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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #22435496 - 10/26/15 10:59 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Once again you people conflate things

>If they're laying the golden egg why is income inequality at an all time high?

Probably because of obumble and shrub's policies that give the loot to big business and take bribes to favor corporations.

>Why are jobs already going overseas?

I already explained why, its been explained over and over. Too high taxes. but you people want even higher taxes. Now I suppose you will talk about eisenhour's time and how good it was. That was over 50 years ago, things have changed a lot. Now its china exporting cheap goods so our factories can't compete. Trump will  fix that


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Invisibleamp244
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #22435503 - 10/26/15 11:01 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
If they're laying the golden egg why is income inequality at an all time high?  And why are socialist countries considered more 'business friendly'?  Why are jobs already going overseas?




Policy policy policy! QE, Stimulus, Obamacare, Bailout. These policies actively leach the wealth from the greater population and give to the 1%. These policies were devised by members of that 1%.


--------------------
How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer


"Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith


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InvisibleKauaiOrca
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Posts: 3,131
Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Stonehenge] * 1
    #22435523 - 10/26/15 11:09 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Once again you people conflate things

>If they're laying the golden egg why is income inequality at an all time high?

Probably because of obumble and shrub's policies that give the loot to big business and take bribes to favor corporations.

>Why are jobs already going overseas?

I already explained why, its been explained over and over. Too high taxes. but you people want even higher taxes. Now I suppose you will talk about eisenhour's time and how good it was. That was over 50 years ago, things have changed a lot. Now its china exporting cheap goods so our factories can't compete. Trump will  fix that




Cheap labor and globalization in general much more responsible for jobs leaving America than corporate tax rates.  Our tax rates keep the profits off shore as well ... but labor costs are a MUCH bigger factor than corporate tax rates.

Income inequality is at an all time high because of globalization, monetary policy that favors the uber wealthy and enormous political advantages to corporations (the wealthy) that gives them an extreme advantage in the financial and legal systems.  Add to that technology reducing the need for what used to be good middle class jobs and it's a triple whammy.


--------------------
"The universe is endless, limitless and infinite.  Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance.  We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end.  There is only memory.  Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends.  Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations.  Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death."

-- Ancient Taoist Master


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InvisibleKauaiOrca
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Posts: 3,131
Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: amp244]
    #22435525 - 10/26/15 11:10 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

amp244 said:
Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
If they're laying the golden egg why is income inequality at an all time high?  And why are socialist countries considered more 'business friendly'?  Why are jobs already going overseas?




Policy policy policy! QE, Stimulus, Obamacare, Bailout. These policies actively leach the wealth from the greater population and give to the 1%. These policies were devised by members of that 1%.




Let's not forget "defense" spending.


--------------------
"The universe is endless, limitless and infinite.  Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance.  We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end.  There is only memory.  Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends.  Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations.  Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death."

-- Ancient Taoist Master


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Invisibleamp244
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Registered: 08/05/08
Posts: 1,336
Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
    #22435607 - 10/26/15 11:36 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

KauaiOrca said:
Quote:

amp244 said:
Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
If they're laying the golden egg why is income inequality at an all time high?  And why are socialist countries considered more 'business friendly'?  Why are jobs already going overseas?




Policy policy policy! QE, Stimulus, Obamacare, Bailout. These policies actively leach the wealth from the greater population and give to the 1%. These policies were devised by members of that 1%.




Let's not forget "defense" spending.




Ha-ha, I left that one out. Nice catch.

Simple answers are certainly hard to come by and the economic environment is rapidly changing, that's for sure. There is alot of things going on and I feel like both sides of this argument are right to an extent.

The bottom line is that those truly in power are causing this problem.


--------------------
How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer


"Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
    #22435633 - 10/26/15 11:42 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

KauaiOrca said:
Quote:

Stonehenge said:

Rich people are the goose laying the golden egg. Fal, you and the other extreme left wingers want to drive away the goose by confiscating all its gold. Rich people aren't stupid, if they see any profits made in usa get taxed at some ridiculous rate, they invest overseas and do not bring the money back. This is already happening and it will get worse if Bernie gets in. It will get much worse if the bitch gets in.




LMAO ... the uber wealthy (We're talking billionaires, here) are the ones eating the eggs, for the most part ...




Best line I've heard on here in a while lmao!

Quote:

It's our education system + innovative companies that create products with American employees + infrastructure + legal system that is the golden goose.  The "eggs," more and more, are being hoarded away in accounts that don't add anything to the American economy and are being hatched overseas in the cheapest labor markets that offer near slave labor conditions for extreme profits.  An increasing percentage of what you call "investing" is simply speculation, much of it extremely fast paced (HFT) that SCALPS money out of the real economy. 

