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Oh my garsh I've heard this one a bunch... really? you hate to have religion shoved down your face 24/7 (i surround myself with all life has to offer(in the fucking bible belt no less[tho liberal college art city EVEN WORSE!!] I am definitely not BARRAGED by religious hate Logos or anything, maybe you stay up too late watching television the nuts aren't just the Christians... all are heretic in retrospect to Perfection, friend
You don't like to be BARRAGED by the brazen onslaught of attacks about getting saved on your daily basis, yet you spend your time picking through a message board defending your views AGAINST RELIGION... who's out to get you guys??? You state that all us bible thumpers are walking around ready to pull out the cross in Jesus name we pray ... For instance the OP is blasting Theism yet you say that you don't like being "attacked" by zealots .... pffwt perhaps the zombie aliens will break loose and try to kill us all... i'd rather have a zealot nut then Drakoin the Timid by my side
I must highlight the fact you said I'm defending my views. And indeed I would think lesser of any person who doesn't defend themselves.
If it was just having religion shoved in my face I could tolerate it. The oppression that I speak of (and will go over again for your benefit) is when religious organizations do actions like pass their teachings into law in attempts to get others to adhere to their religion. Examples of such would be: drug laws, sharia law, abortion laws, anti-gay laws, racist laws, among others. These laws have been pushed by the religious fanatics, and I don't see it coming to an end in my life time.
It's not "what's out to get me" but "who's out to take from me and control me".
I'm not anti-religion, I'm anti-intolerance. I have had these conversations in the street and on the forums, so your assumption of my cowardliness is unfounded.
You have fun putting your faith in a "zealot nut" because from the sounds of it, you may already do.
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Perhaps you believe that the evil pope controls the world ...is this the oppression you speak of Drakian?
I'll admit that Catholicism doesn't rule the world anymore, but they are still a powerhouse. If you know anything about medieval times than you know the pope's word was law. Through him (and the byzantine empire) you saw countless wars, women and children burned to death, and years of scientific oppression. People feared to even say out loud that the earth was round for fear of "divine" retribution.
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What gives the Atheist the moral attitude or ability to save anothers life in a life/death situation. Plain morals? I'm sure a God loving nut would probably sacrifice himself more often because of his beliefs/psychotic/out of touch ??? i dunno maybe I'm jumping to conclusions
This morality issue is a dead horse, and you guys keep kicking it and kicking it. It has been explained by better men than myself, but I'll take a mighty whack at it.
Man kind has been around much longer than "modern" religion, and the morality has remained (more or less) the same. Granted ancient cultures treated women as livestock, they still had the basic sense of right and wrong. If anything religion goes to show you how people have progressed since their foundings. The old books still tell us to treat women as property and have no qualm with slavery. That's the morality you wish to base your life on? If anything I have a stronger morality than any Christian or Islamic follower, as they would gladly allow "infidels" and "heretics" to die horrible deaths merely to appease their bloody handed God(s). Is this the religious morality of which you speak?
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If I handed you a ball of dirt and I said this is "my god" then you would have no evidence to refute this, my direct claim... My evidence is plain and clear this IS "my god" you can not refute that buddhabud bit of info it is my evidence. However you are making a statement, you are putting down the cards to reveal that YOU believe in SOMETHING... however, you have NO EVIDENCE the only remote thing to evidence you would have(if this were say in a court room) would be the "theory" the there is "no evidence god exists" as has been ...well I'll just call it fact because as YOU have come to the conclusion that because what You say is fact and that is fact because you know its fact
You are misusing the word evidence. Does evidence suggest that YOU believe that the dirt is YOUR God? Yes. Does the evidence suggest that the ball of dirt is A God? No.
You people seem to be forgetting that the responsibility of evidence lies completely with the person making the claim. We don't need proof that your claims are unfounded, as claims made without evidence are dismissed without evidence. We don't need evidence to refute claims made with no evidence, none what-so-ever. That burden is purely yours my friend.
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because you have no prior description of WHAT I AM DESCRIBING I.e. what I mean by "my god" ... do you understand where I base a fair chunk of the "negative proof" function... You use YOUR preconceived notions to try and understand the ultimate COSMIC QUESTION ... you are a fool for being a Know It All
Unless you are using the word "God" wrong, yes people already know what the word God means, as it already has a definition. If your "God" doesn't fit the criteria of the definition than it's not a God at all, but maybe something like a pet for example. The issue lies with the people who believe in a God (by definition). Obviously you understand what it is that makes your dirt a God, but neither you or your God can seem to show us. "Negative proof" doesn't exist. It's a word made up by people who can't prove their claims. I'll post what I said before:
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We are not asking you if evidence may or may not exist. We are asking for evidence for your claim. Nothing more, nothing less. Telling me: I can't prove that there is not proof that may be found to support the claim that you currently can't prove, therefor proving your claim as true doesn't help your argument at all, but merely makes you look silly. That's called circle logic.
I never once claimed to be a "know it all". I will say I'm a "give me some evidence" guy. I'm more than willing to believe your mud ball is God, and if I saw your mud perform a muddy miracle you bet your bottom dollar I would start praying to the mud God and his gravelly angels on that very spot. But the simple fact is I wont believe anything anyone says without at least a shred of proof, as blindly believing things will leave me nothing but poor, broken, and dieing, or as some faiths call it "blessed".
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Friend, I know I cannot prove to you what God is or if It exists. I can however hand you dirt and tell you that is my God. How can you state otherwise? It is my belief to ME it is true, just as to YOU it is not true.
It's unfortunate that you can't prove your God to me, because I would love to be reincarnated as a superstar, Go to heaven, get 72 virgins, or whatever your divine reward is. Right or wrong, until such a time I will go on following the other things that at least can show me something to back up their claims. The only difference between your belief and mine in the mud God is my belief is founded on evidence (or the lack thereof) while yours is based on faith.
You can believe in that mud your whole life, I'm fine with that. Your mud God can tell you to be slathered in mud 24/7. That's cool. But as soon as your mud God tells you to start slinging mud at people, or you attempt to pass a law stating that every Friday I have to roll around in mud for half an hour, I'm going to draw a line.
Just for the record you successfully misspelled my name every time, and you did it so well I'm not sure if you did it on purpose or not. But either way, thanks for making me think. I appreciate it.
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Choosing a religion is like playing the lotto, you can't get saved if you don't play! ~ Bill Maher
The efficiency of the truly national leader consists primarily in preventing the division of the attention of a people, and always in concentrating it on a single enemy. ~Adolf Hitler
10 years in an American prison right here folks, be careful!
Edited by Drakion (12/21/08 01:59 AM)
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