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Head-in-the-Sand Liberals
    #6116078 -

Head-in-the-Sand Liberals
Western civilization really is at risk from Muslim extremists.
By Sam Harris, SAM HARRIS is the author of "The End of Faith: Religion, Terror and the Future of Reason." His next book, "Letter to a Christian Nation," will be published this week by Knopf. samharris.org.

September 18, 2006


TWO YEARS AGO I published a book highly critical of religion, "The End of Faith." In it, I argued that the world's major religions are genuinely incompatible, inevitably cause conflict and now prevent the emergence of a viable, global civilization. In response, I have received many thousands of letters and e-mails from priests, journalists, scientists, politicians, soldiers, rabbis, actors, aid workers, students — from people young and old who occupy every point on the spectrum of belief and nonbelief.

This has offered me a special opportunity to see how people of all creeds and political persuasions react when religion is criticized. I am here to report that liberals and conservatives respond very differently to the notion that religion can be a direct cause of human conflict.

This difference does not bode well for the future of liberalism.

Perhaps I should establish my liberal bone fides at the outset. I'd like to see taxes raised on the wealthy, drugs decriminalized and homosexuals free to marry. I also think that the Bush administration deserves most of the criticism it has received in the last six years — especially with respect to its waging of the war in Iraq, its scuttling of science and its fiscal irresponsibility.

But my correspondence with liberals has convinced me that liberalism has grown dangerously out of touch with the realities of our world — specifically with what devout Muslims actually believe about the West, about paradise and about the ultimate ascendance of their faith.

On questions of national security, I am now as wary of my fellow liberals as I am of the religious demagogues on the Christian right.

This may seem like frank acquiescence to the charge that "liberals are soft on terrorism." It is, and they are.

A cult of death is forming in the Muslim world — for reasons that are perfectly explicable in terms of the Islamic doctrines of martyrdom and jihad. The truth is that we are not fighting a "war on terror." We are fighting a pestilential theology and a longing for paradise.

This is not to say that we are at war with all Muslims. But we are absolutely at war with those who believe that death in defense of the faith is the highest possible good, that cartoonists should be killed for caricaturing the prophet and that any Muslim who loses his faith should be butchered for apostasy.

Unfortunately, such religious extremism is not as fringe a phenomenon as we might hope. Numerous studies have found that the most radicalized Muslims tend to have better-than-average educations and economic opportunities.

Given the degree to which religious ideas are still sheltered from criticism in every society, it is actually possible for a person to have the economic and intellectual resources to build a nuclear bomb — and to believe that he will get 72 virgins in paradise. And yet, despite abundant evidence to the contrary, liberals continue to imagine that Muslim terrorism springs from economic despair, lack of education and American militarism.

At its most extreme, liberal denial has found expression in a growing subculture of conspiracy theorists who believe that the atrocities of 9/11 were orchestrated by our own government. A nationwide poll conducted by the Scripps Survey Research Center at Ohio University found that more than a third of Americans suspect that the federal government "assisted in the 9/11 terrorist attacks or took no action to stop them so the United States could go to war in the Middle East;" 16% believe that the twin towers collapsed not because fully-fueled passenger jets smashed into them but because agents of the Bush administration had secretly rigged them to explode.

Such an astonishing eruption of masochistic unreason could well mark the decline of liberalism, if not the decline of Western civilization. There are books, films and conferences organized around this phantasmagoria, and they offer an unusually clear view of the debilitating dogma that lurks at the heart of liberalism: Western power is utterly malevolent, while the powerless people of the Earth can be counted on to embrace reason and tolerance, if only given sufficient economic opportunities.

I don't know how many more engineers and architects need to blow themselves up, fly planes into buildings or saw the heads off of journalists before this fantasy will dissipate. The truth is that there is every reason to believe that a terrifying number of the world's Muslims now view all political and moral questions in terms of their affiliation with Islam. This leads them to rally to the cause of other Muslims no matter how sociopathic their behavior. This benighted religious solidarity may be the greatest problem facing civilization and yet it is regularly misconstrued, ignored or obfuscated by liberals.

