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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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If Satan has free will and a brain
    #1286521 -

Hello, I am here to bash with a fundamentalist. Just kidding, sort of. But I do have a question that I've had since my more religious days.

If Satan is a sentient being, as some believe, he must surely be aware of the purpose of our mortal existence--as a testing ground--and also of his own role as tempter. So why, then, if he is really so set on foiling God's plan, doesn't he just stop being tempter, and even turn it the other way and encourage us to be good? Wouldn't that mess up the Great Plan, and so be the vilest, most spiteful thing he could do to God?

By the way, I no longer try to be a believer, I'm an agnostic leaning atheisticish, but I still think about this stuff now and then. It's all very fascinating.

Thanks,
hongomon

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: hongomon]
    #1286557 -

well, technically, if the devil was originally an angel who fell from heaven, he has no choice. humans have free will, but god's more angelic and demonic creations dont. angels dont have a choice, they have to do gods bidding. likewise satan is stuck in his role for eternity. he might understand that if he stoped playing the tempter he would outdo god, but he just cant do it. he doesnt have the ability to make that choice.


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"is there a doctor in the house?
we like fuck that, nut sacks in yo mouth
lemme show you what a thug about
we can talk or we can slug it out"
-cisco kid

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: minusrestraint]
    #1286580 -

That's interesting, thanks.  Was it also God's will that as an angel he rebel?  I see a lot of similarities to the case of Judas Iscariat, who we would have to assume did exercise free will.

By the way, I don't want this to become a free will/determinism debate.  So all you determinists, START YER OWN BLEDDY THREAD.  :grin: 

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: minusrestraint]
    #1286610 -

I suppose you know this because you know God and you know Satan.

I figure that people think they know these things due to the writings they have read. I have no doubt in my mind that these writings have changed since their inception.

When it comes down to it all I think all we have are opinions on an idea that started a long time ago and has changed from its original form.

As far as the original question goes...I root for Satan according to the story I am aware of. It is Satan who tought us to doubt. With out doubt we would be nothing but machines doing the will of God...happy machines though.

I think our current role it to find out why we would be happy machines.

Joshua


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The Shroomery Bookstore

Great books for inquiring minds!

"Life After Death is Saprophytic!"

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: hongomon]
    #1286651 -

Deleted by admin

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: World Spirit]
    #1286686 -

I think that's a good position for a believer to have. I still hold on to a philosophical concept of both God and Devil.

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: hongomon]
    #1286688 -

Deleted by admin

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: World Spirit]
    #1286721 -

I would agree. I think they are concepts for us to dwell. They are natural ramifications of the ability to conceptualize. Humans have the desire to personify ideas in an effort to associate w/ the idea. God and the Devil are mere personifications of right and wrong, good and evil, up and down.

I know your reply was not directed toward me.

Joshua


--------------------
The Shroomery Bookstore

Great books for inquiring minds!

"Life After Death is Saprophytic!"

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: Joshua]
    #1286751 -

Deleted by admin

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: World Spirit]
    #1286777 -

Yeah, what Joshua said. I may have rejected the whole 'God' idea a long time ago if it didn't serve as such a potent metaphor.

That and my desire to worship something.

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: hongomon]
    #1287275 -

In the realms of the Eternal ie. heaven, a decision made once is made for all time and forever.  Therefore, that which was good (Lucifer), having turned once to evil (becoming Satan) shall remain evil until the cycle is complete.  This is why there is no redemption for the Devil, but plenty of sympathy.

He had just enough free will to say "well damnit!  I wanna be God!" and that was enough to cause the split between him and the gGodhead.  It's a classic duality.  So goes the story, anyway.

Down here on the more variable planes however, WE have constant choice of duality.  Perhaps the Devil's jealous of that. 

I dunno, though, we don't talk a lot, me and him.  He's got a real fundamentalist sorta personality (like a "true Christian" or, say, a "scientific rationalist") that really starts to grate after a while and then it's "jeez, get behind me Satan!  You're so BORING!"

:smile:


the Landotter 


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* * * * * * * * * *
Read the Landotter's Mystical Journey Journal

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: World Spirit]
    #1287280 -

Quote:
I no longer am hung up on the cast of the movie. Life goes on. God remains Ruler of the Universe. 


Oooh!  I like that!  I really like that!  :ooo:

Neat!  :smile:


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* * * * * * * * * *
Read the Landotter's Mystical Journey Journal

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: hongomon]
    #1287305 -

i don't think that there is a force of evil. what satan means to me is root of temptation to do things which are wrong and cause suffering. satan is the ego.

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: hongomon]
    #1288794 -

I don't beleive in satan either.


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Computer games don't affect kids. I mean if Pacman affected our generation as kids, we'd all be running around in a darkened room, munching pills and listening to repetitive electronic music.

"Being bitter and hateful is like drinking a vial of poison and hoping the other person gets sick" FreakQLibrium

"My motto from here on out is: If someone or something (including me) in my life is conducting themselves in such a way that they can be seen on Jerry Springer, it's time to take out the garbage!!! When you stop taking their behaviour personally and see their antics as a true reflection on their character, it becomes absolutely nauseating." Anon. on abusive relationships.

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: hongomon]
    #1288850 -

If God is all powerful, then there couldn't be a Satan.

How could God want something, and then not get it?



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Mp3 of the month: ESB - Mushroom People


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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: Learyfan]
    #1288862 -

No arguing with church doctrine! If you question us like that again we'll have you excommunicated!








:wink: 

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Re: If Satan has free will and a brain [Re: Learyfan]
    #1289075 -

LearyFan...

Satan was invented as an opposite to God. When little kids say "mommy why did God let dad get tourtured, murdered, and decapitated in that dark alley before I was born?" then mommy can simply say "It was Satan.... God wouldn't have done that."

rofl man I can't believe religion is still so prominent..


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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