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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze]
    #24634677 -

Wow, they must be MUCH more responsible, because their median income is much lower in Belgium.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_income
Median Household Income:
Belgium-$31,112
U.S.-$43,585

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze]
    #24634880 -

keyser_soze said:
median wealth doesn't really mean anything when everything is priced 2-3x higher than average.


That's a ridiculous claim.  MAYBE 20-30% higher for SOME things, at MOST.  Some thins are less there.

Regardless, if you have three times the wealth, you're a lot better off, especially when you retire because you can take that wealth anywhere.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #24634962 -

https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/country_result.jsp?country=Belgium


--------------------
People in my Fan Club: Masked (President), Ballsalsa (VP), The Ecstatic*don't waste your time "debating" with him, he uses 3rd grader tactics (Director of Bullshit), Koods (Fake News Anchorman), Falcon - Devout Communist

*Word your posts carefully if they contain right wing values. The moderators here like to keep it left leaning, they will use every excuse to ban you but not the others. You've been warned.

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze] * 1
    #24634970 -

keyser_soze said:
https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/country_result.jsp?country=Belgium


Perfect.

Quote:
Cost of living in Belgium is 11.54% higher than in United States (aggregate data for all cities, rent is NOT taken into account). Rent in Belgium is 19.87% LOWER than in United States (average data for all cities).



--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #24637249 -

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
keyser_soze said:
https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/country_result.jsp?country=Belgium


Perfect.

Quote:
Cost of living in Belgium is 11.54% higher than in United States (aggregate data for all cities, rent is NOT taken into account). Rent in Belgium is 19.87% LOWER than in United States (average data for all cities).




great, so they get cheaper housing (which is smaller than our standards, with no land attached) but everything else is more expensive. awesome.

somehow you still think they come out ahead?


--------------------
People in my Fan Club: Masked (President), Ballsalsa (VP), The Ecstatic*don't waste your time "debating" with him, he uses 3rd grader tactics (Director of Bullshit), Koods (Fake News Anchorman), Falcon - Devout Communist

*Word your posts carefully if they contain right wing values. The moderators here like to keep it left leaning, they will use every excuse to ban you but not the others. You've been warned.

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze] * 1
    #24637308 -

do you think their properties would be larger under a different tax regime?

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze] * 1
    #24637617 -

keyser_soze said:
somehow you still think they come out ahead?


I KNOW they come out ahead.  Median wealth in Belgium is 3 to 4 times greater than it is in the US.  That's a LOT.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: akira_akuma]
    #24640388 -

relic said:
keyser_soze said:
It is turning into an argument of "everyone else has single payer so we need it too" rather than actually looking at the repurcussions.




what are the repercussions?  let's look at and discuss them.


akira_akuma said:
The Ecstatic said:
Or we could look at the actual data, because the concept of single payer is actually real.


did i say something about single payer?

Quote:
what are the repercussions?  let's look at and discuss them.


you people always say the literal same THING

all the time. "project into the future, see how economic models work, give me the evidence!"

<<snipped out most of the melting>>>
do you "people"


yes, i'm a person tyvm, and i'm a business owner who employs people at living wages and contributes to our economy but i'm one who wants all citizens in the US to have affordable health insurance while getting employers out of the business.  there is zero reason that i should be involved in my employees' healthcare and there shouldn't be insurance companies profiting off of diseased people unless they provide some service other than pushing around paper. 

i'm willing to pay my share plus at least 20% of some really poor person's share because i have a little to spare and i'm not a greedy dickhead.  i know you're just loving the contrarian badge lately, but you can kindly go back to your hole and repent because you couldn't follow the conversation.

now, getting back to the discussion and spelling it out slowly...keyser said we weren't looking at the repercussions of, wait for it, single payer programs...thus me asking to talk about the repercussions of single payer that he knows of but didn't bother to state so we couldn't discuss them.

now go sit in a corner and repeat 'i'll read a little slower next time' 1000 times.  thanks, keyser's spokesman.

respectfully,

relic's fingers.

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: relic] * 2
    #24648634 -

New YouGov poll puts support for single payer amongst Americans at 40%



We're gettin there.


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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #24648771 -

Samplings like the one posted above gave the Dems false hope in the elections.

Keep dreaming.


--------------------
People in my Fan Club: Masked (President), Ballsalsa (VP), The Ecstatic*don't waste your time "debating" with him, he uses 3rd grader tactics (Director of Bullshit), Koods (Fake News Anchorman), Falcon - Devout Communist

*Word your posts carefully if they contain right wing values. The moderators here like to keep it left leaning, they will use every excuse to ban you but not the others. You've been warned.

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze]
    #24648798 -

Quote:
now, getting back to the discussion and spelling it out slowly...keyser said we weren't looking at the repercussions of, wait for it, single payer programs...thus me asking to talk about the repercussions of single payer that he knows of but didn't bother to state so we couldn't discuss them.

now go sit in a corner and repeat 'i'll read a little slower next time' 1000 times.  thanks, keyser's spokesman.

respectfully,



i told you my opinion already, that single payer can be fine and dandy if you can redirect spending from all the other senseless nonsense. if you can't follow that, then please, quiet yourself.

and if you can't refute what i said, stop gibbering about it.

