fireworks_god said:

That is because this forum is specifically intended for ideological discussion.

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I don't have to play by the rules.  Is someone gonna ban me because of this ridiculousness ?  When I was in school, I didn't care what the teacher wanted out of me.  You know why?  Because I wanted to have fun.  I never bought into seriousness and strict guidelines.

People like to expect things out of me.  I think that's funny, and this is why I enjoy this type of debate.

deranger said:

I can't fully understand Socrates context as I have not fully experienced what he has, therefore I cannot fully understand what he is saying (or his meaning).  The same goes for the Tao Te Ching and the original Zohar interpreted by David Goldstein.  If we have not experienced similar experiences these authors have, we cannot understand the context through which they speak.  Their meanings will be fully, partially, or completely misunderstood.  Until we have experienced, we can partially or slightly understand their context.  The author of the Tao Te Ching speaks in a way which sometimes baffles me.  Until I have partially experienced what the author of the book experienced, then I can partially understand his context. 

So we can understand outside of context, if we make changes in our experiences.

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I understand what you mean, although I would personally refer to it more as "expanding one's context", in the sense that one is proceeding to gain more knowledge, insight, or experience which contributes to one's ability to understand.

When I said that one cannot find meaning outside of context, I was referring to the idea that the meaning and intention behind one word is only evidenced (to others) in that word's relation to other words, to other phrases. You've expanded this same idea to the entirety of an individual's personal understanding and the meaning they assign to everything they perceive, and I agree. It determines how we understand what others are saying and the simple fact that we aren't the same people as them with the same vantage point implies that we are not capable of seeing things and understanding things fully as they do.

To focus more on the specific point at which the exchange of information is taking place, in order for someone to begin to approach a greater understanding of the intention, or context, if you wish, of Socrates, one can read some of his work. If I personally don't find enough information in your words "not really, different contexts" to feel like I can pinpoint an accurate impression of what you were intending to say, it is helpful for me to ask for more information from you.

deranger said:

I don't have to play by the rules.  Is someone gonna ban me because of this ridiculousness ?

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fireworks_god said:

I understand what you mean, although I would personally refer to it more as "expanding one's context", in the sense that one is proceeding to gain more knowledge, insight, or experience which contributes to one's ability to understand.

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Same stuff, different pile to me.  Like I said, I never paid attention in school, and didn't want someone telling me which words I should use.

To focus more on the specific point at which the exchange of information is taking place, in order for someone to begin to approach a greater understanding of the intention, or context, if you wish, of Socrates, one can read some of his work. If I personally don't find enough information in your words "not really, different contexts" to feel like I can pinpoint an accurate impression of what you were intending to say, it is helpful for me to ask for more information from you.

I was testing how expanded your ability to contextualize was.  This was sort of an experiment for me.

I think you might have missed the point I was attempting to express. The forum is orientated or intended for ideological discussion because that's what a lot of people come here to do. This is why I try to hold myself to the ideal of discussing what has been presented, the ideas that have been put forth to discuss.

I understood your point from the beginning.  I mentioned in the OP that I wasn't asking to become a mod.  Maybe you didn't take me seriously.  I also said this thread was a joke.  I've always known the admins wouldn't let me mod.  I knew this for a fact.

I like to get inside of peoples heads, to hope to teach them a lesson.  And I like people getting inside of my head, so that I can learn as well.  It's much more powerful a teaching than reading some words on a book.

deranger said:

fireworks_god said:

I understand what you mean, although I would personally refer to it more as "expanding one's context", in the sense that one is proceeding to gain more knowledge, insight, or experience which contributes to one's ability to understand.

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Same stuff, different pile to me.  Like I said, I never paid attention in school, and didn't want someone telling me which words I should use.

To focus more on the specific point at which the exchange of information is taking place, in order for someone to begin to approach a greater understanding of the intention, or context, if you wish, of Socrates, one can read some of his work. If I personally don't find enough information in your words "not really, different contexts" to feel like I can pinpoint an accurate impression of what you were intending to say, it is helpful for me to ask for more information from you.

I was testing how expanded your ability to contextualize was.  This was sort of an experiment for me.

I think you might have missed the point I was attempting to express. The forum is orientated or intended for ideological discussion because that's what a lot of people come here to do. This is why I try to hold myself to the ideal of discussing what has been presented, the ideas that have been put forth to discuss.

I understood your point from the beginning.  I mentioned in the OP that I wasn't asking to become a mod.  Maybe you didn't take me seriously.  I also said this thread was a joke.  I've always known the admins wouldn't let me mod.  I knew this for a fact.

I like to get inside of peoples heads, to hope to teach them a lesson.  And I like people getting inside of my head, so that I can learn as well.  It's much more powerful a teaching than reading some words on a book.

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deranger said:

This isn't a real philosophy forum, IMO.

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There goes your chance of modship right there.

Quote:

Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity.
Calculate what we will or will not tolerate.
Desperate to control all and everything.
Unable to forgive your scarlet lettermen.

