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amp244
Sporocarp Stretching


Registered: 08/05/08
Posts: 1,336
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22439603 - 10/27/15 10:25 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
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qman said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: no one here has yet answered my question what the Fed did wrong during the crisis.
I did.
My apologies. What did you say the Fed did wrong?
First off I never said, "hey look at this video of the Fed doing illegal shit!" which is apparently what you think I said. I was using the video to illustrate the fact that the "oversight board" directly responsible for reporting to congress the dealings at the Fed, is unable to satisfy the congress. As a matter of fact, the congress is getting quite pissed at all of the dodging and "We don't know at this time" bull shit. He wasn't asking difficult questions, and it wouldn't be hard to figure out who got the money. Its not like they dropped it out of an air plane and let it blow around in the wind.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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KauaiOrca
Waterman


Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 3,131
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: amp244]
#22439616 - 10/27/15 10:30 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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amp244 said:
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KauaiOrca said:
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Stonehenge said:
Also, gold was trading at around 300 in 2000, now over 1100. That is more than a 366% increase in 15 years. How has the value of the dollar been? Not so good, it buys less now than in 2000
I'll take the performance of stocks over the last 75 years over PM's. Much more fun to invest in ... more challenging in terms of researching companies ...
As Buffett has said ... "we use near slave labor to dig up shiny rocks from the ground, melt them into bars, the stick them back into the ground again (in vaults) and guard them ... "
No dividend, not profits, no earnings ... just speculation, hoarding and massive manipulation. Gold is really, at this point, a fringe currency. No doubt money will be made and lost on it and I own a pound of coins I keep hidden away just in case ... but that's about it.
Gold is not a currency anymore, and even on the most recent "gold-standards" it was held in reserves and the bank notes were tied to it indirectly. This is what kept the currency stable, the fact that you could take your bills to the bank and receive silver/gold for them. If other countries had the same system, then trade between nations was seamless.
Now, it is merely an investment instrument, but nobody invests in gold for a return. They invest in it as a store of wealth. If you want a return, hit the stock and bond markets. Stocks are much more intricate and in some instances, pay dividends, as you have noted. There are also some tax advantages of stocks over gold. But the advantage gold has over stocks is its value stability. No matter what happens to the dollar, to the stock market, or to the bond market, gold will always have value. So long as there is trade within an economy, gold will have value.
The bank of England knows this...
There is no argument at all that Gold will always have some value and, depending on fear and trust levels, that value can get VERY volatile.
I think there is a strong argument that a basket of stocks will have value as well ... an index perhaps. If you want to talk apocalyptic collapse, I'm going to stay out of that kind of speculation as I just don't believe that's going to happen.
I do think the people that trade gold professionally look at it as a fringe currency and trade it that way. For the guy that buys and holds coins, obviously not ...
Also, consider the 25 years out impact of nano technology. We may literally be manufacturing gold or substances MORE VALUABLE than gold in the very near future. Nano technology manufacturing is going to change everything and nothing is going to be hit harder than long held beliefs about storable commodities like PM's. The change the PC brought to our communications is going to happen with nano manufacturing in terms of how we create virtually everything.
Technology changes everything eventually. Gold will be one of the long held beliefs of humanity that will be radically changed ... IMHO.
-------------------- "The universe is endless, limitless and infinite. Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance. We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end. There is only memory. Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends. Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations. Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death." -- Ancient Taoist Master
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qman
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22439627 - 10/27/15 10:33 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
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qman said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: no one here has yet answered my question what the Fed did wrong during the crisis.
I did.
My apologies. What did you say the Fed did wrong?
Rewarding poor behavior sets a horrible precedent. Having insolvency and bankruptcies is a part of business for everyone, including banks.
What did the bailouts do for the people getting kicked out of their homes? Nothing, those distressed assets should have hit the open market at a major discount, it would have worked out just fine. That doesn't produce a economic depression.
So what did the bailouts produce? The largest wealth and income inequality in 80 years.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: amp244]
#22439632 - 10/27/15 10:34 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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amp244 said: First off I never said, "hey look at this video of the Fed doing illegal shit!" which is apparently what you think I said.
No, it's not what I think you said. I asked you what they did wrong, and the video simply shows someone not able to answer a question about an investigation that was in process.
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amp244 said: He wasn't asking difficult questions, and it wouldn't be hard to figure out who got the money.
No, it wouldn't be. Are you saying they never got the answers?
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: qman]
#22439665 - 10/27/15 10:44 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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qman said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: My apologies. What did you say the Fed did wrong?
Rewarding poor behavior sets a horrible precedent. Having insolvency and bankruptcies is a part of business for everyone, including banks.
I completely agree with you here. Except when businesses are so big, their failure would cause the collapse of the entire economy. Congress is at fault for allowing 'too big to fail', not the Fed.
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qman said: those distressed assets should have hit the open market at a major discount, it would have worked out just fine. That doesn't produce a economic depression.
I disagree with you, because there were so many derivatives tied to those assets.
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qman said: So what did the bailouts produce? The largest wealth and income inequality in 80 years.
I don't think the bailouts are at fault for the inequality. The bailouts prevented an economic depression. Congress (not the Fed) should have done a LOT more for Main Street with the money that was being spent.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Stonehenge
Alt Center