You're describing American in the 50's - early 80's ... things have changed.





Stonehenge heres points and arguments, and then reiterates his own conjecture that never changes and never has any point except that 'librawls r dumb!'

Sorry stoney... you're wrong. Trickle down doesn't work. You're preaching trickle down horse shit that most politicians don't even dare reiterate any longer.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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InvisibleKauaiOrca
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Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 3,131
Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: amp244]
    #22435635 - 10/26/15 11:42 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

amp244 said:
Quote:

KauaiOrca said:
Quote:

amp244 said:
Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
If they're laying the golden egg why is income inequality at an all time high?  And why are socialist countries considered more 'business friendly'?  Why are jobs already going overseas?




Policy policy policy! QE, Stimulus, Obamacare, Bailout. These policies actively leach the wealth from the greater population and give to the 1%. These policies were devised by members of that 1%.




Let's not forget "defense" spending.




Ha-ha, I left that one out. Nice catch.

Simple answers are certainly hard to come by and the economic environment is rapidly changing, that's for sure. There is alot of things going on and I feel like both sides of this argument are right to an extent.

The bottom line is that those truly in power are causing this problem.




You're definitely one of the brighter lights on this thread in terms of getting to the crucible of the problem.  Let's face it, our monetary system has enabled some incredible miracles ... expansion, building, infrastructure, amazing corporations, etc.  It's hard to do that stuff trading gold coins ... It takes a lot of capital to do what we do in America and placing an artificial limit on it with a hard gold standard would be, IMHO a disaster.

On the other hand, we need a way to make sure the currency actually CIRCULATES in the economy and doesn't get hoarded into black holes of greed.


--------------------
"The universe is endless, limitless and infinite.  Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance.  We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end.  There is only memory.  Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends.  Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations.  Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death."

-- Ancient Taoist Master


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: amp244]
    #22435640 - 10/26/15 11:44 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

amp244 said:
Quote:

paperbackwriter said:
If they're laying the golden egg why is income inequality at an all time high?  And why are socialist countries considered more 'business friendly'?  Why are jobs already going overseas?




Policy policy policy! QE, Stimulus, Obamacare, Bailout. These policies actively leach the wealth from the greater population and give to the 1%. These policies were devised by members of that 1%.




Let's not forget the tarrif free trade deals. Lets not forget the TPP; literally written by banks and wall street interests.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Stonehenge]
    #22435647 - 10/26/15 11:45 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
>Why are jobs already going overseas?

I already explained why, its been explained over and over. Too high taxes. but you people want even higher taxes.




I want higher taxes on the largest incomes.  I want wealth redistributed.  I want corporations that are evading taxes to pay their taxes.

I actually agree that the corporate tax rate should go down.  I think it needs to be part of a larger measure though that includes everything in my previous paragraph.  I'd also like to see tax breaks for businesses that are worker coops, worker owned, or have workers participating on the board.

That said it's not just taxes that move jobs overseas.  Many companies are still headquartered here but they outsource labor and manufacturing to countries that pay workers next to nothing and have such lax environmental laws that they literally dump heavy metals into villages.  People are so poor they make a living by recycling these metals and selling them back to manufacturers who in turn make more cheap shit, for us to buy, for us to break, outgrow, or get bored with.  For us to drop off at Best Buy, for recycling, so it can all go back to China, to turn into new shit...

Meanwhile we pawn off the immediate environmental cost, which is painful to see, on those in another country.  In return we give them jobs, we lose jobs, and we get cheap crap in return.

How do you propose we break this cycle?


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleKauaiOrca
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Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 3,131
Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #22435666 - 10/26/15 11:48 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

I'm for wealth CIRCULATION, not redistribution.  I want money MOVING AROUND in the economy and the velocity of money to increase a lot.  That's what's missing right now.

Way too much of the country's currency is stuck in places that don't benefit the country at all ... that's why we can have 18 trillion in debt ... 2-3 trillion in stimulus, 850 Trillion in derivatives and have minimal inflation ... The money isn't getting into the hands of the people that are going to spend it quickly. 

Better trade deals?  Yes.  Better tax policy?  Yes.  Bigger incentives to employ Americans here in America?  Yes.  Smarter energy policy to export all that natural gas we just flare and waste?  Yes.


--------------------
"The universe is endless, limitless and infinite.  Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance.  We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end.  There is only memory.  Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends.  Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations.  Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death."