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
keyser_soze said:
somehow you still think they come out ahead?


I KNOW they come out ahead.  Median wealth in Belgium is 3 to 4 times greater than it is in the US.  That's a LOT.


and everything is raising in price...do you...just pretend not to see these specific words?

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze] * 1
    #24648935 -

keyser_soze said:
Samplings like the one posted above gave the Dems false hope in the elections.

Keep dreaming.


Yeah because the Dem candidate for president didnt say "single payer will never happen."

Hillary literally shunned single payer and your excuse for why she lost is that she naively supported it?

Thats pretty lazy. Even for you.


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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #24649416 -

No, it is the false hopes that skewed polls provide the dumb liberal masses.

Hillary was gonna win in a land slide according to everyones polls "that mattered".


--------------------
People in my Fan Club: Masked (President), Ballsalsa (VP), The Ecstatic*don't waste your time "debating" with him, he uses 3rd grader tactics (Director of Bullshit), Koods (Fake News Anchorman), Falcon - Devout Communist

*Word your posts carefully if they contain right wing values. The moderators here like to keep it left leaning, they will use every excuse to ban you but not the others. You've been warned.

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze]
    #24649599 -

So you dont believe the polls is what youre saying.


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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #24649630 -

The Ecstatic said:
So you dont believe the polls is what youre saying.



that poll is a random one on the internet and because it says what  you want to believe, you believe it without question.

i'm going to need more proof than an anonymous online poll anyone can take multiple times.


but, to entertain your poll: i have a feeling if they published a tax rate instead of simply "...paid through taxes", a lot of people would have voted against it. Do you see how deceptive the questions can be in polls aimed at getting a particular result?

*edit, but they know once they reveal the true cost of tax funded healthcare that people will not want it, which is why you see all these low ball proposals that everyone is agreeing to. If they put the true cost, it would be the opposite.


--------------------
People in my Fan Club: Masked (President), Ballsalsa (VP), The Ecstatic*don't waste your time "debating" with him, he uses 3rd grader tactics (Director of Bullshit), Koods (Fake News Anchorman), Falcon - Devout Communist

*Word your posts carefully if they contain right wing values. The moderators here like to keep it left leaning, they will use every excuse to ban you but not the others. You've been warned.

Edited by keyser_soze (09/21/17 06:56 PM)

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze] * 2
    #24649664 -

So you dont believe the poll, but even if you did you dont believe the cbo, but even if you did the taxes would be too high and people would vote against it.

I dont have the patience to address the other half dozen misunderstandings in that post.


--------------------

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #24649918 -

The Ecstatic said:
So you dont believe the poll, but even if you did you dont believe the cbo, but even if you did the taxes would be too high and people would vote against it.

I dont have the patience to address the other half dozen misunderstandings in that post.



it's pretty simple.

Outright, the poll is a sham.

JUST TO ENTERTAIN your line of thinking, the poll's question is so vaguely asked, it is skewed toward getting the result they sought out in the first place.

Had they asked the question and added a legitimate tax $ amount, you would see different results.


Polls are worded like that so people like you believe them. It's the beauty of statistics.

next time address the argument instead of jumping to passive aggressive waffling.




--------------------
People in my Fan Club: Masked (President), Ballsalsa (VP), The Ecstatic*don't waste your time "debating" with him, he uses 3rd grader tactics (Director of Bullshit), Koods (Fake News Anchorman), Falcon - Devout Communist

*Word your posts carefully if they contain right wing values. The moderators here like to keep it left leaning, they will use every excuse to ban you but not the others. You've been warned.

Edited by keyser_soze (09/21/17 08:31 PM)

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze] * 2
    #24649947 -

You havent addressed the argument at all. You cant even comprehend the cost analysis.

Everyone who is for single payer understands how taxes work. Why dont you?


--------------------

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: keyser_soze] * 2
    #24650099 -

keyser_soze said:
next time address the argument instead of jumping to passive aggressive waffling.



Speaking of which, when were you planning to explain how belgians can possibly be so much more fiscally responsible compared to americans that their median wealth is more than 3X even though their median income is only 3/4 and their tax burden is almost double?

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Re: Dems Finally Sobering Up. Establishment 2020 frontrunner Kamala Harris endorses single payer [Re: ballsalsa]
    #24650123 -

they are a nation of 11,250,000 people, and they are done with budget deficits, and they feel insecure about the fact that (well some more intelligent people) their economy is propped up solely by investment in the global markets. - you aren't in China, by the by,...you could be, though, maybe in a century!
http://www.hangthebankers.com/why-the-hell-is-belgium-buying-so-much-us-debt/
remember those sci-fi novels? :wink:

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