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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deCypher]
    #9268653 -

deCypher said:
Can a microscope inspecting itself find a flaw in the lens that it's using to inspect?


if it were to practice self-reflection, maybe so.

or maybe if the microscope were to dose 800mcg of lsd whilst smoking tonnes of pot on the come up, it'd become aware of it's own lens.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deranger]
    #9268664 -

Being aware of it's lens isn't the same as seeing the lens as it truly is.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deranger]
    #9269105 -

Maybe so, indeed.  The point is that one cannot be certain.

Drugs and meditation only give another perspective from which to look out from; they don't wholly remove the lens and let us stare into the face of undifferentiated Truth.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #9269415 -

Oweyervishice said:
Being aware of it's lens isn't the same as seeing the lens as it truly is.


How so?

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deCypher]
    #9269467 -

deCypher said:
Maybe so, indeed.  The point is that one cannot be certain.


Is it not possible that one can be certain?

Quote:
Drugs and meditation only


no, not only.  never only.

Quote:
Drugs and meditation only give another perspective from which to look out from; they don't wholly remove the lens and let us stare into the face of undifferentiated Truth.


Psychedelics and meditation can help one to be more aware of the lens.  There is no removal of the lens.  But there is cleansing of the lens.  And there is the dirtying of the lens.  True meditation cleanses the lens.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deranger]
    #9269495 -

It's possible, sure, but one can never be absolutely sure that one isn't just looking out at the world through yet another (albeit slightly more transparent) lens.

I think meditation and psychedelics (and yes, other tools as well) can certainly help give us a clearer perspective, but this is far from saying that deep meditation or a high dose LSD trip will completely remove all beliefs, predispositions, and biased perspectives that we tend to view the world through.

I mean, hell, maybe they do--the point is that we'd never know.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deCypher]
    #9269524 -

deCypher said:
It's possible, sure, but one can never be certain that one isn't just looking out at the world through yet another (albeit slightly more transparent) lens.


I certain I just had a thought come into mind.  I am certain I am aware right now.  I am certain I am not as aware as I could be. 

Quote:
I think meditation and psychedelics (and yes, other tools as well) can certainly help give us a clearer perspective, but this is far from saying that deep meditation or a high dose LSD trip will completely remove all beliefs, predispositions, and biased perspectives that we tend to view the world through.


I don't think so either, it's an life-long journey of awakening.  If one chooses to wake up.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deranger]
    #9269533 -

Are you certain you're not dreaming right now?

:strokebeard:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deCypher]
    #9269576 -

I'm certain I'm dreaming :yesnod:

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deranger]
    #9269580 -

:lol:, OK, that was a good answer.  Props.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deCypher]
    #9269586 -

We need to stop this.

15 pages of ramblings from dreamers.

Will it ever end?

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deranger]
    #9269592 -

Not if we don't make it end.

:hehehe:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deCypher]
    #9269605 -

Make it stop, please.  My brain is about to shut down.

Need... more... piracetam.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deranger]
    #9269622 -

Well, it looks like it'll be forced to come to a temporary halt, anyways... I'm about to open the floodgates of a THC deluge onto my brain in combination with some ferocious Norwegian black fuckin' metal.

:headbanger:  'night, everyone.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deCypher]
    #9269632 -

Yeah I'm about to blaze a bowl.

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #9269868 -

OrgoneConclusion said:
How many fucking more pages of

"Did!"

"Did not!"

must aware readers suffer through? :mad2:


Dude... this is like free porn.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer *DELETED* [Re: deranger]
    #9271386 -

Post deleted by Veritas

Reason for deletion: Keep it about the ideas, please.



--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Icelander]
    #9271404 -

I love the way you circumvent the 'no personalism' clause. :heart:


--------------------

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #9271424 -

Veritas is my teacher.:heart: She pushes me relentlessly to perfect myself.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Icelander]
    #9271440 -

The viewpoint that we display different characteristics online that we wouldn't in person, goes a long way to dissuade me from thinking these people I chat with really are the image I have of them in my mind. (The image I construct from their on-line dialogue.)


--------------------
Let it not be remembered
That mycelium eats detritus and dies
But that life in all it's glory
Counts mycelium to be on it's side.

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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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