Given the mendacity and shocking incompetence of the Bush administration — especially its mishandling of the war in Iraq — liberals can find much to lament in the conservative approach to fighting the war on terror. Unfortunately, liberals hate the current administration with such fury that they regularly fail to acknowledge just how dangerous and depraved our enemies in the Muslim world are.

Recent condemnations of the Bush administration's use of the phrase "Islamic fascism" are a case in point. There is no question that the phrase is imprecise — Islamists are not technically fascists, and the term ignores a variety of schisms that exist even among Islamists — but it is by no means an example of wartime propaganda, as has been repeatedly alleged by liberals.

In their analyses of U.S. and Israeli foreign policy, liberals can be relied on to overlook the most basic moral distinctions. For instance, they ignore the fact that Muslims intentionally murder noncombatants, while we and the Israelis (as a rule) seek to avoid doing so. Muslims routinely use human shields, and this accounts for much of the collateral damage we and the Israelis cause; the political discourse throughout much of the Muslim world, especially with respect to Jews, is explicitly and unabashedly genocidal.

Given these distinctions, there is no question that the Israelis now hold the moral high ground in their conflict with Hamas and Hezbollah. And yet liberals in the United States and Europe often speak as though the truth were otherwise.

We are entering an age of unchecked nuclear proliferation and, it seems likely, nuclear terrorism. There is, therefore, no future in which aspiring martyrs will make good neighbors for us. Unless liberals realize that there are tens of millions of people in the Muslim world who are far scarier than Dick Cheney, they will be unable to protect civilization from its genuine enemies.

Increasingly, Americans will come to believe that the only people hard-headed enough to fight the religious lunatics of the Muslim world are the religious lunatics of the West. Indeed, it is telling that the people who speak with the greatest moral clarity about the current wars in the Middle East are members of the Christian right, whose infatuation with biblical prophecy is nearly as troubling as the ideology of our enemies. Religious dogmatism is now playing both sides of the board in a very dangerous game.

While liberals should be the ones pointing the way beyond this Iron Age madness, they are rendering themselves increasingly irrelevant. Being generally reasonable and tolerant of diversity, liberals should be especially sensitive to the dangers of religious literalism. But they aren't.

The same failure of liberalism is evident in Western Europe, where the dogma of multiculturalism has left a secular Europe very slow to address the looming problem of religious extremism among its immigrants. The people who speak most sensibly about the threat that Islam poses to Europe are actually fascists.

To say that this does not bode well for liberalism is an understatement: It does not bode well for the future of civilization.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-harris18sep18,0,1897169.story?coll=la-opinion-rightrail


"But my correspondence with liberals has convinced me that liberalism has grown dangerously out of touch with the realities of our world — "

"While liberals should be the ones pointing the way beyond this Iron Age madness, they are rendering themselves increasingly irrelevant. Being generally reasonable and tolerant of diversity, liberals should be especially sensitive to the dangers of religious literalism. But they aren't."


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6116090 -

Quote:
Letter to a Christian Nation



That's funny, here I thought this was an american nation.


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"Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson

"Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: RosettaStoned]
    #6116096 -

RosettaStoned said:
Quote:
Letter to a Christian Nation



That's funny, here I thought this was an american nation.



Did you read the article? He makes some good points.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6116389 -

I read this a few days ago. lol, I just knew someone would post it here. It hits about 3 birds with one stone.


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"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: Basilides]
    #6116616 -

The thing is he's claiming all this on the basis of his e-mails he's received (or at least he claims this). The politicians who rule the liberals, however, are not weak on terror at all, in fact they are the only logical, strong handed rulers who will keep americans free of terror and free of Bush's new "terrorism rules." This doesn't mean that they will not spy on Al-Qaeda terrorists and fight even harder with spying, it just means that within 72 hours of it they'll go and get a warrant for whatever operation they're doing, so we don't have to worry about data collection for money or data collection for use against political enemies (Like some American citizens).

This entire thing was generalizing liberals, and if this guy really was a liberal, I can't see why'd he do that. If he wants America to be strong on terrorism you can imagine that there other liberals, many many liberals, on that side, and I don't think any liberal would say "Naa forget doing anything about terrorism, we just need better schools there." That's not how it works. We were just as upset on 9/11. We just as much wanted to go to Afghanistan. However Bush had different plans, and thats why the liberals are so angry: They're trying to show republicans and non-voters what a big deal this is. That's why they're so furious. It shows they are passionate about there politics and show they truley are fighting for the rational states in America, with a force.