-- Ancient Taoist Master


Edited by KauaiOrca (10/26/15 11:58 AM)


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Invisiblepaperbackwriter
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Registered: 03/31/14
Posts: 1,888
Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
    #22435694 - 10/26/15 11:55 AM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Let me clarify.

I want higher taxes on the incomes of the top earners in this country.  I want taxes on speculation too.  I want this tax money put into social programs such as education, healthcare, rebuilding of our infrastructure, and green energy.

This will create jobs and generate more wealth for the poor.

*edit*  And by wealth I really mean income.  I agree I want circulation too.


--------------------
Why should we strive with cynic frown
To knock their fairy castles down?  ~ Eliza Cook

It's rather embarrassing to have given one's entire life to pondering the human predicament and to find that in the end one has little more to say than, 'Try to be a little kinder.' ~Aldous Huxley


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Invisibleamp244
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
    #22435769 - 10/26/15 12:11 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

KauaiOrca said:

You're definitely one of the brighter lights on this thread in terms of getting to the crucible of the problem.  Let's face it, our monetary system has enabled some incredible miracles ... expansion, building, infrastructure, amazing corporations, etc.  It's hard to do that stuff trading gold coins ... It takes a lot of capital to do what we do in America and placing an artificial limit on it with a hard gold standard would be, IMHO a disaster.

On the other hand, we need a way to make sure the currency actually CIRCULATES in the economy and doesn't get hoarded into black holes of greed.




It doesn't necessarily have to be gold, but there should be SOMETHING tied to the dollar. That is the only way to protect average American from the confiscation of their savings. We can't just have paper money that is only worth a fuck because of its reserve currency status, which wont last forever. Hell a fiat currency WOULD work, so long as increases to the money supply were tied to ACTUAL production. A little inflation here, a little deflation there, its not a big deal if things were managed correctly. Bitcoin isn't doing so bad...


--------------------
How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer


"Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith


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InvisibleKauaiOrca
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Posts: 3,131
Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: amp244]
    #22435938 - 10/26/15 12:55 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

amp244 said:
Quote:

KauaiOrca said:

You're definitely one of the brighter lights on this thread in terms of getting to the crucible of the problem.  Let's face it, our monetary system has enabled some incredible miracles ... expansion, building, infrastructure, amazing corporations, etc.  It's hard to do that stuff trading gold coins ... It takes a lot of capital to do what we do in America and placing an artificial limit on it with a hard gold standard would be, IMHO a disaster.

On the other hand, we need a way to make sure the currency actually CIRCULATES in the economy and doesn't get hoarded into black holes of greed.




It doesn't necessarily have to be gold, but there should be SOMETHING tied to the dollar. That is the only way to protect average American from the confiscation of their savings. We can't just have paper money that is only worth a fuck because of its reserve currency status, which wont last forever. Hell a fiat currency WOULD work, so long as increases to the money supply were tied to ACTUAL production. A little inflation here, a little deflation there, its not a big deal if things were managed correctly. Bitcoin isn't doing so bad...




The dollar is tied to many things ... it's traded agains EUROS, yen, yuan, gold, silver, platinum, oil, you name it.  There are plenty of mechanisms out there to keep our dollar "honest" so to speak. 

IMHO, part of the answer is for the US Treasury to issue a COMPETING CURRENCY to Federal Reserve Notes.  This is what Lincoln and Kennedy both wanted and I think they were both right.    Call them US Treasury Dollars and if you want to back that with some kind of basket of commodities, that might be an idea.  The US could use this currency to pay for infrastructure projects without having to borrow anything.


--------------------
"The universe is endless, limitless and infinite.  Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance.  We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end.  There is only memory.  Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends.  Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations.  Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death."

-- Ancient Taoist Master


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
    #22435960 - 10/26/15 12:59 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

A strong case can be made that the dollar derives much of its value from the fact that oil is traded worldwide for USD. The dollar is backed by oil.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22435996 - 10/26/15 01:09 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

The petrodollar is a HUGE factor in our currency's value, and by proxy our foreign policy, namely our propensity to invade nations who decide against the petrodollar.


--------------------


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Invisibleamp244
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22436144 - 10/26/15 01:50 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
A strong case can be made that the dollar derives much of its value from the fact that oil is traded worldwide for USD. The dollar is backed by oil.




That's the only thing that is giving it any value whatsoever. That certainly doesn't mean that it is backed by oil. Under this logic you could say that the dollar is backed by mountain dew. The supply of money is not tied to the supply of oil. The price of a barrel of oil as it relates to the dollar is constantly fluctuating.