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
#22439679 - 10/27/15 10:48 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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>When congress regulated the money supply, which they did for many years between 1780-1913, it did not go well. There are problems with a central bank, but the problems with elected officials directly deciding on the money supply are much greater which is why so few countries even consider it.
Nice strawman. I never said lets have congress take over the fed, no one said that. I said lets audit the fed.
>The FED discloses a lot of information to the Treasury and the banking committees.
Not nearly enough. I don't want just a tiny handful of politicians and power brokers knowing the facts, I want those facts published. As I already said, its not a problem to redact highly sensitive info of which there is little. The sensitive info they don't want to get out is the evidence of wrong doing. Where there is smoke there is fire and its been smoking like mad.
BTW, gold is still accepted as a currency. Go ahead and spend those gold dollars, $5 pieces etc. I'm sure you will not be refused though a dumb clerk might think it was fake. i'll gladly give 10x the face value in fiat.
Fal, you are wrong again, qman knows his economics. You should learn from him instead of opposing him.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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KauaiOrca
Waterman


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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: qman] 1
#22439691 - 10/27/15 10:51 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
What did the bailouts do for the people getting kicked out of their homes? Nothing, those distressed assets should have hit the open market at a major discount, it would have worked out just fine. That doesn't produce a economic depression.
So what did the bailouts produce? The largest wealth and income inequality in 80 years.
How do you know it "would have worked out just fine?" Bernanke said last year that 12 of America's biggest financial institutions were literally DAYS away from insolvency? Would that have worked out just fine? We're talking overnight insolvency for CITI, UBS, Deutche, BofA, and a bunch of others ...then the dominoes start to fall.
Bernanke had the data. He was in a position to know. He knew more than you and I did.
Blaming the FED for the failures of Congress is nice and it fits some really intriguing conspiracy theories about global banking families, but the truth is, both democrats and republicans resisted putting in place effective oversight of Wall Street and the ratings companies that would have prevented it. If just the ratings agencies had been honest, this would have been averted.
-------------------- "The universe is endless, limitless and infinite. Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance. We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end. There is only memory. Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends. Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations. Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death." -- Ancient Taoist Master
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KauaiOrca
Waterman


Registered: 08/12/08
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Stonehenge]
#22439721 - 10/27/15 11:00 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Stonehenge said:
Not nearly enough. I don't want just a tiny handful of politicians and power brokers knowing the facts, I want those facts published. As I already said, its not a problem to redact highly sensitive info of which there is little. The sensitive info they don't want to get out is the evidence of wrong doing. Where there is smoke there is fire and its been smoking like mad.
I think you have a valid point here and, in general, transparency and disclosure is generally better than the alternative. I don't think our government believes the public is ready to hear/handle a lot of "truth" on many topics ... finance included. The fact that we have outsourced many functions of government, especially the most secretive, to private corporations would come as a major shock to most ...
We had a corporate takeover of government decades ago. That's the biggest secret of all.
-------------------- "The universe is endless, limitless and infinite. Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance. We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end. There is only memory. Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends. Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations. Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death." -- Ancient Taoist Master
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Stonehenge
Alt Center

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
#22439734 - 10/27/15 11:04 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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>We had a corporate takeover of government decades ago. That's the biggest secret of all.
Yep, and the last few presidents have all been corporate shills and dirtbags. Hitlery or jeb would be the next in a long sleazy line. That's why I would settle for bern-out rather than either of them or biden for that matter. Trump looks to be the best, time will tell. If he is a good president he will help us a lot. I hope to see the fed audited, dirty deals exposed, and the tpp, ttip, tafta, etc ditched. Also the govt run like a business and an end to bribery.
-------------------- “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835) Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755
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KauaiOrca
Waterman


Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 3,131
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Stonehenge]
#22439883 - 10/27/15 11:43 AM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Stonehenge said: >We had a corporate takeover of government decades ago. That's the biggest secret of all.
Yep, and the last few presidents have all been corporate shills and dirtbags. Hitlery or jeb would be the next in a long sleazy line. That's why I would settle for bern-out rather than either of them or biden for that matter. Trump looks to be the best, time will tell. If he is a good president he will help us a lot. I hope to see the fed audited, dirty deals exposed, and the tpp, ttip, tafta, etc ditched. Also the govt run like a business and an end to bribery.
We actually agree on a lot of stuff ... Will we ever get full disclosure on the really big topics? Maybe, but probably not in my lifetime.
We have some huge technology changes coming first ... we'll see how that shakes out.
-------------------- "The universe is endless, limitless and infinite. Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance. We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end. There is only memory. Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends. Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations. Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death." -- Ancient Taoist Master
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amp244
Sporocarp Stretching


Registered: 08/05/08
Posts: 1,336
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#22439981 - 10/27/15 12:12 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:
amp244 said: First off I never said, "hey look at this video of the Fed doing illegal shit!" which is apparently what you think I said.
No, it's not what I think you said. I asked you what they did wrong, and the video simply shows someone not able to answer a question about an investigation that was in process.
Quote:
amp244 said: He wasn't asking difficult questions, and it wouldn't be hard to figure out who got the money.
No, it wouldn't be. Are you saying they never got the answers?
Are you familiar with the concept of timely reporting? What good is information to congress if they don't get it until years after it would have been useful? What good is information if it is completely inconsequential? He is asking her about events that took place 8 months prior, and she still claims she knows nothing. So long after the policy was put into place and executed, years after the fact, the information began to surface. Long after it was useless and could only be assessed in hindsight. If you are content with private bankers who are supposed to be under the watchful eye of congress being able to implement these kinds of massive and market swinging strategies without having to disclose information in a timely manner, then again you are a lost cause.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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qman
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
#22440008 - 10/27/15 12:25 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
KauaiOrca said:
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qman said:
What did the bailouts do for the people getting kicked out of their homes? Nothing, those distressed assets should have hit the open market at a major discount, it would have worked out just fine. That doesn't produce a economic depression.
So what did the bailouts produce? The largest wealth and income inequality in 80 years.
How do you know it "would have worked out just fine?" Bernanke said last year that 12 of America's biggest financial institutions were literally DAYS away from insolvency? Would that have worked out just fine? We're talking overnight insolvency for CITI, UBS, Deutche, BofA, and a bunch of others ...then the dominoes start to fall.
Bernanke had the data. He was in a position to know. He knew more than you and I did.
Blaming the FED for the failures of Congress is nice and it fits some really intriguing conspiracy theories about global banking families, but the truth is, both democrats and republicans resisted putting in place effective oversight of Wall Street and the ratings companies that would have prevented it. If just the ratings agencies had been honest, this would have been averted.
Let the big banks fail, so what? Let those stock and bond holders suffer the ramifications of their poor investment. Again, other financial institutions would have bought up the distressed assets, that's how capitalism works. You do realize many banks did act responsibly waiting for the crash to buy up those assets? Their reward, a big kick in the ass from the Fed and their buddies.
Banks can fail, it's NOT the end of the world. What are you going to support when the next financial crisis hits the financial sector? I assume more of the same since the ends justify the means in your mind.
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qman
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] 1
#22440040 - 10/27/15 12:37 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:
qman said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: My apologies. What did you say the Fed did wrong?
Rewarding poor behavior sets a horrible precedent. Having insolvency and bankruptcies is a part of business for everyone, including banks.
I completely agree with you here. Except when businesses are so big, their failure would cause the collapse of the entire economy. Congress is at fault for allowing 'too big to fail', not the Fed.
Quote:
qman said: those distressed assets should have hit the open market at a major discount, it would have worked out just fine. That doesn't produce a economic depression.
I disagree with you, because there were so many derivatives tied to those assets.
Quote:
qman said: So what did the bailouts produce? The largest wealth and income inequality in 80 years.
I don't think the bailouts are at fault for the inequality. The bailouts prevented an economic depression. Congress (not the Fed) should have done a LOT more for Main Street with the money that was being spent.
"so many derivatives tied to those assets"
And the justifying of bad behavior continues, my answer is so what? If I bought car insurance from a company that was heavily leveraged and they couldn't make good on my accident insurance, I learned my lesson.
"I don't think the bailouts are at fault for the inequality"
Really, the $4 trillion on the Fed's balance sheet helped Joe Six-Pack and his issues? I don't think so.
It helped the boys on Wall Street, guess who owns the majority of the stocks, bonds, and real estate that got pumped up? Not Joe Six-Pack and friends.
"The bailouts prevented an economic depression"
For the people at the top, how come the rich haven't suffered one bit from this real economic downturn? Who's still worse off since before the crisis? Main Street. During the Great Depression both the rich and middle class took the economic pain, this time around it's NOT the case.
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KauaiOrca
Waterman


Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 3,131
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: qman]
#22440047 - 10/27/15 12:38 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Let the big banks fail, so what? Let those stock and bond holders suffer the ramifications of their poor investment. Again, other financial institutions would have bought up the distressed assets, that's how capitalism works. You do realize many banks did act responsibly waiting for the crash to buy up those assets? Their reward, a big kick in the ass from the Fed and their buddies.
Banks can fail, it's NOT the end of the world. What are you going to support when the next financial crisis hits the financial sector? I assume more of the same since the ends justify the means in your mind.
As much as I admire the bravado of the "let them fail" chant ... I think you may be under estimating how interdependent our financial system is and what is meant by systemic failure.
Bernanke said there was virtually NO LIQUIDITY in the markets. Where would the investors have gotten the money and credit to purchase these distressed assets? Most of their money would have been vaporized.
-------------------- "The universe is endless, limitless and infinite. Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance. We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end. There is only memory. Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends. Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations. Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death." -- Ancient Taoist Master
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amp244
Sporocarp Stretching


Registered: 08/05/08
Posts: 1,336
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: qman]
#22440084 - 10/27/15 12:50 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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And you are all placing the blame on congress, but they are mere pawns in the scheme. The heart of the problem is the Fed. They are the policy setters, they are the ones pulling the strings. Congress has less than an hour to read the bailout bill of 1000+ pages and then vote on it. They don't have a say in anything that goes on regarding the economy. That's why a few of the ones who aren't completely compromised are so damn pissed.
So lets draw the connection. Federal Reserve is owned and operated by its private member banks ie: mega institutions on Wall Street. Wall Street controls the Federal Government. The Government delegated its constitutionally granted powers to coin money, over to the Federal Reserve who carries out what the government would have done, in complete secret. The Fed is responsible for setting policies which affect interest rates and the actions of the mega wall street institutions which just so happen to own and operate it. Congress has absolutely no say under this system. They are the ones to blame on the surface of things, but the Fed, and more specifically the multinational bankers who control it, are the actual source of the problems. These people run our country from the shadows and have no affiliation to it whatsoever.
-------------------- How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer "Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith
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qman
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
#22440087 - 10/27/15 12:51 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
KauaiOrca said:
Quote:
qman said:
Let the big banks fail, so what? Let those stock and bond holders suffer the ramifications of their poor investment. Again, other financial institutions would have bought up the distressed assets, that's how capitalism works. You do realize many banks did act responsibly waiting for the crash to buy up those assets? Their reward, a big kick in the ass from the Fed and their buddies.
Banks can fail, it's NOT the end of the world. What are you going to support when the next financial crisis hits the financial sector? I assume more of the same since the ends justify the means in your mind.
As much as I admire the bravado of the "let them fail" chant ... I think you may be under estimating how interdependent our financial system is and what is meant by systemic failure.
Bernanke said there was virtually NO LIQUIDITY in the markets. Where would the investors have gotten the money and credit to purchase these distressed assets? Most of their money would have been vaporized.
Not everyone was insolvent by any means, reward the responsible and prudent, instead they got punished.
We know the deal, the concentrated power by the "too big too fail" banks creates a situation that scares the shit out of everybody when their needs are not met, nothing more than a 2 year old throwing a temper tantrum.
You guys want to break them up after the fact, how are you going to break up something you made even more powerful? Not gonna happen.
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KauaiOrca
Waterman


