and through his belief he changed a whole nation.

I could say I believe in a philosophy where I sprout wings and fly away. If I did it people should really listen the fuck up. But since I can't, nobody should listen to that idea


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A cautious young fellow named Lodge / Had seat belts installed in his Dodge. / When his date was strapped in / He committed a sin / Without even leaving the garage. That's clever, isn't it?-A boy and his dog

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