If the dollar were backed by gold, or perhaps oil, the prices of oil would not fluctuate to this degree. The U.S. dollar is not stable, and pinning it to a commodity such as gold or oil would serve to stabilize it. Here is an interesting chart that illustrates my point clearly:



This shows amount of Dollars and Euros it would take to buy one barrel of oil in the red and blue lines. It also shows how many barrels of oil it would take to buy one oz of gold in the purple line. As you can see, the oil and gold share a very stable relationship with one another. Their value in the economy and as related to one another is clearly stable. You may also note, that the fiat monetary units that are constantly being manipulated by the market makers, experience wild swings of valuation as they relate to commodities, in this case a barrel of oil. In 2002, when gold was under $300 an ounce, oil was down around $20 a barrel. When gold shot up to $900 an oz in 2008, barrels of oil likewise shot up to around $80 a barrel. Gold isn't the only thing that can stabilize our money, but there is certainly a reason why every central bank in the world stock piles it.


--------------------
How to Convert a Normal 24-hour Light Timer into a Short Cycle Repeating Timer


"Monopoly, besides, is a great enemy to good management, which can never be universally established but in consequence of that free and universal competition which forces everybody to have recourse in it for the sake of self-defense." -Adam Smith


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InvisibleKauaiOrca
Waterman


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Posts: 3,131
Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: amp244]
    #22436176 - 10/26/15 02:00 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

amp244 said:

This shows amount of Dollars and Euros it would take to buy one barrel of oil in the red and blue lines. It also shows how many barrels of oil it would take to buy one oz of gold in the purple line. As you can see, the oil and gold share a very stable relationship with one another. Their value in the economy and as related to one another is clearly stable. You may also note, that the fiat monetary units that are constantly being manipulated by the market makers, experience wild swings of valuation as they relate to commodities, in this case a barrel of oil. In 2002, when gold was under $300 an ounce, oil was down around $20 a barrel. When gold shot up to $900 an oz in 2008, barrels of oil likewise shot up to around $80 a barrel. Gold isn't the only thing that can stabilize our money, but there is certainly a reason why every central bank in the world stock piles it.




The price of gold has fluctuated wildly in the last 10 years.  The dollar, over the last 3 years, has proven to be a much better way to store value than gold, even with all the global stimulus and QE.  And, if you want to use Gold as your "currency" you can pretty much do it. 

If you peg the dollar to a commodity such as gold and place really strong limits on fractional reserve lending, how exactly do you introduce enough currency into the economy to stimulate growth?  Tight monetary policy kills exports and and tourism.


--------------------
"The universe is endless, limitless and infinite.  Any effort to define it's boundaries is an attempt to overcome ignorance.  We are physical, mental and spiritual beings ... there is no beginning and there is no end.  There is only memory.  Our repeated loss of memory experiences create the illusion of beginnings and ends.  Immortality is the ability to retain full memory through all consciousness transformations.  Loss of memory is man's greatest curse and, in very real terms, death."

-- Ancient Taoist Master


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InvisibleStonehenge
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: paperbackwriter]
    #22436247 - 10/26/15 02:24 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Taxes are a big reason why companies are offshoring. Its not the only reason but its a biggie. Why do you think google is headquartered in another country, Ireland I think? Its not for the cheap labor its because of taxes. Same for many others.


--------------------
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

Trade list http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18047755


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: KauaiOrca]
    #22436249 - 10/26/15 02:25 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

The price of gold has fluctuated wildly because the value of the dollar has fluctuated wildly. As his graph demonstrates, the value of gold has been quite stable in comparison to dollars. I'm sure a lot of this is related to QE.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Hillary 'Turns Over' E-mail Server and Thumbnail drive to FBI [Re: Stonehenge] * 1
    #22436262 - 10/26/15 02:29 PM (8 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Stonehenge said:
Taxes are a big reason why companies are offshoring. Its not the only reason but its a biggie. Why do you think google is headquartered in another country, Ireland I think? Its not for the cheap labor its because of taxes. Same for many others.




So, you're proposal is that we reduce taxes to the levels of panama to compete with tax havens (0%) and we reduce wages to those of Bangladesh to compete with low wage labor costs ($0.50/day).

Well, as I've said before, you conservatives may be on a race to the bottom. You may worship wealth like a golden statue. The rich are your gods. The rest of us will fight for the fruits of our labor. We don't want America to be a 3rd world country, as you do. Your proposals are absolutely assinine.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


Edited by Bigbadwooof (10/26/15 02:29 PM)


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