Clutch it like a cornerstone. Otherwise it all comes down.
Justify denials and grip 'em to the lonesome end.
Clutch it like a cornerstone. Otherwise it all comes down.
Terrified of being wrong. Ultimatum prison cell.

Saturn ascends, choose one or ten. Hang on or be humbled again.
Humbled again.

Clutch it like a cornerstone. Otherwise it all comes down.
Justify denials and grip 'em to the lonesome end.
Saturn ascends, comes round again.
Saturn ascends, from one or ten. Ignorant to the damage done.

Wear the grudge like a crown of negativity.
Calculate what we will or will not tolerate.
Desperate to control all that and everything.
Unable to forgive your scarlet lettermen.

Wear your grudge like a crown. Desperate to control.
Unable to forgive. And we're sinking deeper.

Defining, confining, sinking deeper.
Controlling, Defining, and we're sinking deeper.

Saturn comes back around to show you everything
Let's you choose what you will, will not see and then
Drags you down like a stone or lifts you up again
Spits you out like a child, light and innocent.

Saturn comes back around. Lifts you up like a child or
Drags you down like a stone
To consume you till you choose to let this go.
Choose to let this go...

Give away the stone. Let the oceans take and
Transmutate this cold and fated anchor.
Give away the stone. Let the waters kiss and
Transmutate these leaden grudges into gold.
Let go.

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RationalEgo said:

deranger said:

This isn't a real philosophy forum, IMO.

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There goes your chance of modship right there.

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I never said I wanted to be a mod. 

MushroomTrip said:

That's because you post in it

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deranger said:

Same stuff, different pile to me.  Like I said, I never paid attention in school, and didn't want someone telling me which words I should use.

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Quote:

I understood your point from the beginning.  I mentioned in the OP that I wasn't asking to become a mod.  Maybe you didn't take me seriously.  I also said this thread was a joke.  I've always known the admins wouldn't let me mod.  I knew this for a fact.

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If you understood my point from the beginning, then you certainly wouldn't be mentioning the fact that you weren't asking to become a moderator, because the issue of whether or not you want to be a moderator is completely irrelevant to the point I was making when I referred to the forum being intended for ideological discussion, which was mentioned specifically regarding why I personally choose to hold myself to the ideal that I do in posting.

The statement "That is because this forum is specifically intended for ideological discussion. " was directly speaking in regard to my behavior in posting. "That" is a marker for "I try to hold myself to the ideal that I am only discussing what is presented, that which has been placed on the table for discussion.".

You seemed to mistake my mentioning the nature of the forum as suggesting that your behavior wasn't allowed, and then you mistook my elaboration on what I meant to suggest that I had mentioned it in regards to whether or not you wanted to be a moderator. I was only stating that I am interested in ideological discussion and that, subsequently, I focus squarely on that as that is what the forum is intended for, which is why I'm here in this forum. I then elaborated more later on what I feel that kind of discussion is and why I'm interested in it.

fireworks_god said:

deranger said:

Same stuff, different pile to me.  Like I said, I never paid attention in school, and didn't want someone telling me which words I should use.

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It really isn't a matter of telling you which words you should use, but a process of helping you to form an internally-consistent viewpoint on a matter.
For instance, you refer to a person's context and its nature as something that has been uniquely determined by the specific progression of experiences through life.
At the same time, you refer to a process of accumulating new experiences which can be similar to those of others, through which one can better understand the context of others. You label this as "thinking outside of context", but the nature of context (the fact that meaning only exists within context) and the nature of the process you specifically referred to implies that it isn't thinking "outside" of context, but rather changing one's personal context, the effect of which enables one to better understand the context of the meaning others express.

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I already implied I know what you just said, so I don't get why that explanation was needed.

Quote:

It really isn't a matter of telling you which words you should use, but a process of helping you to form an internally-consistent viewpoint on a matter.

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I don't need help, I feel quite consistent.  Though I may seem confusing to others

Quote:

If you understood my point from the beginning, then you certainly wouldn't be mentioning the fact that you weren't asking to become a moderator, because the issue of whether or not you want to be a moderator is completely irrelevant to the point I was making when I referred to the forum being intended for ideological discussion, which was mentioned specifically regarding why I personally choose to hold myself to the ideal that I do in posting.

The statement "That is because this forum is specifically intended for ideological discussion. " was directly speaking in regard to my behavior in posting. "That" is a marker for "I try to hold myself to the ideal that I am only discussing what is presented, that which has been placed on the table for discussion.".

You seemed to mistake my mentioning the nature of the forum as suggesting that your behavior wasn't allowed, and then you mistook my elaboration on what I meant to suggest that I had mentioned it in regards to whether or not you wanted to be a moderator. I was only stating that I am interested in ideological discussion and that, subsequently, I focus squarely on that as that is what the forum is intended for, which is why I'm here in this forum. I then elaborated more later on what I feel that kind of discussion is and why I'm interested in it.

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And I was giving you my perspective on why I don't strictly conform to "ideological discussion", to make myself clear.

deranger said:

ME FOR MOD?

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