Another attempt to put "liberals don't do anything about terrorism" into our heads before election time. If you'd just look at the last two presidents in office, democrat and republican, you can judge for yourself who's "good at terrorism."


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I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.

Edited by beatnicknick (09/29/06 07:38 PM)

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: beatnicknick]
    #6117019 -

I honestly don't get the whole "liberals [Democrats] are soft on terror" bit. For one thing, they haven't even been in power in the post 9-11 era so at the moment it's just neocon doomsaying. Their policies on terrorists pretty much mirror that of the political right with the vast exception of the Iraq war. Given the recent intelligence report that the Iraq war is actually increasing the threat of terrorists, "liberals" might actually be the ones who are more suited for the job given that conservatives are distracted with Iraq for the most part. And, probably, it will be "liberals" who finally clean up the mess in Iraq left behind by the Right.


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"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: Basilides]
    #6117237 -

I honestly don't get the whole "liberals [Democrats] are soft on terror" bit.

The smart Republicans don't believe that, they just say that.

Why?

Because it works! They know that message is an easy sell to Joe Six-pack, the casual observer of politics. (And the not-so-casual observer of the inside of his own eyelids).

The conservative message is a simple one and it appeals to simple people.

The clever ones have undertaken a perpetual war for the sole purpose of continually putting Democrats in that position- You will rubber stamp our stamping out of liberty or we will portray you as weak on defense. I know that most of them don't feel that way ( yet )- a feeling they share with the senile Hindenburg in pre WWII Germany.

They will do this over and over and over until somebody stops them.


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“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6117979 -

I think you may find this interesting.

This was recently screened by Channel 5 in the UK, entitled "No excused for terror" and part of a series of polemics "Don't get me started.."

A left-wing journalist and columnist for the Times and Guardian newspapers David Aaronvitch explains where the many on the left are going very very wrong on how it views Islamist terrorism.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=aaronovitch+on+channel+5

Another from the same series, in which comedian and writer and director of the Jerry Springer opera, Stewart Lee, explores religious offense and religion in politics.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=stewart+lee+get+me+started

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: psilomonkey]
    #6118134 -

It was very Interesting. Thanks


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6118156 -

It was EXTREMELY interesting


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"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: Basilides]
    #6118236 -

I enjoy researching Youtube.

Have you seen this one?

"Better Know a District" Colbert Report.
"Cocaine and Prostitutes"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xOocmYuFH0


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6118697 -

I just watch the Colbert Report


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"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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--- [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6131146 -

---

Edited by EntheogenicPeace (11/27/14 06:26 PM)

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #6131164 -

You make some good points, but keep in mind that the number of people who have been killed by Saddam's regime is practically genocidal. Women may have had some improvement of rights, but that is only because Saddam himself was secular. Saudi Arabia does not execute non-violent dissenters of the government, they only jail them.


--------------------


"Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."

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--- [Re: Basilides]
    #6131227 -

---

Edited by EntheogenicPeace (11/27/14 06:27 PM)

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #6132867 -

Exactly why such a phrase "head in the sand liberals" couldn't be further from the truth. Most people opposed to what the US govt is doing are opposed because we understand the history involved. It's the bush supporters who have their heads buried very deep. Just look at the damn history, the USS liberty, the iran coup in 1955, operation northwoods, gulf of tonkin incident. This stuff is all declassified and if you know about each of these things and the CIAs involvement you can clearly see the US will stop at nothing and no act is off limits to further their own ends.


--------------------
"Government big enough to provide you with all you need is also big enough to take everything you have." ~ Thomas Jefferson

"Without stupid, faggy potheads we wouldn't have wars." - Zappa

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--- [Re: RosettaStoned]
    #6134810 -

---

Edited by EntheogenicPeace (11/27/14 06:28 PM)

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: lonestar2004]
    #6152464 -

Quote:
Western civilization really is at risk from Muslim extremists.