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Posts: 3,131
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: amp244]
#22440090 - 10/27/15 12:52 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
amp244 said: And you are all placing the blame on congress, but they are mere pawns in the scheme. The heart of the problem is the Fed. They are the policy setters, they are the ones pulling the strings. Congress has less than an hour to read the bailout bill of 1000+ pages and then vote on it. They don't have a say in anything that goes on regarding the economy. That's why a few of the ones who aren't completely compromised are so damn pissed.
So lets draw the connection. Federal Reserve is owned and operated by its private member banks ie: mega institutions on Wall Street. Wall Street controls the Federal Government. The Government delegated its constitutionally granted powers to coin money, over to the Federal Reserve who carries out what the government would have done, in complete secret. The Fed is responsible for setting policies which affect interest rates and the actions of the mega wall street institutions which just so happen to own and operate it. Congress has absolutely no say under this system. They are the ones to blame on the surface of things, but the Fed, and more specifically the multinational bankers who control it, are the actual source of the problems. These people run our country from the shadows and have no affiliation to it whatsoever.
What's your alternative to the Federal Reserve?
-------------------- "The universe is endless, limitless and infinite. Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance. We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end. There is only memory. Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends. Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations. Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death." -- Ancient Taoist Master
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KauaiOrca
Waterman


Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 3,131
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: qman]
#22440100 - 10/27/15 12:55 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Not everyone was insolvent by any means, reward the responsible and prudent, instead they got punished.
We know the deal, the concentrated power by the "too big too fail" banks creates a situation that scares the shit out of everybody when their needs are not met, nothing more than a 2 year old throwing a temper tantrum.
You guys want to break them up after the fact, how are you going to break up something you made even more powerful? Not gonna happen.
I know a lot of democrats and I don't know a single one that thinks the big banks should be getting bigger. EVERY ONE thinks they should be broken up and a modern version of the Glass Steagall act passed. EVERY ONE. And, everyone agrees that Obama has been a huge disappointment, like Clinton and GWB in terms of prosecuting Wall Street.
-------------------- "The universe is endless, limitless and infinite. Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance. We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end. There is only memory. Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends. Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations. Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death." -- Ancient Taoist Master
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paperbackwriter
Edward Lear


Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
#22440148 - 10/27/15 01:07 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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Hillary dodged the glass-steagall shit a lot during the debate.
-------------------- Why should we strive with cynic frown To knock their fairy castles down? ~ Eliza Cook It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley
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Bigbadwooof
Trumps Bone Spurs



Registered: 12/07/13
Posts: 13,344
Last seen: 2 minutes, 13 seconds
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
#22440159 - 10/27/15 01:09 PM (8 years, 3 months ago) |
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KauaiOrca said:
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amp244 said:
You should all do yourselves a favor and read this essay by Alan Greenspan written way back in 1966 arguing a link between a gold standard and economic freedom. I think this will do a lot to help you all truly understand the argument for a gold standard.
http://www.321gold.com/fed/greenspan/1966.html
That ship sailed a long time ago ... we are not going to any gold standard now or in the future. That's not to say that a competing commodities backed currency won't be introduced, because it might ...
The world was a different place in 1966 ... no personal computers ... no online trading ... Currency trading was nothing like it is today ... The global trade situation had hardly gotten started in terms of what we have today.
We live in an era of options ... currencies, stocks, bonds, derivatives, commodities, PM's and internet based currencies ... Gold's importance has gone down, now up.
Those options are allowing the game to be rigged and played accordingly. You could still trade a gold-based currency over the internet anyway. The same way we do now. I don't see your point.
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KauaiOrca said:
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Bigbadwooof said:
Gold isn't the best investment you can make for financial gain, but it is quite secure in a time of crisis.
Gold really isn't an investment per se ... it's an increasingly volatile inflation hedge ... speculation more accurately.
It pays no dividend, produces nothing and must be guarded carefully.
As more and more countries gain more and more financial power, the volatility of gold increases. It trades almost entirely on technical factors and really doesn't have any fundamentals to assess.
Gold is a finite resource and a precious metal. It is useful for many things, and prized the world over. Gold will always have value. Dollars will not always have value. Every fiat currency that has ever existed was inflated out of existence at some point, or will eventually. Quantitative easing is the beginning of the process, and nobody has ever recovered once they start QE.
This is my understanding of the situation. If you are uncertain about the stability of your economy in the immediate future, gold may be a wise investment.
-------------------- "It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti FARTS "There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin Every one of you should see this video. "If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy
 
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