... my correspondence with liberals has convinced me that liberalism has grown dangerously out of touch with the realities of our world — specifically with what devout Muslims actually believe about the West, about paradise and about the ultimate ascendance of their faith.

A cult of death is forming in the Muslim world — for reasons that are perfectly explicable in terms of the Islamic doctrines of martyrdom and jihad. The truth is that we are not fighting a "war on terror." We are fighting a pestilential theology and a longing for paradise.



Wow, this guy is the one who is completely out of touch with reality! He thinks Muslims are fighting the US not out of anger, but because that will get them into paradise???

Quote:
Given the degree to which religious ideas are still sheltered from criticism in every society, it is actually possible for a person to have the economic and intellectual resources to build a nuclear bomb — and to believe that he will get 72 virgins in paradise. And yet, despite abundant evidence to the contrary, liberals continue to imagine that Muslim terrorism springs from economic despair, lack of education and American militarism.



So this guy thinks Mulsims are fighting the US because they're really horny and want 72 virgins? Interesting, but I think he should talk to a few Muslims to confirm it's not the reason liberals think.

Quote:
16% believe that the twin towers collapsed not because fully-fueled passenger jets smashed into them but because agents of the Bush administration had secretly rigged them to explode.

Such an astonishing eruption of masochistic unreason could well mark the decline of liberalism, if not the decline of Western civilization.



16 percent. I wonder how many conservatives still believe there are weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. I'll bet it's more than 16%. Is that evidence of the decline of western civilization?

Quote:
Unfortunately, liberals hate the current administration with such fury that they regularly fail to acknowledge just how dangerous and depraved our enemies in the Muslim world are.



Wait a minute, I thought this guy claimed to be a liberal??? I guess he was just saying that to appeal to his readers. In any case, liberals hate the current administration because of how dangerous and depraved it has made the Muslim world.

Quote:
there is no question that the Israelis now hold the moral high ground in their conflict with Hamas and Hezbollah. And yet liberals in the United States and Europe often speak as though the truth were otherwise.



I think most liberals would say both sides have taken the low road, yet for some reason the US feels it's ok for one side.

Quote:
Unless liberals realize that there are tens of millions of people in the Muslim world who are far scarier than Dick Cheney, they will be unable to protect civilization from its genuine enemies.



Again, there are tens of millions of people in the Muslim world who are far scarier than Dick Cheney because of Dick Cheney. Before the current administration came to power, there were far fewer "scary" Muslims.

Quote:
Being generally reasonable and tolerant of diversity, liberals should be especially sensitive to the dangers of religious literalism. But they aren't.



We're well aware of the dangers of religious literalism. That's the reason why so many Christian fundamentalists are cheering for Israel to wipe out Palestine.

This guy is not a real liberal, and he is the one who is WAY out of touch with reality.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

Edited by Falcon91Wolvrn03 (10/09/06 11:21 PM)

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #6152952 -

Democrats are currently wailing out about how the GOP distracted us with Iraq when there are real WMD's out there (NK) to be concentrating on.

GOP Sen. Rick Santorum (news, bio, voting record), facing a bitter re-election battle, said in a barely veiled reference to Democrats — "North Korea's actions cause great concern. This is no time for inexperienced, weak leaders."

They'll slam this into your brain until you god damn ignore the facts. Democrats are weak on terror. Democrats are weak on terror. Democrats are weak on terror. Democrats are weak on terror. Believe it yet? What you still have that whole unclassified report on how Iraq has increased terrorism in your memory. We'll get rid of that for you. Democrats are weak on terror. Democrats are weak on terror.

They will jam this into your ear like a drill and swirl up your brains until the only conclusion you can come up with is "Oh, Democrats are weak on terror."

It's not going to work this election, we as democrats refuse to let the weaker minded be scared into voting republican, and I'd say we're doing a damn good job at that, especially just us plain old Americans that like talking politics in every day life. Reality is spreading. Look at the polls now.


--------------------
I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.

Edited by beatnicknick (10/10/06 02:42 AM)

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Re: Head-in-the-Sand Liberals [Re: lonestar2004]
    #23962807 -

Erradicate Islam!

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